Orb Speaker setup issues, questions

[pg13]

I just got Orb People's choice 5.1 speaker system with Yamaha RXV663. I have basically few questions:

1. Orb website says that I should not drive any speaker level to oustide +/-2db regardless of what the automatic calibration comes up with. My Yamaha YPAO comes up with driving the surrounds at +4db and sets the crossover to 160Hz. I manually changes everything to fit into +/-2db and 120Hz crossover. Cant point to the cause but the whole system sounds good but not great especially at lower volumes (typical listening volume for me is -34db). Why does Orb have that advisory ?

2. The sub though nice is not "thumpy" enough. It hardly ever gets loud even in major action sequences. It is already set to +1.5db.

3. What exactly is the difference between mod2 and mod1 besides volume ? Given that I hardly ever go higher than -20db on my mod2 fronts, do I really need mod2 fronts+center ?

4. Any suggestions on receiver setup to get better performance at *low* volumes especially for music ?

 

[pg13]

Any suggestions ?

Any suggestions/feedback would be really helpful.

 

[cscalley]

Hi pg13,
I have exactly the same speakers (Orb People's choice 5.1) and receiver (Yamaha 663) as yourself, both of which I bought a couple of months ago.

1. Orb website says that I should not drive any speaker level to oustide +/-2db regardless of what the automatic calibration comes up with. My Yamaha YPAO comes up with driving the surrounds at +4db and sets the crossover to 160Hz. I manually changes everything to fit into +/-2db and 120Hz crossover. Cant point to the cause but the whole system sounds good but not great especially at lower volumes (typical listening volume for me is -34db). Why does Orb have that advisory ?

I'm pretty sure that Orb gives this advice because they're worried you might overload (and damage) a particular speaker. For example if you had one speaker set much higher e.g.+10db, then you might accidentally overload that speaker when you have the volume set really high. I wouldn't be too concerned about a setting of +4db though, I think that would be fine, it would be normal for your surrounds to be set louder than your fronts, because your surrounds are Mod1 and your other speakers are Mod2. Maybe check with Orb support just to be sure, their email support is very good, just check on their website for the email address.

Oh, and the 120Hz crossover is what I'm using as well.

2. The sub though nice is not "thumpy" enough. It hardly ever gets loud even in major action sequences. It is already set to +1.5db.

Firstly, double check what the volume setting on the back of your sub is. It should be around half (i.e. 5) but you could always make it a bit higher. And while you're checking those settings, double check that "X-Over" is set to Disabled.

Secondly, you could try putting the sub in the corner of the room (I'm not sure where you've got it at the moment), I think that normally increases how loud the sub seems.

Thirdly, you could always simply increase the level of your subwoofer in the receiver above +1.5db, by going into manual setup. Although you've mentioned Orb advises to stay within +/- 2dB I don't think this is as critical for the sub, I think that's mainly referring to the other speakers.

3. What exactly is the difference between mod2 and mod1 besides volume ? Given that I hardly ever go higher than -20db on my mod2 fronts, do I really need mod2 fronts+center ?

I'm wondering the same thing. I tried turning my front speakers into Mod1 (by disconnecting the wire which connects the lower speaker to the upper speaker). Personally I found that the effect was very slight, except that the volume was a bit lower. I have heard that a Mod2 will give slightly more bass output compared to a Mod1 but I couldn't hear much difference. Apparently its a good idea to leave the centre speaker as Mod2, because that's where most of the dialogue is for movies. So the answer is you probably don't need the Mod2 for your fronts, but I'd keep it for the center. Try it out and see what you like!

4. Any suggestions on receiver setup to get better performance at *low* volumes especially for music ?

You could always try the "ADAPTIVE DRC" feature on the amplifier, see if you like the sound of that. That feature is designed for listening at lower volumes.

Personally I found that my system was not giving enough bass (especially in music), which was especially noticeable at low volume, so I made some changes using the equalizer. In manual setup, under the sound menu, then Equalizer, "Auto PEQ" refers to the settings that were found during the YPAO auto setup. I changed this to "GEQ", which allows you to manually adjust the equalizer. For Front Left and Front Right, I increased the two lowest frequencies (63Hz and 160Hz): 63Hz +4db, and 160Hz +3db.

A few other settings just to double check:
- in manual setup under "Basic Menu", then "Speaker Set", check that all speakers are set to "Small", and that "LFE/BASS OUT" is set to "SWFR". You can also try changing "Subwoofer phase" to whichever value sounds better to you.
- in manual setup under "Basic Menu", then "SP DISTANCE", check that the speaker distances look correct, especially the subwoofer distance, I found this was sometimes inaccurate.


