Outlaw 7220 vs Emotiva XPA7 Gen 3

[jnboone]

Is the Outlaw worth $800 (40%) more? Better options in the $2800-2000 price range?

 

[lovinthehd]

Why not the Monolith 7 instead?

 

[ryanosaur]

What are you wanting to do with it? What are your listening habits? Music:HT? What's the rest of your system like?

In general, I would say yes. It was built in partnership with ATI, it is fully differential, it's supposed to be a beast of an Amp at a pretty good price considering what you get.

On the flip side, surrounds and rears don't usually need that much power supplied to them, unless they are very low sensitivity speakers.

I paired my 85dB sensitivity speakers with the monoblocks so I could clear reference level dynamic peaks... if I want. I probably rarely use more than 4-8 watts per channel, though. My Mains, Center and Surrounds are set up like this because I am into some multi-channel audio. Not much of an HT guy. My rears and, soon, Atmos, will all be powered by my AVR.

Regardless, Emo and Monolith both seem to be putting out some good product, too.

 

[jnboone]

What are you wanting to do with it? What are your listening habits? Music:HT? What's the rest of your system like?

In general, I would say yes. It was built in partnership with ATI, it is fully differential, it's supposed to be a beast of an Amp at a pretty good price considering what you get.

On the flip side, surrounds and rears don't usually need that much power supplied to them, unless they are very low sensitivity speakers.

I paired my 85dB sensitivity speakers with the monoblocks so I could clear reference level dynamic peaks... if I want. I probably rarely use more than 4-8 watts per channel, though. My Mains, Center and Surrounds are set up like this because I am into some multi-channel audio. Not much of an HT guy. My rears and, soon, Atmos, will all be powered by my AVR.

Regardless, Emo and Monolith both seem to be putting out some good product, too.

System is in signature. Main/center RBH's are 90dB sensitivity and sides/rears are 87dB. 50/50 music/theater - sometimes very loud. At some point I will be upgrading my AVR, and I hope by having a nice amp I won't have to go top end AVR because I won't need the power (mid level model will be plenty for additional speakers if I go Atmos/add second room, and I want more quality power than most of the high end AVR's produce anyway). I can see myself upgrading front/center speaker way down the road and could use the amp to bi-amp L/R if necessary. Probably the most important part of the decision to me is I don't want to regret it later and want to upgrade. To me an amp is a very long term piece of equipment (and I'm not a always have to have the latest/greatest kind of guy. I do want very nice, but if I'm happy I'm content. Thanks!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

System is in signature. Main/center RBH's

Very nice speaker system BTW!

I spoke to RBH about selling amps a year ago. They said a MCH amp (7Ch or 8Ch) was in discussion, but still a long away from anything concrete. Too bad. Maybe one day.

Adcom only has a 2Ch and 5Ch amp, would have liked to also see a 7Ch amp.

As already mentioned by HD, the Monolith 200x7 is a good option.

ATI (which makes some amps for Outlaw, Monoprice, among other brands) is another option.

Let me know if you need some help.

 

[ryanosaur]

My only addition to what's been said would be to decide what you need based on actual and preferred SPL. As I used myself as an example (my desire to be able to clear Reference Level Dynamic Peaks and have those 5 channels matched as closely as possible), it seems only fair I continue.
I know that at 85dB sensitivity, I only need 1w @ 1m to achieve Reference Level SPL, but the 20 dB peak will require ~128w @1m. I sit about 8' away in a small room, ~11x15', ~2000'3. Due to the size of the room, I likely do not experience the 6dB drop upon doubling distance, rather probably -3dB. Accounting for that, I would still need to double my power from 128w to 256w, achieving 109dB @ 1m... adjusted should yield ~106dB @ 2m.
Looking at your room, you would clear 105dB @ 1m with 32w. Assuming a large room with little boundary reinforcement, 2m would have you drop to 99dB, and 93dB some 12' away. Again, I stress the assumption being made that you have no support from boundary gain. If you do and on the otherhand, and only experience a -3dB drop per doubling of distance, then you only require 128 watts to get that Reference level Dynamic Peak at a LP 12' away.
Our favorite tool to recommend is this online SPL calculator. It takes many more things into account than I can.

