New Home system questions

[Magoo]

New Home system Update 7/22

Have learned a lot by using the Search function, lots of good info here!

As I live in RURAL Michigan, I can't get a chance to demo the equipment I'm intending to install. I'm building a new house, and would like a little feedback on what I might expect from the system I'm considering.
I'm hoping for a music-first system that can handle movies, etc. The components I'm considering are: Marantz PD4230V Plasma, Marantz SR7500 Receiver, Marantz DV7500 Disc player, Mordaunt Short 504 fronts, 502 center, and 506 dipole surrounds (or possibly the in-wall AW153? any info on these?).
I'm hoping for a sound a bit on the warmer side (but still controlled) as Ive a 25' cathederal ceiling and lots of windows. I'd appreciate thoughts of what I might expect from this system.

Two more questions: 1) I've found good pricing on the MS speakers at "Accessories 4 Less.com" and would like to know if they are a reputable dealer and if anyone has any experiences with them? And 2) I'm going to be pulling speaker wire this weekend, should I jus use 12 ga. for all the speakers, or do different speakers perform better with different ga. wire?

Thanks!

 

[Spiffyfast]

Have learned a lot by using the Search function, lots of good info here!

As I live in RURAL Michigan, I can't get a chance to demo the equipment I'm intending to install. I'm building a new house, and would like a little feedback on what I might expect from the system I'm considering.
I'm hoping for a music-first system that can handle movies, etc. The components I'm considering are: Marantz PD4230V Plasma, Marantz SR7500 Receiver, Marantz DV7500 Disc player, Mordaunt Short 502 fronts, 502 center, and 506 dipole surrounds (or possibly the in-wall AW153?).
I'm hoping for a sound a bit on the warmer side (but still controlled) as Ive a 25' cathederal ceiling and lots of windows. I'd appreciate thoughts of what I might expect from this system.

Two more questions: 1) I've found good pricing on the MS speakers at "Accessories 4 Less.com" and would like to know if they are a reputable dealer and if anyone has any experiences with them? And 2) I'm going to be pulling speaker wire this weekend, should I jus use 12 ga. for all the speakers, or do different speakers perform better with different ga. wire?

Thanks!

Welcome to the forum you chose a great one to get some questions answered. Very nice system, should sound amazing with all that Marantz Equipment, just a thought though, If you're planning on spending that kind of money on a system you may want to consider the Marantz 8500 since it has DVI switching. I havent heard the MS speakers personally but I have heard good things. As for Accessories4less.com they are actually a Marantz factory authorized dealer so they must be a fairly good company, its wear I plan on ordering my Marantz, so hopefully you post back with your thoughts about them. Good luck I think you will be very impressed with that setup, enjoy

 

[Resident Loser]

A question for Spiffyfast...

...you "apologize' for your self-described "POS" Sony Htib...why is that ? Is it because you find fault with it or because others may have a less than favorable opinion of it and(maybe you're thinking) therefore of you?

If the former, that's one thing...if the latter, take my advice, tell 'em to all screw-off...

This hobby, like just about all of them, is filled with those of the "my dog's biggern' your dog" persuasion. Don't feel like you must pre-emptively bow and scrape to the egocentric blowhards. Pay no particular attention to those who print a laundry-list of components as if it somehow is supposed to impress us mere mortals...remember the old Charlie the Tuna ads? Plainly put: it's not the style, it's the substance.

jimHJJ(...besides, it's only tee-vee...)

 

[El Toro]

That seems like it will do a good job for you. Although I do have some options that you might consider. First you might want to check into a Pioneer plasma for the simple reason that they are the one that produce the Marantz plazma components and you can probably get the same screen for less. Second, you might want to consider a Denon av reciever or possibly some seperates for the price point. As far as the Marantz equipment goes it is good quality stuff, but I think that the Denon has a few better options and internal components. Besides they are produced by the same company since Denon bought them a while back.

 

[Spiffyfast]

...you "apologize' for your self-described "POS" Sony Htib...why is that ? Is it because you find fault with it or because others may have a less than favorable opinion of it and(maybe you're thinking) therefore of you?

If the former, that's one thing...if the latter, take my advice, tell 'em to all screw-off...

