Pioneer HPM-100 Question

Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
I reworked the binding posts on a pair of these and was thrown off by the wires on the woofer. The white goes to the positive and the blue goes to the negative. I would like to get this confirmed as it seems odd. For all the other drivers the colored wire goes to positive. I just want to make sure that somebody didn't get it backwards when they were in there.

I know Sheep has or had a pair of these but I would rather ask here before I go begging him to remove his woofer.

TIA,
Alex
 
Rickster71

Rickster71

Audioholic Spartan
Hey Alex, the Blue goes to the + positive.
I'm certain of that.
 
Last edited:
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I reworked the binding posts on a pair of these and was thrown off by the wires on the woofer. The white goes to the positive and the blue goes to the negative. I would like to get this confirmed as it seems odd. For all the other drivers the colored wire goes to positive. I just want to make sure that somebody didn't get it backwards when they were in there.

I know Sheep has or had a pair of these but I would rather ask here before I go begging him to remove his woofer.

TIA,
Alex
According to the diagram, the woofer and mid are wired normally becuase they only have a 6dB/octave filter and the tweeter and super tweeter are reversed because they have a 12dB/octave filter.
 
J

Jeepers

Full Audioholic
I reworked the binding posts on a pair of these and was thrown off by the wires on the woofer. The white goes to the positive and the blue goes to the negative. I would like to get this confirmed as it seems odd. For all the other drivers the colored wire goes to positive. I just want to make sure that somebody didn't get it backwards when they were in there.

I know Sheep has or had a pair of these but I would rather ask here before I go begging him to remove his woofer.

TIA,
Alex
CaptianKirk28 has or maybe meanwhile had a pair of these.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50151&highlight=HPM-100
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
According to the diagram, the woofer and mid are wired normally becuase they only have a 6dB/octave filter and the tweeter and super tweeter are reversed because they have a 12dB/octave filter.
It's pretty cool that you can tell what the slope is by looking at the schematic. Any chance you know what the cross over points are?

Hi, yes the blue goes to the Pos i took one of my drivers out to make sure before i told you.
Wow, that's huge. :) I passed as much rep around as I could before I hit the wall.

I found a suggested mod on line where it was suggested that these parts be swapped out:


Qty Part Number Product
2 005-10 Mills 10 Ohm 12W Non-Inductive Resistor
2 027-419 Dayton DMPC-4.3 4.3uF 250V Polypr Cap
2 027-220 Dayton PMPC-3.0 3.0uF 250V Precis Cap
2 027-462 Jantzen 0.15uF 1200V Z-Superior Cap

and this is a pic of the crossover from eBay:



I'm probably not going to do anything more with them as the cabinets are pretty beat up but you never know. This was the old binding post system with the screw on push button spring type wire connectors either broken of lost.



This is the part from Radio Shack that had a long enough threaded bolt to make it through to the back of the crossover.



Here you can see the shiny bolt sticking through the crossover. It actually 'threaded' through the plastic housing and the square hole on the crossover. I soldered that tab to the threaded bolt to insure a lasting connection and checked it with an Ohm meter afterward. I used a smaller nut that Radio Shack had in stock as the ones that came with the new part were a little too big.



Here's the finished product.



This little project sucked up some serious time and the speakers are probably going to live out there days in a buddies garage. I have a few other fish to fry before I mess with them any further. I hope you like the pic's. ;)

This thread may need to be moved to the DIY section ... or not. :)
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
It's pretty cool that you can tell what the slope is by looking at the schematic. Any chance you know what the cross over points are?
The slope of a crossover will be determined by the number of components in the filter. A coil or capacitor in series with a speaker will work at 6dB/octave. The "crossover" frequency is actually the point where the output is 3dB less than it would be without the filter. If you want a 12dB/octave high pass filter, you would place a capacitor in series with the speaker and a coil after the cap, in parallel with the speaker. Caps resist more at low frequencies and coils pass low frequencies well, so when the coil's inductance coincides with the capacitor's value, the cap filters the bass out and whatever gets through bypasses the speaker, If you were working with a low pass filter, you would use a coil in series (6dB/octave) and a cap in parallel after the coil (12dB/octave).

In addition to the slope of the filter, it also causes delays for the signal as it passes through, which is usually referred to as phase shift. Each filter component will shift the phase by about 90 degrees. If you look at the HPM 100 crossover schematic, you'll see that the positive to the tweeter & super tweeter is reversed when you compare it with the woofer and midrange. The woofer has a coil in series(90° of phase shift) and the mid has a cap in series with a coil, in series with the speaker (90°) but the tweeter and super tweeter have a cap in series and a coil in parallel, which is 180° of phase shift. Phase shift cause cancellations in the response and keeping the crossover region of two drivers "in phase" when they're reproducing some of the same frequencies is important.

It is possible to calculate the frequency for the components. The formula is C=2πFR, where C is Capacitance, F is Frequency, π is Pi and R is resistance. You can swap C and F when you need to.

Here's a link:

http://www.the12volt.com/caraudio/cross.asp
 

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