Maggies for Movies?

[AndrewLyles]

I have been auditioning speakers now for over a year, trying to find some that give me goose bumbs when I hear them. I'll list below what I've auditioned but I am looking at using Maggies all around for a HT setup. I keep hearing that this might be a mistake, and realizing that I live in a small apartment, these things might not have the room they need to breathe as they will most likely be placed directly in a corner.

Here is what I'm thinking about using right now:
Mains: Maggie 1.6QRs
Center: Maggie CC3
Left and Right Surrounds: Maggie MMGWs
Subwoofer: SVS 20-39 PC-Plus

Here is what I have ruled out:
B&W: DM600 S3 & DM602 S3 speakers
Focal.JM Lab: Chorus 726S
Def. Tech: BP 7006 SuperTowers
Mirage: Omnisat Surround System
Klipsch & Polk: I spent a couple hours in the speaker room at J and R's in NY listening to several different systems there, but don't remember the model numbers.

So far, the Maggies were the ones with the most WOW factor. I like the thin form factor, I love the surrounds can be flush mounted to the walls, and for music they sounded astounding (I am driving back out to the dealer in a few weeks to test them when a couple movies and in corner placement.) They look pretty good in white and I've been inpressed with their sound so far.

Primarily I use my system for Movies/TV and video games. I do enjoy auditioning albums, but that might only be about 20% of their usage at best. Am I off my rocker trying to use these speakers for HT in such a limited space. I realize that Planar speakers need room so is it a matter of just not having enough of it where I am?

Sound and Vision seemed to like the Maggies for movies, but I haven't seen many reviews on them.
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article.asp?section_id=2&article_id=809&page_number=4

Are there any serious makers in my price range that I've missed in my search that I should really look for, really listen for, that would compete or beat what I'm looking at currently. I'd love to hear from Maggie users about any input they may have and also from people who have positive experiences with other set-ups in this price range ($3-4K.)

Thanks in advance everyone.
~Andrew

 

[AudioSeer]

Are you allocating 3K-4K just for speakers? If so, I would try to audition ATC speakers if you can find a dealer close by. They are not very well known in the states, but have an excellent pro audio pedigree. ATC makes some of the finest speakers in the world IMO.

http://www.atc.gb.net/multi_channel/concept_1/concept_1.html

You'll find that the many English made speakers sound better in smaller rooms. These ATC's are an example of this with their sealed design.

 

[AndrewLyles]

Are you allocating 3K-4K just for speakers?

Yes, 3-4k for just speakers but that must also include a subwoofer. I have not heard of ATC before, I will have to try and find some information on them.

 

[jaxvon]

I think you might also want to try M&K, Vandersteen, and Phase Technology. They're all top-notch speaker makers.

 

[AndrewLyles]

Vandersteen

I think you might also want to try M&K, Vandersteen, and Phase Technology. They're all top-notch speaker makers.

Jaxvon:
I've been looking at the Vandersteen speakers and have to say am very intrigued by them. There is a dealer about 30 min. away that I will have to visit for an audition.
1) Do you know anything about the speakers or had any experience with them? Would love to hear some input.

2)As far as the maggie situation goes, I love the MGC series becasue they mount flush to the wall and swivel out into listening position, perpendicular to their mounted position. This would work extremely well as my couch is situated directly against the rear wall and I don't really have side walls to mount on (one is a window, the other is a Kitchen counter.) Any thoughts on using the maggies for the surrounds and using one of the more dynamic speakers for the mains and the center... something like the Vandersteen 2ce Signatures?

Thanks.

 

[AudioSeer]

Jaxvon:
I've been looking at the Vandersteen speakers and have to say am very intrigued by them. There is a dealer about 30 min. away that I will have to visit for an audition.
1) Do you know anything about the speakers or had any experience with them? Would love to hear some input.

I've owned Vandersteen 2CE's in the past. They are an excellent speaker. However, they need to be at least three feet away from the front wall because of the rear firing woofer. If they are too close they get boomy.