This hobby, like just about all of them, is filled with those of the "my dog's biggern' your dog" persuasion. Don't feel like you must pre-emptively bow and scrape to the egocentric blowhards. Pay no particular attention to those who print a laundry-list of components as if it somehow is supposed to impress us mere mortals...remember the old Charlie the Tuna ads? Plainly put: it's not the style, it's the substance.

jimHJJ(...besides, it's only tee-vee...)

actually I know its a POS so I'm apologizing to myself, i just didnt know any better when I bought it, all my friends think its amazing, but I know something else could sound alot better

 

[Takeereasy]

Hi Magoo. Welcome aboard. I think you have made some excellent choices. I'm in the same boat as Spiffyfast with regards to never having heard the MS speakers, but I too have only heard positive things about them. On a quick side note you swapped the model # for the center and the fronts. The fronts are 502's and the center is the 504. As for your receiver my suggestion would be to consider the new Yamaha 4600 or Marantz 8500. The Yamaha kills everything in its price class for connectivity and features and is pretty darn power packed. On the other hand I have a Marantz 8400 (fore-runner to the 8500) and I really love it. It is simple to setup and operate and I love the remote. The sound is just so darn clean. The Yamaha is on par with the Marantz 8500 pricewise at the stores, not with the listed MSRP however. I don't agree that Denon receivers have higher quality components inside them. In fact I'd wager that many of the components in my Marantz at least match those in the Denon 3805. But Denons do have many more features and are great sounding/performing receivers. I think it boils down to this. What do you want in a receiver? The Denons and the Yamahas have many more options and tweaking potential. The Marantz is pretty much as plug and play and hassel free as it gets. All sound excellent IMO and you can't dissapoint yourself. I would wait for the Denon 3806 to come out if you go that way though, I think it's going to have HDMI switching.

I also am 100% behind El Toro with regards to looking into the Pioneer elite line of Plasmas. They do indeed use many of the components as the Marantz Plasmas. That isn't to say that the Marantz is a rebadged Pioneer, it isn't. But if you cover the brand name on each one and walk into a room you won't be able to tell much difference in picture quality I'd be willing to wager, and you can get a bigger Pioneer for the same price, and the guy with the bigger toys wins (says the guy with the 27" crt tv).

As for wire just a couple of quick suggestions/notes. First off if you are pulling wire through your walls make sure that the wire is safety rated to do so and that it is in-wall wiring. Second of all 12 ga. is perfect for all of those speakers. Don't spend a bundle on the wire. Any good oxygen free 12 ga. inwall wire will do. Thirdly it is a good idea to terminate your speaker wire with Banana Plugs. Just do it.

A couple of parting thoughts. You need a big honking sub. At least one. A 25' ceiling has assured that you will have tons of trouble getting deep satisfying bass unless you go big. Finally you need HD programming to make that Plasma work best. Try and make sure that the HD box, be it satellite or cable, has either hdmi or DVI ability.

Hope this post helps and doesn't cause you any concerns. Good luck with the purchase. It really does seem well researched.

 

[Magoo]

Thanks for the input! I have looked into the Denon, but it seemed there were some issues with some of their units. I really want something that will be stone reliable, as I don't have any local dealers for any of this stuff. It seemed that performance-wise the Marantz was "as good as," and I didn't see any posts about reliability issues with the Marantz.
I will look into the SR8500; since it appears I can get the MS speakers for a better price than I originally thought, I may be able to upgrade to it.
As far as a sub, I was *hoping* that the fronts would be strong enough. I listen to way more music than watch movies, isn't the sub more for movie sound effects?
Anyone have any thoughts about the in-wall AW153 vs. the 506's for rear surrounds? I was originally going to hang the 506's on the wall anyway, so if the speakers are comparable I might as well just put them in the wall. I just don't know if they'd be compatible with the other speakers?
I'll also look further into the Pioneer plasmas, I've read some decent things about their sets. Any recc's on models I should look into? I'd really like a 50", but may have to settle for a 42" due to budget constraints. I am going to wall mount it, if that makes any difference. I agree on the HD programming, I have to get satellite anyways, and was planning on it.
Thanks for the heads up on the wire, I'l be getting to that this weekend!

Anyone else have any beta on Accessories4Less.com?

 

[jaxvon]

For wire, you might want to go for some 12ga Belden wire from Westlake. They have awesome prices, and the wire is rated for in-wall installation. Even with shipping, it'll best just about any other price. And you don't have to drive for it!

As far as speakers go, are you basically limited to online ordering only? If so, have you considered options from Axiom and AV123? AV123 makes especially pretty speakers (that sound good too, of course) which should help you justify the price to the wife While they don't make in-wall speakers, they still make good quality stuff for awesome prices, and both places offer long return periods so you can check out the speakers in your home. The out-of-wall offerings are still a good option though, as you can tweak the placement of the speakers more to get the sound you desire.

As far as subwoofers go, yes subs are needed for movie sound effects, but subs are also needed for music. It helps fill in the bottom end where most speakers just can't tread. Going for a good sub will make your music and movie experience way better. Since you have a big room, I think you should look at the offerings from SVS. Their big cylinder subs and their larger box subs will rock you. Hard. And still, they have the ability to do music too, not just huge explosions. Besides, many recievers offer you the ability to disable the sub and just listen to music through your front two speakers without any extra processing.

If you wanted to really go all out, an in-wall system from RBH would kick major arse. They are used in many reference systems here at Audioholics. They're expensive as heck, but they'd pump out the sound. Probably out of your price range though.

