Need advice on beginner system

[huskalator]

I just got out of training with the military and am due for a large $$$ bonus shortly. I worked hard and want to get a nice sound system for my apartment. I have never had one before so I have done a lot of research on cnet, amazon user reviews, and here and have narrowed my selection down to two options. I'm not really an audiophile(yet) so I'm not looking to spend much more than $800 for speakers + receiver, preferably less.

Either the:

Onkyo HT-S6100

Or:

Energy 5.1 Take Classic


with,

Yamaha RX-V363BL


What should I go with? I'm leaning towards the Take Classic system because it appears to more versatile and offer better sound even if it is more expensive. For the Take Classic is the AV Receiver the right choice? Is there a better AV receiver for a similar price? I need a versatile system as I'll be using for movies, music, and gaming.

People here seem very knowledgable so I would be very thankful for some help in this.

 

[alexwakelin]

$800 is enough for a good starter system, some people would recommend to start out with a 2.1 or 3.1 system. Going this route will get you better quality to start out, and you can easily add rear speakers at a later date.

I would also recommed you look at The Speaker Company, they offer free shipping and an in home trial.

http://www.thespeakercompany.com/

 

[huskalator]

Thanks for your input. I'm not very familiar with the speaker company speakers or a 2.1 or 3.1 system. Can you or anyone suggest a set-up in my price range? Keep in mind the $800 has to include the receiver too.

Will 2.1 or 3.1 give me the same quality as a 5.1 or 7.1 system?

 

[alexwakelin]

Thanks for your input. I'm not very familiar with the speaker company speakers or a 2.1 or 3.1 system. Can you or anyone suggest a set-up in my price range? Keep in mind the $800 has to include the receiver too.

Will 2.1 or 3.1 give me the same quality as a 5.1 or 7.1 system?

The Speaker Company is relatively new, and is an internet only seller. They are able to offer quality speakers at a lower price by cutting out the middle man. If you go with a 2.1 or 3.1 system, you would be getting better sound quality by spending more on your front speakers. Of course, you would be missing out on some of the surroud effects, but you would be surprised at how little sound comes from the surround speakers in many movies. In most receivers, if you turn of the surround speakers, sounds that would normally come out of them will be rerouted to the L/R speakers.

 

[sholling]

I'm in the 3.0 or 3.1 camp for a starter system. You're moving into an apartment and in my experience that means giving up massive booming bass - especially if you're not on the first floor. Towers will give you plenty of bass without driving the neighbors nuts. If you shop well you can buy a pair of decent full range tower speakers for within your budget. Add in an acoustically matched center and then wait until you have more money to add surrounds.

The problem in recommending speakers is that they are the number one most subjective part of a system and what I may love you may hate. That said here are a couple of ideas.

• I've never listened to The Speaker Company products but the prices are nice. The $450/pr TST2 combined with the $100 TC2 center and a refurbished Onkyo TX-SR606 receiver for another $300-350.
• About couple of times a year Frys.com blows out a few pair of discontinued Polk R50 towers as $80-100ea (+ S&H) loss leaders. They usually sell out in an hour or less. Because they sell out fast it may take some time to find a pair and more to match a center. You can also find them for about $350/pair on ebay. I'd use the same Onkyo 606 receiver.

 

[lsiberian]

I'm in the 3.0 or 3.1 camp for a starter system. You're moving into an apartment and in my experience that means giving up massive booming bass - especially if you're not on the first floor. Towers will give you plenty of bass without driving the neighbors nuts. If you shop well you can buy a pair of decent full range tower speakers for within your budget. Add in an acoustically matched center and then wait until you have more money to add surrounds.

The problem in recommending speakers is that they are the number one most subjective part of a system and what I may love you may hate. That said here are a couple of ideas.

• I've never listened to The Speaker Company products but the prices are nice. The $450/pr TST2 combined with the $100 TC2 center and a refurbished Onkyo TX-SR606 receiver for another $300-350.
• About couple of times a year Frys.com blows out a few pair of discontinued Polk R50 towers as $80-100ea (+ S&H) loss leaders. They usually sell out in an hour or less. Because they sell out fast it may take some time to find a pair and more to match a center. You can also find them for about $350/pair on ebay. I'd use the same Onkyo 606 receiver.

606s go for more than 705s these days. And aren't really available at 300 dollars anymore.
Plust he would be spending half his budget on a receiver.

The highest you should go on your budget is a HK AVR247 180 on ebay best offer.


Then I suggest you just get a really good pair of towers or bookshelves.

Kef iQs are an excellent choice IMO.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Check out the deal that Adam posted on the b-stock Ascends.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53651

Awesome speakers.

I would also be willing to try out the EMP system that AH is offering.
http://store.audioholics.com/product/1793/66234/emp-htp-551t-5-1-speaker-system

 

[krzywica]

606s go for more than 705s these days. And aren't really available at 300 dollars anymore.
Plust he would be spending half his budget on a receiver.