Either way, I would consider looking for a strong 3-channel amp to handle the Front-3 over a 7-channel Amp. If anything, I might consider putting the surrounds on a different Amp altogether, over time. However, your AVR is strong enough to handle 4 surrounds quite well. If you want to future proof against adding more speakers and needing stronger and more amplification, maybe consider a 5-channel amp and include your L/R Surrounds, leaving your Rears on the AVR amp.
Mind, this is just an exercise. I did this to myself, too, before deciding on my Monoblocks. Regardless, It comes back to one thing: Your Ears, Your System, Your Ducats! I am not the guy to say you don't need an amp. I ask instead: is a 7-channel behemoth the right path?

Cheers!

 

[jnboone]

Very nice speaker system BTW!

I spoke to RBH about selling amps a year ago. They said a MCH amp (7Ch or 8Ch) was in discussion, but still a long away from anything concrete. Too bad. Maybe one day.

Adcom only has a 2Ch and 5Ch amp, would have liked to also see a 7Ch amp.

As already mentioned by HD, the Monolith 200x7 is a good option.

ATI (which makes some amps for Outlaw, Monoprice, among other brands) is another option.

Let me know if you need some help.

Thanks for the compliment. I've truly enjoyed them very much, and I bought them through you . I can see myself upgrading to the 831/821R's at some point. It would probably happen sooner if they made them in flat black!

 

[PENG]

On the flip side, surrounds and rears don't usually need that much power supplied to them, unless they are very low sensitivity speakers.

I paired my 85dB sensitivity speakers with the monoblocks so I could clear reference level dynamic peaks... if I want. I probably rarely use more than 4-8 watts per channel, though. My Mains, Center and Surrounds are set up like this because I am into some multi-channel audio. Not much of an HT guy. My rears and, soon, Atmos, will all be powered by my AVR.

Agreed, I would add that if the speakers are in the low 80's and the users demand reference or near reference spl, amps with more than 3 channels are still not a realistic option because as most of us know that you need 10X more power to gain 10 dB spl. For someone using an a 100 WPC AVR, one would have to add 7X1kW amp to really make a good difference.

When I listen to 2 channel music, I sit 8-10 ft from my 90 dB Focals and the power meter would swing between near 0 to 0.1 Watt (avg about 0.025 W is my guess), rarely exceeding 1 W, that's peak. If I were to crank it up to reference, that I could not stand, the wattmeter would swing between near 0 to 1 W, and rarely exceeding 100 W.

What a waste of money to try and capture those rare 20 dB peaks in the surround channels on top of the incredibly loud 85 dB average, that may not even exist!! Oh, and don't forget the talks about 20 A, or better still twin 20 As dedicated line to get the benefit of those big amps.

My vote is, as always, for the biggest 3 channel amp one can live with (the physical room/weight, looks, money etc.) and let the AVR handle the remaining channels.

 

[jnboone]

3 channel makes sense to me, and I'd given it serious thought - just don't see many reviews to even begin to know where to start. I will probably one day update my fronts and center to the RBH 831R's (100-500 watts 4 ohms) and 821R (100-300 watts 4 ohms). Suggestions? Still comfortable in the $2,00-2,800 range.

 

[ryanosaur]

I looked real hard at the Emo's XPA and XPA-DR 3-channels. Not familiar with ATI or any of the other higher end manufacturers. I liked them. Mono isn't bad, but worth noting is that they are not truly balanced (if that is important to you).

Remember, you don't need to max out the RMS rating of a speaker! That is a folly.

Know what wattage you need to achieve the SPL you want to listen at. Maybe have a little more as headroom. I guarantee it won't be more than what I mentioned above for a reasonably sensitive speaker. And if you find yourself needing to pump 500w into each speaker... buy QSC Cinema Amps, or Crown XLS... but be careful. Blowing drivers in a $2500.00 speaker is a hard way to learn about amplification!

Oh... and those 831s are rated at 93dB sensitivity! With boundary gain, you should clear 105dB at 2m with just 32w!!!