Need advice for my Yamaha RX-V 673

I

indigo

Audiophyte
Hi there,

I have a Yamaha RX-V 673 and i want to buy some loudspeakers. Specs of the yamaha:
Code:
http://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/audio-visual/av-receivers-amps/rx/rx-v673_g/
Will my amp be able to handle those:

- B&W 684
Code:
http://www.bowers-wilkins.net/Speakers/Home_Audio/600_Series/684.html
or
- Klipsch RF-82 II Floorstanding Speaker
Code:
http://www.klipsch.com/rf-82-ii-floorstanding-speaker/details#specs
My use will be mainly for music and a bit for movies but music is more important.

thanks
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
I would be cautious about those speakers with a receiver. The B&W speakers have a minimum impedance of 3 ohms, so basically the nominal rating that they give for them is pure BS. (If B&W were honest, they would rate a speaker with a minimum impedance of 3 ohms as being nominally 3.45 ohms [or, if they rounded it, it would be 3 ohms nominally]; see this for the formula.) Klipsch has played fast and loose with the truth in their impedance ratings in the past, though I do not know about that model specifically, as I have not seen any reviews in which the impedance is measured and Klipsch does not give the minimum impedance.

Because many speaker manufacturers are basically liars, you cannot trust nominal impedance ratings (though some manufacturers are honest about them, many are not, so you would have to know that a specific manufacturer is honest in order to be able to trust such a rating). Consequently, you should judge them by the minimum impedance and pick according to that.

The danger to the amplifier in your receiver is that with a low impedance, there will be higher current demands for a given power output, and that can lead to overheating and premature failure. Worse case scenario is a fire in which you are horribly mutilated, but that is unlikely. But it is possible.

The reason that many speaker manufacturers lie about the nominal impedance is because many people would not buy a speaker that is rated at an impedance that is below the minimum recommended for the amplifier that they have. So their lies increase sales. And then when the poor sucker who bought their improperly rated product destroys their amplifier, that is just too bad for the poor sucker.

My guess is that there is no LEGAL definition of nominal impedance (even though there is a standard for its meaning), and consequently scumbags lie in order to sell their wares to unsuspecting customers.


Now, if you only play things at low volume, the power demands would be less and consequently it may never be a problem.
 
I

indigo

Audiophyte
thanks for the response. Now im depressed :(

Can you tell me what should i look for so i can make the right choice. This whole amp h/c and loudspeaker thing is a new world to me.

i might consider those speakers too: Monitor Audio RX6 and Q Acoustics 2050i.


thanks
 
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Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
As I stated in my earlier post:

you should judge them by the minimum impedance and pick according to that.​

Both of your new suggestions have minimum impedances of approximately 4 ohms. See:

Monitor Audio Silver RX6 loudspeaker Measurements | Stereophile.com

Q Acoustics - 2050i Speaker

I would not recommend them, but, again, if you do not play things very loudly, you might be able to get away with it.


Many times, tower speakers with twin woofers use nominally 8 ohm woofers wired in parallel, which presents a nominally 4 ohm load to the amplifier. That is not good if you are wanting to play things loudly with most receivers.

If you look at tower or bookshelf speakers with single woofers, you are less likely to run into this problem, but you should be judging this by the minimum impedance, not by the number of woofers. (Since I have encountered many people online who fail to understand English, even when it is their native language, being less likely to run into a problem does not mean that one will not run into the problem. So ALWAYS examine the minimum impedance before committing.)


Keep in mind, none of this has anything whatsoever to do with the quality of the sound. My advice above is regarding the electrical compatibility of the speakers with your receiver.

Now, with your receiver, you do have preamp outputs for the right and left channels, so you could buy an appropriate separate power amplifier to drive whatever you wanted for those channels. But that will cost a lot, so you would have to really want the low impedance speakers badly for this to be worthwhile.


When buying speakers for a surround system, it is good to remember that the main speakers do not need to have deep bass if you are going to be using a subwoofer. That, after all, is the point of a subwoofer, making it so that you do not need all of the other speakers to be able to reproduce very deep bass. You then need to be careful to set it up properly (which means, in part, that you set the main speakers to "small" and select an appropriate crossover frequency; 80 Hz is often a good choice with bookshelf speakers, but it will depend on the particular model in question).


One thing to keep in mind is that different people have different preferences with speakers, so it is a very good idea for you to go to all of your local audio shops and listen to as many different types of speakers (e.g., ribbon, horn, dome, whatever) as you can find, of as many brands as possible, that are in your price range, to find out what you like and what you don't like. Once you have settled on something you like, you then find out the minimum impedance of it, and see if you have a problem with the receiver you already have. If it is not a problem, great, that is what you buy and you [hopefully] live happily ever after. If it is a problem, you then consider whether there is a similar model that is not a problem, or you consider buying a power amp to drive them.


