Need help understanding true output of my amplifier

[davehall83]

So i have heard from amplifier dealers which are in business just to do that and sell you an amp and some are true to their customers and give you the real truth about amplifiers but who is right is the integrated amplifier i have truely 125watts per channel by 9 channels? I have a denon AVR-X4700H and its 125 watts per channel by 9 channels. I need to know if what i am being told that an integrated amp like this is actually 125 watts divded by 9 channels is only truely giving me 13.8 watts per channel. I have heard this and then I have heard that no i should be getting 125 watts per channel and thats just a amp salesperson trying to sell me something i dont need. But what i am trying to do is this:

(2) Polk LSIM 705 towers
(1) Polk LSIM 706c center
(2) Polk LSIM 703 for surround left/right
(2) Polk 265 LS in wall speakers for surround back left and right
(2) SVS prime elevation for dolby atmos 7.1.2 (I may add 2 more later for 7.1.4)
(1) SVS PB1000 Sub

The question i have , does the denon X4700H have enough power for all this ?

If not,

I was thinking a Marantz 7706 or 8805 pre and then i love the ati amps like a 528NC and a 523NC.

I just don’t want to sink a crap load of money in a master bedroom system but i know i love the marantz and ati sound the warm sound is great that’s what i want. If the denon can do it great but if not i may want something with balanced xlrs

 

[lovinthehd]

Just look at the published ratings from Denon and learn how to interpret them. Most avrs do not come with ACD (all channels driven simultaneously) ratings. Your math is off but look at various bench tests to see differences between a typical one or two channel rating vs an all channel test. It's not that important, tho. Your Denon could well be fine but depends on the distance you are from the speakers as well as the spl you're desiring. You don't mention either. Salespeople, meh. In a bedroom most avrs, and particularly your very nice 4700, will have more than enough amplification for typical speakers in a typical room. Try this to start estimating your needs http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

 

[mazersteven]

Long Story Short

Your receiver does not ÷ 125 x 9. It is 125 per channel. But in real life its really not a full 125. Off the Top if my Head probably 100 per channel. But its definitely not 13.8

LOL

And that is a solid receiver and nice speakers.

If you were looking for an amp and I'm not saying you need them but if you were

Model 2220

Mono? Mini? Micro? Magnificent? Whatever that M is, this is one UNREAL little single-channel amp. 200 Watts (conservatively!) into a 3-inch chassis with balanced input stage to offer Common Mode Rejection! MANUAL See Front Panel Huge See Rear Panel Huge

outlawaudio.com

But you do need to up your subwoofer game

 

[lovinthehd]

Long Story Short

Your receiver does not ÷ 125 x 9. It is 125 per channel. But in real life its really not a full 125. Off the Top if my Head probably 100 per channel. But its definitely not 13.8

LOL

And that is a solid receiver and nice speakers.

If you were looking for an amp and I'm not saying you need them but if you were

Model 2220

Mono? Mini? Micro? Magnificent? Whatever that M is, this is one UNREAL little single-channel amp. 200 Watts (conservatively!) into a 3-inch chassis with balanced input stage to offer Common Mode Rejection! MANUAL See Front Panel Huge See Rear Panel Huge

outlawaudio.com

But you do need to up your subwoofer game

Better to think of it as at any one time from demand from a particular channel, it has that spec for 125 watt output. Depends on what the demands are from the other channels at that moment to be significant....

 

[davehall83]

Long Story Short

Your receiver does not ÷ 125 x 9. It is 125 per channel. But in real life its really not a full 125. Off the Top if my Head probably 100 per channel. But its definitely not 13.8

LOL

And that is a solid receiver and nice speakers.

If you were looking for an amp and I'm not saying you need them but if you were

Model 2220

Mono? Mini? Micro? Magnificent? Whatever that M is, this is one UNREAL little single-channel amp. 200 Watts (conservatively!) into a 3-inch chassis with balanced input stage to offer Common Mode Rejection! MANUAL See Front Panel Huge See Rear Panel Huge

outlawaudio.com

But you do need to up your subwoofer game

I was thinking about adding another pb1000 does that sound about right? I am not needing a lot of bass i don’t usually crank my bass up hardly at all. I’m about 20 ft from the front channel speakers. I do want to add 2 more atmos speakers to my system but if i do i have to get an external 2 channel amp at that point. I did look at the outlaw amps i am considering it. If i love my front 3 speakers to amps i guess that would be the best start?

 

[mazersteven]

Well if you have over a 20 ft room I could tell you that that SVS 1000 is not pressurizing that space.

