New home, new system

[Gru]

Hello everyone,

I'm new to the hi-fi world but I'm trying to learn a few things so that I can have a decent sound system at home.

As the title says, I'm moving to a new home soon and I want some quality sound there. I'm not a pro so I'm trying to keep it simple. I would like to have a music dedicated room and system and a good home theater but for now I need a compromise solution.

I'm thinking of a solution with a mid-range AV receivers and a pair of corresponding columns.

For the receiver, and after some ressearch, I'm thinking on the Denon AVR-X2300W or the Yamaha RX-V581. I prefer the Denon but I would like to hear some feedback.

For the speakers, I like the Q Acoustics 3050 and my alternative choice will be the Wharfedale Diamond 230.

What do you think of these? For an inicial setup, what do you'll add?

Thanks for your feedback.

 

[shadyJ]

Looks good to me. I would prefer a pair of bookshelf speakers and a decent subwoofer, but if you don't need powerful bass, the tower speakers should do the trick. I do like all the Wharefedale speakers I have heard.

 

[Gru]

Looks good to me. I would prefer a pair of bookshelf speakers and a decent subwoofer, but if you don't need powerful bass, the tower speakers should do the trick. I do like all the Wharefedale speakers I have heard.

Thanks

I haven't made a final decision on bookshelf or floorstanding, I will only be moving in June so I still have some time to make this kind of decisions. Why do you prefer the bookshelf solution, is there any practical advantage of one over another?

 

[shadyJ]

Tower speaker do not have an advantage over bookshelf speakers above low bass frequencies. But tower speakers are usually at a disadvantage against subwoofers in low bass frequencies, so a pair of bookshelf speakers and a decent subwoofer can usually outperform a tower speaker along the same level of cost.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I'm going to go the other direction and advocate for towers. It's true if you're using a subwoofer, the extension capabilities don't matter too much. Honey, towers will have more/larger drivers that usually make them more sensitive and imo deliver a more dynamic presentation. A few things of importance are room size, seating distance and listening habits. For example, if you're in a small room and never listen loud, bookshelves are fine. Do you know the size of your new room yet?


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[Gru]

I'm going to go the other direction and advocate for towers. It's true if you're using a subwoofer, the extension capabilities don't matter too much. Honey, towers will have more/larger drivers that usually make them more sensitive and imo deliver a more dynamic presentation. A few things of importance are room size, seating distance and listening habits. For example, if you're in a small room and never listen loud, bookshelves are fine. Do you know the size of your new room yet?


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I was searching for some documents with room size but I can't find it now. Tomorrow I can easily get that information but I think it is about 40/50 m2.

All about distances I must check first but I can tell a litle about my listenning habits. It will be about 50/50 to music and movies (one day I'll have a room just for audio but that day is still far away...). I'm not looking for a very loud sound. Off course I want it fo "fill" the room, but mostly I want it to have a good solid and clear sound with no unwanted noises. If it could sound loud, better, but it isn't the most important for me.

 

[lovinthehd]

I've used both bookshelves and floor standers but use subs with either, but not a huge difference between the bookshelfs and floorstanders altho my floorstanders are better if I want to get real loud. One thing about bookshelves is it's a usually easier to accommodate 3 matching speakers across the front (I wouldn't consider going without a center for tv/movies). I also like bass so a sub is a must for me with the two speakers you proposed, they just don't go low enough for me (f3 point on the QAcoustics is 44Hz, 40 for the Wharfdale).

Both avrs are good units, I'm more a Denon fan due to Audyssey.

 

[Pogre]

I'm going to go the other direction and advocate for towers. It's true if you're using a subwoofer, the extension capabilities don't matter too much. Honey, towers will have more/larger drivers that usually make them more sensitive and imo deliver a more dynamic presentation. A few things of importance are room size, seating distance and listening habits. For example, if you're in a small room and never listen loud, bookshelves are fine. Do you know the size of your new room yet?


