New TV/Old Amp compatibility + Onkyo AVR update

Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
I have a new TCL TV with eARC hooked up to a 5 or 6 year old Yamaha RX-A670 AVR using a new, certified hdmi cable. Everything was working swimmingly until this weekend and now the TV is not communicating with the amp. First no arc control, and now no sound even though the input is on TV! I changed nothing, but I went into settings on both devices and everything was still correct. I wonder if compatibility is the issue. The AVR has ARC, but not eARC. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

My Onkyo TX-NR696 was shipped off to United Radio in New York for repair last Monday and they are already on it. I got a call on Friday from them asking me questions about it. So I hope to hear from them again soon. I told them that I will not be hooking that unit up again, unless they specifically fix something or replace something internal. Then I said I would like for it to just be replaced. She made a note of all of that. If they cannot find the problem, then I do not know what to think Onkyo will do. Meaning, send it back, or send me a new unit.
So if I get a new unit, like I think should happen (I will request something other than a 696 if possible), and if compatibility is the issue on my above situation, that will solve that.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
I have a new TCL TV with eARC hooked up to a 5 or 6 year old Yamaha RX-A670 AVR using a new, certified hdmi cable. Everything was working swimmingly until this weekend and now the TV is not communicating with the amp. First no arc control, and now no sound even though the input is on TV! I changed nothing, but I went into settings on both devices and everything was still correct. I wonder if compatibility is the issue. The AVR has ARC, but not eARC. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

My Onkyo TX-NR696 was shipped off to United Radio in New York for repair last Monday and they are already on it. I got a call on Friday from them asking me questions about it. So I hope to hear from them again soon. I told them that I will not be hooking that unit up again, unless they specifically fix something or replace something internal. Then I said I would like for it to just be replaced. She made a note of all of that. If they cannot find the problem, then I do not know what to think Onkyo will do. Meaning, send it back, or send me a new unit.
So if I get a new unit, like I think should happen (I will request something other than a 696 if possible), and if compatibility is the issue on my above situation, that will solve that.
eARC is much more stable than ARC.

I would connect your TV to the Yamaha with an optical cable. An optical cable has the same spec. as ARC, but it is a lot less trouble.
 
T

Trebdp83

Audioholic Ninja
To avoid further headaches, connect your streaming device directly to the receiver. Turn off HDMI-CEC in the TV and receiver. Connect the receiver to the TV using a port other than the eARC port on the TV. This means manual selections with the remote controller for each device in use. It also means no more ARC mishaps.

If you decide to use the TV’s apps, ARC will allow for Dolby Atmos from apps while optical will limit you to Dolby Digital 5.1 with no support for Atmos/DD+. I’d stick to streaming devices and use the TV simply as a display to avoid more issues.
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
I don't use a streaming device on this TV. I had no radio audio. Did a reset. Now the radio works. My guess is that incompatibility knocked it for a loop. Going to bed now. I might tackle this again tomorrow if I have time. Thx guys for the help so far.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
To avoid further headaches, connect your streaming device directly to the receiver. Turn off HDMI-CEC in the TV and receiver. Connect the receiver to the TV using a port other than the eARC port on the TV. This means manual selections with the remote controller for each device in use. It also means no more ARC mishaps.

If you decide to use the TV’s apps, ARC will allow for Dolby Atmos from apps while optical will limit you to Dolby Digital 5.1 with no support for Atmos/DD+. I’d stick to streaming devices and use the TV simply as a display to avoid more issues.
The receiver has the wrong spec in a lot of sites. It is not a Dolby Atmos receiver, but a 7.2 receiver with no preouts. So for that receiver an optical connection will give the same performance as ARC return. That receiver does not have eARC and so can not handle loss less audio via ARC.
 
T

Trebdp83

Audioholic Ninja
It is a seven channel receiver that can be configured for 5.1.2. It supports Dolby Atmos and DTS:X processing. Dolby Atmos from streaming services is lossy Dolby Digital Plus 7.1 based and requires at least the bandwidth of ARC for delivery and is not available over optical. It supports ARC, not eARC so HDMI-CEC must be on for it to work and the TV will not be able passth lossless multichannel audio using eARC.

Only lossless multichannel audio from disc players and consoles connected directly to a new TV require eARC bandwidth. Streaming services over Smart TV apps will deliver Dolby Atmos over ARC. But, different new TVs and older receivers will work well together or not. Just about any streaming device on the market will better a Smart TV’s apps and will work best connected directly to a receiver.
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
To avoid further headaches, connect your streaming device directly to the receiver. Turn off HDMI-CEC in the TV and receiver. Connect the receiver to the TV using a port other than the eARC port on the TV. This means manual selections with the remote controller for each device in use. It also means no more ARC mishaps.