Do you think you'll need HDMI or DVI switching? If not, you might consider the option of a Yamaha RX-V2500 receiver and an Emotiva amp. Lots of options...

 

[Takeereasy]

I'm gonna go out on a limb and suggest last years model pioneer 50" elite plasma . That is the best price I saw. I'm not sure what you're looking at pricewise for the Marantz. There is a good review in sound and vision. This is a bare bones TV with a draw dropping picture. My local store uses one on their webpage here. It's the TV on the left. Same price here.

What you are risking is the fact that you may not get a valid warranty. What you are saving might be $9000.

YOu can get a non elite model like this one for around $3500.

If you do go 42" and can snag that Marantz for under $3500 it is a great deal.

 

[Magoo]

Well, I pulled the trigger on the speakers today. Ordered the MS 502 towers, the MS 504 Center, the MS AW152 in-wall surrounds, 12 ga in-wall wire and banana plugs.
Still contemplating a sub... not really sure what I want to do there yet.
There is a pretty decent price jump from the SR7500 to the SR8500; is a few more watts and DVI switching worth it? I'll have satellite, but I'm not sure I'll really appreciate full-on HDTV. I like a nice picture, I'm not super critical about it though. I'm more concerned with glare as I've a bunch of windows that might raise heck with the plasma screen.

 

[Magoo]

Got the speakeers today -- boy are they beautiful! I can't wait to get this put together -- this will be a dream system for me!
I did order them from accessories4less.com, I got a good deal and found them to be helpful and generous with assistance in answering my questions.
I would still appreciate your input regarding the components I should be getting to complete this system

Still contemplating a sub... not really sure what I want to do there yet.
There is a pretty decent price jump from the SR7500 to the SR8500; is a few more watts and DVI switching worth it? I'll have satellite, but I'm not sure I'll really appreciate full-on HDTV. I like a nice picture, I'm not super critical about it though. I'm more concerned with glare as I've a bunch of windows that might raise heck with the plasma screen.

Thanks!

 

[brian32672]

For a receiver I recommend a Pioneer VSX-1015tx THS Select 2. It actually weighs more than the SR7500, and should be able to push the MS speakers easier. You can pick these up for 400.00 shipped. Here is a link http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/product/detail/0,,2076_4153_209686388,00.html
Excellent MCCAC (auto calibration w/included mic-is right on-even the 1014 had spot on accuracy)

If not the 1015, then maybe the Denon AVR-3805 its a bigger price jump, but has 120 watts per channel. And a third option would be the Yamaha HTR-5790 which is 110 per channel, but is on price with the Pioneer.

Also, huge tip... jaxvon suggested westlake for the wire. IT IS THE BEST PLACE FOR THE 10,12,14awg CL-3 Beldin Wire.

 

[brian32672]

Still contemplating a sub... not really sure what I want to do there yet.

Even though the THX certified MS 502 towers do have a side firing 10" that is rated from 30hz. Bass management would be better suited to a good subwoofer. Probably placed in the rear of room opposite the large front speakers you have. It should give the room a more omni presence of bass. However placement is tricky, and should be played with for the best results. So get yourself a long sub cord and try different placements. The SVS sub line that someone suggested is highly recommended by a lot of people here, and even with that 25' ceiling you have, you should actually feel the bass from their line of subs. For that big of a room, I would recommend the SVS PB12-ISD/V, this way with the triple ports you would even have more flexability for the bass in that large room. (You will get 3 port plugs to lower the hz to a possible 12hz) Here is a link.
http://www.svsubwoofers.com/subs_pb12_isd_v.htm

 

[Magoo]

Looks like I'll need to add a sub to my shopping list! Thanks for the direction on this part of the system.

Looking into plasmas, I found a lot of options out there!
The Marantz plasmas seem to be more expensive than most of the others out there. I'm also concerned about getting the "right size" screen -- my viewing position will be 12 to 15 feet from the screen. I think maybe a 50" would be more appropriate than a 42" at this viewing distance? Right now, I'm struggling between the Panasonic TH-50PHD7UY or the Pioneer PDP504-CMX. Looks like both are available for less than what I was being quoted on the smaller Marantz. Any thoughts to help me decide between these two?
Now I am confused about the receiver issue. Since I'll be going with a HD plasma, do I need to go with a receiver that has DVI (or even HDMI) switching? Or can I still go with a unit like the Marantz SR7600?
Thanks for any ideas you might have!

 

[tedmjr2]

Magoo,

I'm very happy with the Panasonic TH-50PHD7UY w/HDMI board purchased back in May from VisualApex.com. Give them a call for their opinion of the two commercial plasmas you've mentioned that they also sell. The company is rated highly and is an authorized dealer for both Panasonic and Pioneer so I wouldn't be anxious about purchasing online from them.