The highest you should go on your budget is a HK AVR247 180 on ebay best offer.

Harmon Kardon makes excellent receivers. I have had my AVR147 for over a rear and I love it. I think an AVR247 would be a perfect match with those EMP speakers.

Check out the deal that Adam posted on the b-stock Ascends.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53651

Awesome speakers.

I would also be willing to try out the EMP system that AH is offering.
http://store.audioholics.com/product/1793/66234/emp-htp-551t-5-1-speaker-system

I haven't heard these in person but have heard nothing but good things about them. Definitely worth a trial at least. And thats a crazy good deal!!

 

[sholling]

606s go for more than 705s these days. And aren't really available at 300 dollars anymore.
Plust he would be spending half his budget on a receiver.

eCost just had refurbished 606s for $279 shipped just a few days ago but it seems that they're all out now. This is the 2nd or 3rd time they've come up. Shop Onkyo currently has refurb 606s for $349 for Club Onkyo members. Joining takes all of a minute. It's all a matter of timing. That 50w HK would be struggling, especially if he buys inefficient bookshelf speakers. And I'd buy neither company's products used. I see the Onkyo as a better buy, with better features and if it were me I'd just start with a pair of towers and a center. That gets him out the door for $800-850. Surrounds can come later. If he buys a lesser receiver he's just going to wind up replacing it all too soon.

http://shoponkyo.com/detail.cfm?productid=TX-SR606&modelid=58&group_id=1&detail=1&ext_war=1

If the onkyo isn't a option the Pioneer VSX-918V-K is $229 with free shipping this week. You give up upscaling and it's strictly HDMI passthrough but they are solid little receivers that just don't break.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882117252&nm_mc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r&cm_mmc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r-_-Receivers-_-Pioneer-_-82117252

 

[lsiberian]

eCost just had refurbished 606s for $279 shipped just a few days ago but it seems that they're all out now. This is the 2nd or 3rd time they've come up. Shop Onkyo currently has refurb 606s for $349 for Club Onkyo members. Joining takes all of a minute. It's all a matter of timing. That 50w HK would be struggling, especially if he buys inefficient bookshelf speakers. And I'd buy neither company's products used. I see the Onkyo as a better buy, with better features and if it were me I'd just start with a pair of towers and a center. That gets him out the door for $800-850. Surrounds can come later. If he buys a lesser receiver he's just going to wind up replacing it all too soon.

http://shoponkyo.com/detail.cfm?productid=TX-SR606&modelid=58&group_id=1&detail=1&ext_war=1

If the onkyo isn't a option the Pioneer VSX-918V-K is $229 with free shipping this week. You give up upscaling and it's strictly HDMI passthrough but they are solid little receivers that just don't break.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882117252&nm_mc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r&cm_mmc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r-_-Receivers-_-Pioneer-_-82117252

The HK AVR 247 has comparable power to an Onkyo 705. I know I have had both. The 705 is a step up from the 606 plus the 06s were all nerfed by Onkyo.

The difference between published specs of 50w and 100 watt is 3db. I don't think that's enough to get concerned about. Especially considering how conservative HK specs tend to be and how inflated Onkyo's can be some times.

Feature wise the 705 is far superior, but on his budget I don't think he has any business putting half his budget on a receiver. If he does he should look hard for a 705 and not settle for a 606 IMO.

FYI Ecost.com has several poor ratings on reseller websites. I would proceed with caution buying from them.

 

[sholling]

The difference between published specs of 50w and 100 watt is 3db. I don't think that's enough to get concerned about. Especially considering how conservative HK specs tend to be and how inflated Onkyo's can be some times.

I've never bought into the HK kool-aid that 1 HK watt is worth 8 gazillion of everybody else's. When you're talking about bookshelf speakers with an efficiency of 85db then that 3db means a lot. Again another reason to buy two 90-93db efficient towers over five inefficient bookshelves.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one because I'd take the 606 all day over the HK. As far as half his budget goes that depends on how well he shops.

 

[lsiberian]

I've never bought into the HK kool-aid that 1 HK watt is worth 8 gazillion of everybody else's. When you're talking about bookshelf speakers with an efficiency of 85db then that 3db means a lot. Again another reason to buy two 90-93db efficient towers over five inefficient bookshelves.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one because I'd take the 606 all day over the HK. As far as half his budget goes that depends on how well he shops.

I don't know about driving towers with a 606. The ohm dips in some of them might be too much an amp at the level we are talking at.

The 606 doesn't even have pre-amp outs. That should be the first thing seen on any receiver if you want a long term option.

Meaning you can't integrate your subs and mains with EQ's later down the line. Believe me I didn't drink any koolaid. I have had both brands of receivers and there is really no difference in power. Certainly not noticable.

The 606 is a poor choice overal IMO. Especially considering the price paid.

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/MARSR5002/Marantz/SR5002-receiver-90w-x-7ch-HDMI-home-theater-surround/1.html is another very good option for 310 that's a steal IMO.