 

[lovinthehd]

Multiple subs' benefits are more about smoothing room modes than output.

 

[Verdinut]

Your AVR will output 125 watts per channel with only 2 channels driven, and that is what is written If you peruse the published manufacturer's specs. Should you use all channels simultaneously, it won't produce more than about 80-85 watts/ch, but in any 9 channel situation, most power requirements are for the 3 front channels. Power requirement for surround channels is a lot less. Your AVR is powerful enough for most loudspeakers.

 

[davehall83]

That’s reassuring much better to hear then the amp salesman telling me i need a amp. But i was searching this forum and i saw something interesting so the highly priced ati d series amps are made by the same people that make outlaws and monolith amps ? If that’s the case i might wanna try the monolith it’s a good price point

 

[Verdinut]

That’s reassuring much better to hear then the amp salesman telling me i need a amp. But i was searching this forum and i saw something interesting so the highly priced ati d series amps are made by the same people that make outlaws and monolith amps ? If that’s the case i might wanna try the monolith it’s a good price point

In order to find out if you actually need external amplification, that all depends on the size of your listening room, your listening distance from the front speakers, the sensitivity of the speakers, and how loud you would listen to your HT system.

I suggest that you use the following to find out how much power you need:

Peak SPL Calculator

 

[lovinthehd]

Amp salesman? Hmm...

The Monolith and Outlaw models that ATI make for them aren't class D last time I checked at least, they're A/B. ATI does make some Hypex based class D amps under their own brand....

 

[davehall83]

In order to find out if you actually external amplification, that all depends on the size of your listening room, your listening distance from the front speakers, the sensitivity of the speakers, and how loud you would listen to your HT system.

I suggest that you use the following to find out how much power you need:

Peak SPL Calculator

Well here’s my result. Uncomfortably loud is what the denon can do per the inputs i have it that’s crazy i don’t need to go that loud lol. But i do still need a external amp to drive 2 extra atmos speakers because i cannot run all 11 channels on this thing it can only run 9 but it has preouts to run the extra two channels i need so then it’s a matter of i could get a small amp that runs 125 watt range x5 channels and run the 2 extra channels for atmos and then put the front stage on it

 

[Verdinut]

Well here’s my result. Uncomfortably loud is what the denon can do per the inputs i have it that’s crazy i don’t need to go that loud lol. But i do still need a external amp to drive 2 extra atmos speakers because i cannot run all 11 channels on this thing it can only run 9 but it has preouts to run the extra two channels i need so then it’s a matter of i could get a small amp that runs 125 watt range x5 channels and run the 2 extra channels for atmos and then put the front stage on it

Then, I would suggest the Monolith 2X or two Outlaw Monoblocks, which you could use to drive the front left and right channels. You would have 200 clean watts to drive each of them.

 

[lovinthehd]

If adding an amp you might consider a significantly higher powered one for your mains perhaps (either 2 or 3ch), or a modestly powered one if just for surrounds. The Atmos speakers won't require much in any case.

 

[mazersteven]

Monoblock the Mains

 

[lovinthehd]

Monoblocks offer no particular advantage over a multich amp in one box.

 

[davehall83]

So that being said should i go with an outlaw 7 channel amp and put the atmos speakers on the integrated amp or a monolith ? I like the extra power of the monolith 7 chan at 200 watt

 

[Verdinut]

So that being said should i go with an outlaw 7 channel amp and put the atmos speakers on the integrated amp or a monolith ? I like the extra power of the monolith 7 chan at 200 watt

You don't need to get 7 channels with external amplification. But you could just order the Monolith 3 channel amp to drive your 3 front channels, with ample power on your AVR left to drive the remaining surround and Atmos speakers. As a matter of fact, for practical purposes, the center channel requires as much if not more power than either the left or right front channel.
The Monolith 3x is back order at present, but Monoprice should be able to get some back soon. You could verify with them.

 

[davehall83]

You don't need to get 7 channels with external amplification. But you could just order the Monolith 3 channel amp to drive your 3 front channels, with ample power on your AVR left to drive the remaining surround and Atmos speakers. As a matter of fact, for practical purposes, the center channel requires as much if not more power than either the left or right front channel.
The Monolith 3x is back order at present, but Monoprice should be able to get some back soon. You could verify with them.

the back order is going to be a minute so i bought the 7 channel monolith. I will put all my (7) speakers on that then let the denon run the 4 atmos speakers what’s your thoughts?

 

[lovinthehd]

If you get the 7ch amp may as well use it! There's something to be said for the better value of the 7ch vs 3ch, too on a wp$ basis