Usually, one should select one's speakers first, and then buy a receiver or amplifier appropriate for them. But as you already have a receiver, you are more limited in what speakers you can safely buy without buying another amplifier.


Do you have any other equipment other than the receiver already purchased? If so, what is it? And what is your budget for everything you need to buy, and how many channels of speakers do you want? Will you be having more money to spend in the future (so that, perhaps, you could spend all of your current budget on some of the speakers you want, and can wait and buy the speakers for the other channels later on when you have more money to spend)?
 
afterlife2

afterlife2

Audioholic Warlord
:DYou led me to this review. I love the intermission part:
 
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I

indigo

Audiophyte
@Pyrrho thanks for you post, very informative.

Well my budget is about 900 euros, im not really into 5.1 so its not a priority. 2.0 or 2.1 is just fine for now.
In the future i might add a central speaker.

I have the yamaha rx-v 673 and some old Sony speakers. I read on various sites that the Monitor Audio Silver RX6 and rx-v 673 are a great match.

I'm open to suggestion if you have some. I'm into rock/prog/metal/jazz/classical music.

I really want to buy loudspeakers but those looks good
Code:
http://www.klipsch.com/rb-61-ii-bookshelf-speakers-pair/details#specs
Code:
http://www.dali-speakers.com/en-US/Loudspeakers-1/ZENSOR-5.aspx
Code:
http://www.klipsch.com/rf-42-ii-floorstanding-speaker/details#specs
cheers
 
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I

indigo

Audiophyte
Amplifier Section Channel 7.2
Rated Output Power (1kHz, 1ch driven) 150W (4 ohms, 0.9 % THD [European Model])
Rated Output Power (20Hz-20kHz, 2ch driven) 90W (8ohms, 0.09% THD)
Maximum Effective Output Power (1kHz, 1ch driven) (JEITA) 150W (8ohms, 10% THD)
Dynamic Power per Channel (8/6/4/2 ohms) 130/170/200/240W
 
DannyA

DannyA

Audioholic
Worse case scenario is a fire in which you are horribly mutilated, but that is unlikely. But it is possible.
What fun is setting up your new system if you can't be mutilated in the process? Cuddle up to your lady. Crack open a nice bottle of wine. Relax and watch your receiver burn! ;)
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
Amplifier Section Channel 7.2
Rated Output Power (1kHz, 1ch driven) 150W (4 ohms, 0.9 % THD [European Model])
Rated Output Power (20Hz-20kHz, 2ch driven) 90W (8ohms, 0.09% THD)
Maximum Effective Output Power (1kHz, 1ch driven) (JEITA) 150W (8ohms, 10% THD)
Dynamic Power per Channel (8/6/4/2 ohms) 130/170/200/240W
Look on the back panel about the warning about using speakers less than 8 ohms. That tells you that it is not really designed to deal with lower impedances, though you might be able to get away with it, depending on all of the particulars (as I stated from the beginning).

The dynamic power listing is pretty useless fluff, and the rating with 10% distortion is pretty ridiculous, too, as that is quite high distortion, not anything that would be nice to hear.

While I am at it, you might want to read these:

Connecting 4-ohm Speakers to an 8-ohm Receiver | Audioholics

Setting the A/V Receiver Impedance Selector Switch | Audioholics

Now, can you get away with it? Well, that depends on all of the exact particulars (e.g., the specific speaker impedance curve, what you play [because frequency content can matter], how loud you play it), as I have stated from the beginning.
 
I

indigo

Audiophyte
Well i play loud prog rock /metal music so it can be an issue if im not careful with my choice.

i'm gonna start looking for loudspeaker's impedance curve.
 
P

Phules

Enthusiast
I had an older RX-V663 and B&W 683s. Like what was said before B&Ws like power, they would play fine but until you place an amp inbetween the receiver and speakers they would never really perform. When I replaced the 663, I ensured the new AV receiver had preouts to feed the amp. This could be another route for you, but I dont think your receiver has preouts.
 
I

indigo

Audiophyte
no it does not have preouts :-(

You guys have any suggestions for loudspeakers that can go with my amp?
 
I

indigo

Audiophyte
After reading what you guys wrote i've decided to get bookshelf speakers.

Dali Zensor 1
Code:
http://www.dali-uk.co.uk/en-GB/Loudspeakers/ZENSOR-1.aspx
Klipsch RB 51 II
Code:
http://www.klipsch.com/rb-51-ii-bookshelf-speakers-pair/details#specs
or BW CM1
Code:
http://www.bowers-wilkins.com/Speakers/Home_Audio/CM_Series/CM1.html
Now for the subwoofer which one should i look for power wise to not kill my amp?

thanks
 
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