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I have a pair of bookshelf speakers in a very large room with a pair of subs and I don't find them lacking. I can reach painful, un-distorted levels at my seating position 14' away from the front stage. In fact, where I'm lacking right now is bass. The bookshelf speakers are plenty.

If you think about it, wouldn't a pair of bookshelf speakers with a pair of subs be the same as having 2 towers...?

 

[Gru]

By the way, I've checked the room size and is a 9m x 6m with about 3m high. It's not a big room.

 

[Pogre]

By the way, I've checked the room size and is a 9m x 6m with about 3m high. It's not a big room.

That's a fairly large room. Almost as big as mine. My point still stands though. I think you'd be fine with bookshelf speakers and a sub(s). If you spend the same money for a bookshelf that you have budgeted for floor standers you will generally end up with better bookshelf speakers as the costs can be directed toward better drivers, electronics, etc as opposed to more cabinetry and extra drivers.

 

[lovinthehd]

By the way, I've checked the room size and is a 9m x 6m with about 3m high. It's not a big room.

In terms of subwoofage its a fairly large room, what can be called an extreme room...see this article http://www.audioholics.com/loudspeaker-design/subwoofer-room-size

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I have a pair of bookshelf speakers in a very large room with a pair of subs and I don't find them lacking. I can reach painful, un-distorted levels at my seating position 14' away from the front stage. In fact, where I'm lacking right now is bass. The bookshelf speakers are plenty.

If you think about it, wouldn't a pair of bookshelf speakers with a pair of subs be the same as having 2 towers...?

No, not quite the same. Even most high end towers aren't considered "full range", and ones that even measure into the 30's will not even be close to a subwoofer. It's just not possible. For music? Maybe, but even though I use towers, I rarely turn off the subs. My feelings on the bookshelf debate are(over simplified for presentation) similar to big sub vs small sub. Even if you're reach the same loudness with bookshelves, the presentation isn't inherently the same just because it's as loud. I apologize for lack of verbal dexterity, my brain has gas at the moment lol. Here's an article by Gene that's a good read. Not definitive, but insightful.
http://www.audioholics.com/frequent-questions/bookshelf-vs-tower-speakers



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[Pogre]

No, not quite the same. Even most high end towers aren't considered "full range", and ones that even measure into the 30's will not even be close to a subwoofer. It's just not possible. For music? Maybe, but even though I use towers, I rarely turn off the subs. My feelings on the bookshelf debate are(over simplified for presentation) similar to big sub vs small sub. Even if you're reach the same loudness with bookshelves, the presentation isn't inherently the same just because it's as loud. I apologize for lack of verbal dexterity, my brain has gas at the moment lol. Here's an article by Gene that's a good read. Not definitive, but insightful.
http://www.audioholics.com/frequent-questions/bookshelf-vs-tower-speakers



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I can agree with you on towers being more dynamic for larger areas if they have the extra drivers. Another thing I consider too is quality. Oftentimes you will be able to buy the next step up in line from the same company in a bookshelf that has better drivers, crossovers and build quality for the same money. If I were to upgrade to towers I'd want at least the same build and quality electronics I have in my current bookshelf speakers, and can't afford that right now.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I can agree with you on towers being more dynamic for larger areas if they have the extra drivers. Another thing I consider too is quality. Oftentimes you will be able to buy the next step up in line from the same company in a bookshelf that has better drivers, crossovers and build quality for the same money. If I were to upgrade to towers I'd want at least the same build and quality electronics I have in my current bookshelf speakers, and can't afford that right now.

There is a lot of sense in this. One big expense of towers is the extra cab material and the extra drivers. So yes, agreed. A grand on book shelf speakers will most likely get a better speaker than a grand on a pair of towers, quality wise. I could very well be the minority on this but i still feel that towers provide a better experience. Other than size, and cost, what would be an advantage of, for example your prime bookshelves vs prime towers?