You have a common dilemma that HT enthusiasts undergo concerning the HDMI/DVI switching options for their new monitor/TV. Currently, the digital video switching is available on the higher-end receivers and the cost is over budget for many. One other option is to get an HDMI/DVI switch box. I'm sure there are more solutions others can mention. Good luck!

Ted

 

[Takeereasy]

Sorry Magoo, I missd out on the thread for a while. Congrats on the speaker purchase, glad it went so smooth. The 7500 has good enough juice to drive your speakers. The receiver that Brian mentioned is a heck of a deal in the under $500 range, but you were looking to spend more and you can do better in the area you were originally looking. For example the 8500 is a superior unit to the 1015, but I don't think it is $1000 superior. In the $1500 range you were originally looking into I suggest you try and find a Yamaha 4600. Read the recent review done by Gene, 210w of clean power per channel at 4 ohms is pretty sweet. The 4600 has HDMI switching as well. You should PM a member named RLA and ask him what the real retail is. He owns a shop and they just received stock on these guys. Have you given any thought to the suggestion in the Hot Seperates tip area? You can pick up a Yamaha 1500 and a 2 channel amp for your fronts. This one by Parasound seems like a good deal. The Yamahas seem to get raves about the high quality of their preouts meaning that you can add amps at later dates if you feel it is necessary and you won't have to worry about a degradation in sound.

As for a sub, I'm in the same boat as you. One of the real "go to" members named Buckeye went on a road trip to SVSubs and is going to post his findings regarding them soon. I bet he'll cover something that will suit you fine. Again though, that 25' ceiling is going to be murder on you, you will need a receiver with a great amp section, or sepoerate amps for at least the fronts to start. Also you'll need one heck of a potent sub to pressurize that room. My #1 suggestion is that Yammie 4600 and like I said for a sub wait for a review by Buckeye. If you want though I'll suggest a couple that I'm familiar with that might do the job for you. HSU VTF-3 or STF-3, Paradigm PW-2200 or above models, and as for SVS see above idea re waiting Contact the manf. for more details and to make sure that they are enough for your big room. THis is your fault for buying a great house with open cathedral ceilings so you brought this on yourself.

 

[Magoo]

Looking at the SVS website and following the SVS Visit thread, it looks like I might have to discuss my situation with SVS to find the "right" sub. I kinda think the PB ISD/2 might do the trick for me. Those Ultra subs look nice, but are a little pricey for me. (Believe me, that magnificent ceiling is costing me big time, beyond needing a big sub! )
I'll follow up on the Yamaha RXV4600. The review looked good; it looks like the Yamaha might be stronger for AV than the Marantz, with the Marantz being stronger for music. We'll see how it shakes out price-wise, and if I can get some further info on it specifically compared to the Marantz SR7600 or SR8500.
I'm really not sophisticated enough to go the separates route. I'd like a decent mid range system (~$8,000) that will perform well beyond the HT-in-a-box systems, yet be fairly simple to install, administer and live with. I am a first timer with a system of this magnitude (thats why I'm in the Beginners forum!).
I'm still torn on the display, but am leaning toward the Panasonic. And still not sure what screen size? I'll give VisualApex a call, nice site and looks like they will be able to give some good advice about both the Panasonic and Pioneer.
I'll keep posting as I put this together, and I look forward to continuing to receive input from others that wish to provide assistance or share their experiences.

 

[Takeereasy]

The seperates route is not as hard as you'd believe. 2 good quality 75ohm rca cables and a space in your rack is all you'd really need. As things go along worry about eq'ing, not now. That said never do anything you're not comfortable with, and the Marantz units and the Yammie 4600 all have preouts and ins as well, so later down the road you've still got the option.

I just looked up some pics of the speakers again, and man those look nice. MS makes some nice looking stuff for sure.

For displays (this kills me to do cause I'm a Panny booster most of the time) I'd suggest Pioneer. Pioneer is IMO the king of Plasmas. Is the idea of a front projector setup dead for sure. Clint just posted a sweet deal for AH members for an Optima ht31 projector for about a grand US. You get that, a screen, and and the ceiling mount for well under $2k!. I'd suggest the $400 101" motorized screen. Very cool, very functional, very evil lairish, and you could say things like, "Lower the screen henchman #1" to the lady of the house. If the room is too bright for sure then Plasma is pretty cool way to go though.

Keep the posts coming. Your first big HT is of the caliber that many of us hope our last big HT will be. All well researched and priced out as far as I can tell. Good luck and keep it up.

On a side note I've reviewed a few of my recent posts and man, I'm a terrible speller and or typist. My mom used to teach English at University, if she saw the errors I make she'd stroke out.

 

[AVRat]

Regarding screen size, with the 50" you could even sit closer than the 12' to 15'. In other words, at that seating distance, bigger is better. You could check this site for help: http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html