Hope that helps!
Chris

 

[rufas2000]

I just got "The People's Choice" system myself. My receiver is not the same though (Denon 987).

To address your subwoofer issue check the "phase" knob on the sub. If your sub is in the front of the listening position it should be at 0 (degrees). If it is in the back of the room it should be at 180 (all the way "up"). However these are guidelines and not rules, more like starting points. Try adjusting the phase knob until the sub sounds its "thumpiest".

I would also suggest trying to listen to the sub by itself. The most conveient way to accomplish this is to listen to a CD in Auto mode (stereo plus sub, no centers or surrounds) and selecting Speaker A or B, whichever one the fronts are not connected to. If the sub is loud by itself but the bass goes away when the fronts are on then it is a phase issue. If you can't hear the sub specifically but hear low end bass then it is as it should be. Of course if your receiver doesn't have front a / front b speaker inputs then this won't be possible. You could disconnect one of the leads from each front speaker if you don't mind having to reconnect them when you're through. I like to hear what the sub is doing whenever I make adjustments.

I personally think the mod 2's give the sound more depth in addition to volume and prefer them for the fronts and center. But its your call based on what you like better.

As far as overall performance I'm waiting for them to have enough time to "break in" (as per the instruction manual). Many here do not believe in the "speaker break in" theory, I'm not sure myself but I'll give them that time (20 hours?) to see how they do.

 

[pg13]

Thanks for your replies. The break in is real. Now the whole system sounds way better than it did the first day.

The sub output improved after I moved it to a corner. It still has problems coming out of OFF in the Auto mode at low volumes, so I just keep it ON all the time. Hopefully it will not drive up my electricity bill or harm the life of the sub. The sub "completes" the system but still there is no menacing "to be felt" sound out of it. I have mostly watched HD movies on Dish so far, not much of action movies on DVD yet. I am not sure if Dish gives out true 5.1 sound on their HD channels. Moroever, sometimes I get a single note grunt from the sub while watching TV. Orb guys told me that is not atypical for compressed TV sound.

The mod2 vs. mod1 question is still unresolved but I kept the mod2 fronts (past the return period now). I tried disconnecting a satellite and listening to mod2 as mod1 routine but realized that is unfair to mod1 unless I recalibrate the receiver. too much effort !

My only concern is that 75% of my use is normal television (HD or std) where usually the sound quality difference between orb and TV speakers is not great. I have tried 7channel enhancer mode in yamaha. Not sure what it does but seems to just send same sound to all 5 speakers.
Also somehow Dolby PL-II does not seem to trigger the surrounds that much. I thought it is supposed to convert stereo to 5.1 sound. Any ideas ?

 

[rufas2000]

The break in is real. Now the whole system sounds way better than it did the first day.

Do you know how long it took before the system sounded better?

Also somehow Dolby PL-II does not seem to trigger the surrounds that much. I thought it is supposed to convert stereo to 5.1 sound. Any ideas ?

Again from what I've picked up here and there the surrounds are often left with little to do. However since DPL2 is a format from the processor instead of a source (like a movie with DD or DTS) I would think it would send more to the rears. I'll try it with some music to see what happens for me.

You may want to turn the rears up if you haven't (your first post says the surrounds are low but you were hesitant to go against Orb's directions on volume). If that helps then email Orb with the specifics and see what they say.

It still has problems coming out of OFF in the Auto mode at low volumes

From what I have read that problem is not uncommon for subs. I leave mine "on" and have experienced no ill effects.

I'm thinking you'll have to play some action flicks on a DVD player before you'll see what the sub is capable of.

Thanks in advance for answering my query.

 

[pg13]

I noticed improvement till about ~30 hours of TV and ~10 hours of music playing. These are just ballpark numbers.

By the way, will it be a bad idea to wall mount the speakers such that right channel does not have direct line of sight to me ? (the TV would partly block it). The other option will be to mount it about a foot higher than ear level.

 

[rufas2000]

Ballpark numbers are great, thank you.

As far as speaker placement I'm not an expert but I personally try to avoid blockage whenever possible. So I would mount the right speaker on the wall a foot higher if you can do the same with the left speaker (you don't want sound traveling up and down when it isn't supposed to). I believe the wall mounts from Orb allow you to point speakers down.

If you can't mount the left relatively the same as the right I'd probably go with the first option where it is unless the right is really blocked. In other words keeping the front channels relatively level is a bigger issue for me than having a speaker partially blocked.

Hope that helps.