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[Pogre]

There is a lot of sense in this. One big expense of towers is the extra cab material and the extra drivers. So yes, agreed. A grand on book shelf speakers will most likely get a better speaker than a grand on a pair of towers, quality wise. I could very well be the minority on this but i still feel that towers provide a better experience. Other than size, and cost, what would be an advantage of, for example your prime bookshelves vs prime towers?


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I considered the Prime towers which cost the same as a pair of Ultra bookshelf speakers, but decided to go with the better quality electronics, drivers and parts of the Ultra. It has a 6 1/2 inch woofer and the tweeter is pretty amazing for an aluminum dome tweeter.

I've been told I would probably have to go with more exotic materials or ribbon tweeter to do better. They blend very nicely with a pair of subs and I really don't feel like I'm missing much. It's a pretty neutral speaker and can handle some power, I've never bottomed them out.

 

[Gru]

Hi everyone!

First of all, a big thank you to all of you for your very usefull opinions. Lately I haven't spent much time with this subject because there'se a lot of things going on (new house, a marriage to set up, changing job...) but I hope that I can care of this in the next two months.

So, first thnigs first: the receiver. I'm still considering the pair I talked about in the first post but I now I can get the Yamaha for 150€ less than the Denon. I prefer the Denon one but in this price range it is a big difference. Is the Denon worth that difference?

About the speakers, this is were I still with many doubts. I'm considering both options: floorstanders or a pair of bookshelves and a subwoofer. I'm trying to stick with a budget of about 1000€ to the speakers (and another 500€ for the receiver).

For floorstandings, I'm still considering the Q Acoustics 3050 but for alternative I'm consdering the Monitor Audio Bronze 5. For bookshelves I'm not so convinced. QA 3020? QA Concept 20? Monitor Audio Bronze 2? Wharfedale Diamond 220? And about the sub, any thoughts?

As I said before, it will 50/50 for music and movies.

Here is a rough scheme I made of the living room:

As you can see, despite the room having 9x6m the "listening zone" is about 5x6m (but there's no phisical separation of the "dinning zone"). Unfortenally there's nothing much I can do about this configuration but I think I can get a decent music & cinema zone. I like a "full bodied" and warm sound with much detail I can get but I'm not obsessed with that, I know that I'll be limited with this budget and room.

Once again, I apreciate your help.

 

[shadyJ]

Monitor Audio and Wharefedale are generally good brands. I don't know about Q Acoustics. There probably isn't a big difference between a Denon AVR and Yamaha AVR if the price difference is only 150 Euro. You should just pick the one that has the feature set that appeals most to you. As for subwoofers, see what SVS subwoofers are available to you.

 

[Gru]

Monitor Audio and Wharefedale are generally good brands. I don't know about Q Acoustics. There probably isn't a big difference between a Denon AVR and Yamaha AVR if the price difference is only 150 Euro. You should just pick the one that has the feature set that appeals most to you. As for subwoofers, see what SVS subwoofers are available to you.

I only read wonders about SVS subwoofers but they're not cheap. I didn't expect to spend the same or more in the sub that I spent on the speakers but I'm still considering it because I can't find an alternative that really convinces me. I'm trying to stay in the 300€/350€ but it's not easy.

The HSU seems a nice alternative too but those I can't really find here in Portugal.

Monitor Audio and Wharefedale are generally good brands. I don't know about Q Acoustics. There probably isn't a big difference between a Denon AVR and Yamaha AVR if the price difference is only 150 Euro. You should just pick the one that has the feature set that appeals most to you. As for subwoofers, see what SVS subwoofers are available to you.

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[Pogre]

I only read wonders about SVS subwoofers but they're not cheap. I didn't expect to spend the same or more in the sub that I spent on the speakers but I'm still considering it because I can't find an alternative that really convinces me. I'm trying to stay in the 300€/350€ but it's not easy.

The HSU seems a nice alternative too but those I can't really find here in Portugal.



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It's not uncommon to spend more on your subs than main speakers. Good bass ain't cheap.