 

[krzywica]

That 50w HK would be struggling, especially if he buys inefficient bookshelf speakers. And I'd buy neither company's products used.

My 40 WPC AVR147 has more power than some of the Yamaha and Pioneer "100, 110 WPC" receivers that I have either owned or used in the past. I have had the towers in my sig to ear bleeding levels without any signs of distortion or want for more power. Not trying to pick a fight, just don't underestimate the meek power ratings.

And thats a refurbished product as well. I have been buying refurb and open box stuff for years and have had very few bad experiences. Not saying you should run out and buy whatever....but I wouldn't be afraid to purchase used or refurb.

 

[jostenmeat]

I'm in the 3.0 or 3.1 camp for a starter system.

+1

You're moving into an apartment and in my experience that means giving up massive booming bass - especially if you're not on the first floor. Towers will give you plenty of bass without driving the neighbors nuts.

I concur. Even a pair of towers in some apartments is STILL enough to drive neighbors nuts. If you have a capable set of towers and amplification to back them up, you can have the LFE normally meant for the subwoofer routed the mains instead. Modern receivers do this, just tell the receiver mains are set to large, and sub is off/disconnected. The signal will be greatly reduced in order to protect speakers and receiver, but my guess is that it's still plenty to bother neighbors.

OTOH, some apartment dwellers love their sub, and are smart about when they use it, or crank it (daytime). However, it is IMO that when squeezing out every useful penny, that you might as well just spend on stuff that will ALWAYS be used, if just for now.

The problem in recommending speakers is that they are the number one most subjective part of a system and what I may love you may hate. That said here are a couple of ideas.

+1

 

[sholling]

No disrespect to you my friend or the OP, but we're talking about a beginner to the hobby that was looking for a better than average HTIB or maybe a small step up. I don't think he's going to buy an EQ (do they still make them?) or a $1000 amp to go with it. He's going to care about 4x HDMI 1.3a ports and Audyssey one button setup and other features normal everyday people use. That doesn't include preamp outs.

There is a huge difference between what the average home listener and a hardcore audio nut wants from a receiver. That's why Onkyo sells so many 606s. It has those features.

 

[fractile]

I like the Klipsch Cinema6 array for beginners, it has RSX-3 speakers and a fine set to get for a good 1/2 price if you can.

 

[John Bailey]

As the original poster only mentioned audio, I would suggest going stereo for the time being. For many folks, the speakers are the main part of the system. I would spend the bulk of the money on speakers. I've made a hobby of searching for the best value in audio. Although I don't begin to think of myself as an audio expert, I do have a music degree and my ears are fairly good, if not a bit blunted by age. I agree that everyone's ears are different and my tastes will not be right for everyone. That being said, this would be my suggestion.

If your goal is audio, without worrying about video, I would suggest an Onkyo TX-8555. This is a stereo (2 channel only) receiver. You can find it on e-bay right now for $179. A great little 100 wpc stereo receiver. I have the older version matched with monitor audio bookshelves and find the set up to be a great value and excellent sound. If you must have a 5.1 receiver, I would go with the Onkyo TX-SR304. While many may find the 65 wpc too little, I've found it will make very good music at reasonable sound levels. This receiver can be found on e-bay for $150.

For speakers, the best deal out there right now is Saturday Audion's sale on PBS T55 speakers. These are great all round speakers. They are $629. If it were me, I'd go used and find a pair of Monitor Audio Sr6's. They are often found for $650. (there's a pair for that price on Audiogon right now)

For audio, I would not get the center speaker. I don't think it's needed for audio.

If you are willing to go used, I've found the best set up for audio is a used NAD C320 - $200/250, or NAD C355 - $250/300 and a used set of either PSB T55's- $450/500 or Monitor Audio S6's - $350/450(the forerunner of the afore mentioned Sr6's). I think the PSB's are a better all round speaker, especially for rock, but I chose the Monitor Audio because I listen to mostly classical.

Of course with used, you'll have shipping added to that.

Good luck shopping, and thank you for your service to your country!!

John

 

[sholling]

The Polk R50's are back on sale for $60ea plus S&H again but they always sell out fast. Not audiophile quality but decent starter speakers.

 

[lsiberian]

No disrespect to you my friend or the OP, but we're talking about a beginner to the hobby that was looking for a better than average HTIB or maybe a small step up. I don't think he's going to buy an EQ (do they still make them?) or a $1000 amp to go with it. He's going to care about 4x HDMI 1.3a ports and Audyssey one button setup and other features normal everyday people use. That doesn't include preamp outs.

There is a huge difference between what the average home listener and a hardcore audio nut wants from a receiver. That's why Onkyo sells so many 606s. It has those features.

That's a very good point.

I get carried away sometimes.

 

[Adam]

The Polk R50's are back on sale for $60ea plus S&H again but they always sell out fast. Not audiophile quality but decent starter speakers.

Just a note - buy one at a time to save on shipping ($15/each, or $42 for both)...at least if they're still doing the shipping charges like before.