My cheaper Marantz vs my higher end stuff...

[ematthews]

So I have been running the system in my signature {Parasound/ATI} for a while now. Except replace the Ascend speakers with the Polk Lsim 703, as that's the speakers I was using today. The Marantz PM 8005 was hooked up the the SVS sub with it set at 60hz cut off. Polk's at full range obviously as there are no sub controls. Turned it all all just after running the same song on the Parasound, ATI set up and BOOM... What a huge difference in headroom, sound stage and just overall room filling sound.. Just don't get it. I went back to my high end stuff and made a few adjustments here and there and I just can not duplicate the Marantz playback sound.. Guess I could just sell all that stuff and keep my old Marantz gear. Thoughts???

 

[fuzz092888]

If it sounds better, it sounds better I guess

 

[ematthews]

Yeah. Just can’t put my finger on why it sounds better. Very full sound. In fact I’ve been trying to get this sound with the thought of buying new gear and speakers. Maybe I’m a Marantz guy. I have it in my HT set up.

 

[fuzz092888]

I've been a Marantz guy since getting into the hobby. I've demo'ed other stuff at stores, but nothing has ever given me a compelling reason to switch or spend more (significantly more) money. My ex GF's Dad was a huge Marantz fan and has been using them since forever. It's good stuff for sure.

 

[lovinthehd]

Since you're not comparing directly maybe the difference is more in setup or test method than the particular electronics. Just how did you compare?

 

[KEW]

Maybe it sounds the same, but you were expecting it to sound worse, consequently it seems to sound better?
Maybe because it looks so good with all of the other Marantz gear?
I don't trust my ears to reliably distinguish between something I heard 2 minutes ago and something I am hearing now. I want to have instantaneous switching between amps to feel any sense of certainty (and many here would argue against that, since it is still a sighted test).

But the bottom line is you feel good about it and it is not costing you more for the "better" gear, so go with it and enjoy!

 

[ematthews]

It was a significant difference. An instant A-B was not needed in this case. I also did a straight Comparison without the sub and the Soundstage was bigger. Base was lower as well.

 

[shadyJ]

If the difference was that significant it should me measurable. Do you have any way of taking some measurements?

 

[rojo]

Did you have Audyssey enabled? Maybe the difference was DynamicEQ. Parasound prepro was calibrated for flat at reference output, and therefore sounded weaker at lower volumes; whereas the Marantz with DynamicEQ compensated for the psychoacoustic difference in perceived flatness at a more typical listening volume. Maybe?

 

[PENG]

Yeah. Just can’t put my finger on why it sounds better. Very full sound. In fact I’ve been trying to get this sound with the thought of buying new gear and speakers. Maybe I’m a Marantz guy. I have it in my HT set up.

You should double check the phasing of the left and right to make they are in phase when hooked up to the P5 and ATI. Any difference between them and the SA8005 should be subtle.

 

[ematthews]

Did you have Audyssey enabled? Maybe the difference was DynamicEQ. Parasound prepro was calibrated for flat at reference output, and therefore sounded weaker at lower volumes; whereas the Marantz with DynamicEQ compensated for the psychoacoustic difference in perceived flatness at a more typical listening volume. Maybe?

This isn’t an AVR. It’s a two channel integrated amp. No EQ here.

 

[ematthews]

You should double check the phasing of the left and right to make they are in phase when hooked up to the P5 and ATI. Any difference between them and the SA8005 should be subtle.

Right to right. Left to left so it’s Ok.

 

[PENG]

Right to right. Left to left so it’s Ok.

Thank you, just that when you mentioned the sound stage not as good and sound less full compared to the other set up, that could be due to the left and right channel 180 degrees out of phase to each other.

If you are using a different set of interconnect somewhere in the signal chain, then you should also check and make sure the interconnects are wired correctly. I know of one particular make that look good, not the cheapest, yet there is a bad batch (bought 2 pairs, both have the same issue) that had the black and red wired 180 degree out of phase. It was the same symptoms you described that prompted me to investigate. There was no pointed returning it because it would have been the same so I just fixed it myself, a 5 minute job.