If you decide to use the TV’s apps, ARC will allow for Dolby Atmos from apps while optical will limit you to Dolby Digital 5.1 with no support for Atmos/DD+. I’d stick to streaming devices and use the TV simply as a display to avoid more issues.
They contacted me and said they have not yet duplicated the issue. Seems like they will be sending this boat anchor back to me.
If I get a streaming device and hook it up like you said, incuding your settings suggestions, I will obviously get the primo audio, correct? Just no ARC / eARC function? I think I'll just do that with the Yam.
 
T

Trebdp83

Audioholic Ninja
Yes, the optimal audio experience will be had with a direct connection of a device to a receiver. Connect through a TV and use ARC or eARC and all bets are off as finding the optimal settings for everything can be difficult.
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
I am not home right now, hut I don't recall either device using cec terminology. Is that same as passthrough? Just turn off passthrough on the tv and hdmi "off" on the amp if I don't find cec?
 
T

Trebdp83

Audioholic Ninja
Receivers will call it HDMI-CEC or just HDMI Control. Different TV brands will have different designations for HDMI-CEC.
 
T

Trebdp83

Audioholic Ninja
If you are going to use a streaming device connected to the receiver, I wouldn’t even connect to the eARC port on the TV. I’d use another port and not use the TV apps at all. Audio return will be a non issue and no more HDMI-CEC headaches. Connect any other devices directly to the receiver as well.
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
Right. Just that the tv has no cec setting. So "auto", not passthrough?
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
Oh yeah, that would be output signal. Never mind.
 
Last edited:
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
They contacted me and said they have not yet duplicated the issue. Seems like they will be sending this boat anchor back to me.
If I get a streaming device and hook it up like you said, incuding your settings suggestions, I will obviously get the primo audio, correct? Just no ARC / eARC function? I think I'll just do that with the Yam.
Why do you think that it is HDMI eARC that is locking your receiver up? Your problem has not been duplicated in two facilities now.

I'm wondering if it is something in your system, or more likely your home causing the problem. All it takes is failing starting caps on electric motors to play havoc with modern electronics. AC units and AC/heat pumps are the absolute worst, I can assure you. I have my AC caps checked yearly, and replaced at the first sign of going out of spec. AC starting and running caps are huge and as they fail, which they all do, can cause the motors to send horrible spikes and drop outs down your AC lines in the home. Those events are quite capable of locking up a receiver.

In addition I use UPS units for maximum protection to everything except power amps. Unfortunately receivers contain power amps, so it is hard to protect them. Being able to protect fragile processing circuits is another huge advantage of using separates.
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
Why do you think that it is HDMI eARC that is locking your receiver up? Your problem has not been duplicated in two facilities now.

I'm wondering if it is something in your system, or more likely your home causing the problem. All it takes is failing starting caps on electric motors to play havoc with modern electronics. AC units and AC/heat pumps are the absolute worst, I can assure you. I have my AC caps checked yearly, and replaced at the first sign of going out of spec. AC starting and running caps are huge and as they fail, which they all do, can cause the motors to send horrible spikes and drop outs down your AC lines in the home. Those events are quite capable of locking up a receiver.

In addition I use UPS units for maximum protection to everything except power amps. Unfortunately receivers contain power amps, so it is hard to protect them. Being able to protect fragile processing circuits is another huge advantage of using separates.
If that is the case, I would have no way to diagnose that, so I hope that's not it. It can run fine for days and days, and then you try to turn it on (via TV) and it is locked up. Three different TV's, two different systems. At least three lockups all when I tried to turn it on via arc. So, I have no clue. All I did was tell them what was happening each time. The RZ50 so far is fine with eARC in the house with a new 65" TCL TV.
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
New Fire Stick 4k Max arrived same day shipping already.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
If that is the case, I would have no way to diagnose that, so I hope that's not it. It can run fine for days and days, and then you try to turn it on (via TV) and it is locked up. Three different TV's, two different systems. At least three lockups all when I tried to turn it on via arc. So, I have no clue. All I did was tell them what was happening each time. The RZ50 so far is fine with eARC in the house with a new 65" TCL TV.
In that case it sounds like a serious firmware bug. I bet Onkyo know about this and are not owning up to it as they have no fix for it. Is your firmware up to date?

I guess if you have streamers you won't have to use the TV apps.
 
Squishman

Squishman

Audioholic Chief
FW is up to date, yes. Did that about 10 days before last lock up. United Radio I am pretty sure is being honest. They think it is user error as far as settings, etc. Wrong. I just hope they come to right conclusion this week and tell Onkyo to send me another unit, different model if I had my druthers.
 

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