 

[ematthews]

I’ll check this. I use Blue Jeans cables on all my stuff. However the ATI amp is connected to my P5 pre via XLR. My Marantz is only using one set of BJC RCA’s to the CD player. I’ll recheck the XLR cables. In fact I’ll change them to RCA and see what happens.

 

[sterling shoote]

Well, it sounds better; and, although you are wondering why, after all it is physically different, that's to say, the electronics are not the same configuration or same components, so would not a different sound actually be expected. Only thing that would make me wonder would be if you replaced the PM8005 with another PM8005 and you perceived one sounded different than the other for better or worse. One thing though, you might want to get an external crossover to set your mains at a cut off at about 60hz. Seems to me that would get a better result, or just turn off the sub.

 

[ematthews]

Well, it sounds better; and, although you are wondering why, after all it is physically different, that's to say, the electronics are not the same configuration or same components, so would not a different sound actually be expected. Only thing that would make me wonder would be if you replaced the PM8005 with another PM8005 and you perceived one sounded different than the other for better or worse. One thing though, you might want to get an external crossover to set your mains at a cut off at about 60hz. Seems to me that would get a better result, or just turn off the sub.

I ran the POLK LSIM 703 by themselves. However as a bookshelf speaker, they don't go low enough for me. I have to use a sub. I played with the settings for a while and found the 60 setting to blend really nice. Not an exact science, but it sounds good to me. I also have the SVS subs volume at 12:00. So I have 50% more volume to add if I wanted. Great stuff.

 

[sterling shoote]

I ran the POLK LSIM 703 by themselves. However as a bookshelf speaker, they don't go low enough for me. I have to use a sub. I played with the settings for a while and found the 60 setting to blend really nice. Not an exact science, but it sounds good to me. I also have the SVS subs volume at 12:00. So I have 50% more volume to add if I wanted. Great stuff.

Oh, OK, so your bookshelf speakers are not actually full range and are dropping off at about 60 hz and thus you have your sub set at 60 hz and half gain. I run my sub at half gain with volume at -10db through OPPO bass management. Bass management from digital pre/pro is set at 0 db for similar results to OPPOs bass management. You are just perhaps in need to memorize the bass gain for music you are familiar with so as not to under or over play what you perceive as accurate bass effect. Good going. Marantz components have a really nice look. I've studied the PM8005 and it seems like a winner. Beside the PM8005 what are the other two Marantz components?

 

[ematthews]

Just the Marantz NR1506 AVR. While I purchased this as I needed a slim line receiver, it turned out to be a great upgrade over my Onkyo AVR. The sound is fantastic and it runs nice and cool throughout a movie.

 

[highfigh]

So I have been running the system in my signature {Parasound/ATI} for a while now. Except replace the Ascend speakers with the Polk Lsim 703, as that's the speakers I was using today. The Marantz PM 8005 was hooked up the the SVS sub with it set at 60hz cut off. Polk's at full range obviously as there are no sub controls. Turned it all all just after running the same song on the Parasound, ATI set up and BOOM... What a huge difference in headroom, sound stage and just overall room filling sound.. Just don't get it. I went back to my high end stuff and made a few adjustments here and there and I just can not duplicate the Marantz playback sound.. Guess I could just sell all that stuff and keep my old Marantz gear. Thoughts???

View attachment 23673

So, Marantz with SVS sub replaced the Parasound/ATI with or without the sub?

List the equipment used in each setup and their settings. The way you wrote this makes it look like you changed to the Polks AND changed from Parasound/ATI to Marantz, today. Was the Parasound connected to the sub? If you used a HO crossover on the Polks before, it could explain part of the difference- they weren't providing anything/much below the crossover frequency.

 

[highfigh]

I also have the SVS subs volume at 12:00. So I have 50% more volume to add if I wanted. Great stuff.

How much more might be available depends on the level control and its 'taper', meaning the rate of change based on the position of the wiper and the range of resistance. There's no reason to think that you set it halfway between zero and full output- it may be at 75% or 30%. Two types of variable pots are generally used- linear taper and audio taper, which changes logarithmically.