Vandersteens have a rich sound that leans to the warm side. They are efficient and sound good with all different kinds of music. Unfortunately, I can't comment with their use in a home theater environment.

What I especially like about the Vandersteens is that they are time and phase aligned. This makes them image especially good with music when you are sitting in the sweet spot. Once you get used to this type of speaker, it's hard to switch back.

Other time and phase aligned speakers worth checking out are Thiel and Green Mountain.

 

[The13thGryphon]

Andrew,

The system you're looking at is very similar to the one I am currently putting together...

Mains: Maggie 1.6QRs
Center: Maggie CC3
Side and Back Surrounds: Maggie MC1s
Subwoofer: Dual SVS PB10-ISDs or dual HSU STF-3s

I've heard an all Maggie audio/home theater system and I can honestly say that it was by far the most impressive, exciting, and lifelike home theater system that I have ever experienced. And believe me, I’ve listened to a lot of them; I used to sell this gear for a living. The dialogue on the Maggie system is crystal clear without being hyped or "in your face"... and the main action and surround sounds are so lifelike that my wife and I got goose bumps. Yes... I said my wife.

We looked at Polk, and Vienna Acoustics, and B&W, and Sonas Faber, and JBL, and Infinity, and Snell, and Definitive Technology, and M&K and many, many others. When we listened to the Maggies I just knew that she was going to say "no way you're putting those ‘2001 A Space Odyssey’ monolith things in our home theater"... but low and behold... she LOVED them! I wanted Maggies and had purposefully shown her as many other speakers as I possibly could before letting her hear the Maggies. Still I was afraid that she'd balk... instead, the moment she heard them her head started bobbing and her toes started tapping. Now she says they are the only speakers she'll allow me to buy. Woohoo!

In my opinion, if you like the Maggie sound, then you're not likely to find any box speaker that will satisfy. There just is no comparison (my opinion).

However, I would carefully listen to the MG-1.6QRs in a corner placement. Even fairly miniscule (one inch) movements can drastically change the sound and character of these magnificent speakers. I believe that they need to be out in the room and allowed to "breath" to be at their best... at least 3 feet from the back wall and 2 feet from the side wall.

If you simply can't manage this arrangement, then you might consider the MC1s for your main left and right fronts. The MC1 is designed to hang on the wall just like the MMGWs, but their larger, go lower (80 hz; perfect for handing off to the sub), and are a true two-way design with a quasi-ribbon tweeter element.

Personally, I can't think of a single other system that I'd rather have. Well, maybe those Wisdom Audio towers that run $40,000.00... but since I'm not Bill Gates I think I'll stick with the Maggies.

 

[AndrewLyles]

The dialogue on the Maggie system is crystal clear without being hyped or "in your face"... and the main action and surround sounds are so lifelike that my wife and I got goose bumps.

Gryphon I know exactly what you are talking about. The first time I saw the 1.6QR's in person I was literaly amazed.. the first words out of my mouth in the demo room were simply "WoW!". I could not get past their sheer size but they completely dissappeared once music was playing through them. I believe I mentioned that I have not yet auditioned them with DVD material yet, at least not movies but the music I pushed through them sounded superb. I tested everything from Opera, to Blue grass, to Processed Rap. The maggies dealt with all of it smoothly.

I do understand when people say they have concerns about the dynamic ability of the panels for action movies though as I am comming off having a set of 15" woofer Infinity reference series speakers that could make you feel anything in your chest. The smoothness of the maggies, and the accuracy of the sound was simply the best I have ever heard on any speaker (with exception of an $80k pair the dealer was playing.)

If you simply can't manage this arrangement, then you might consider the MC1s for your main left and right fronts. The MC1 is designed to hang on the wall just like the MMGWs, but their larger, go lower (80 hz; perfect for handing off to the sub), and are a true two-way design with a quasi-ribbon tweeter element

I know I will not be satisfied by having the MC1's as my mains, they simply were not deep enough for my personal tastes, and the fact that the entire front wall is a glass mirror which prevents hanging anything there. I am going to try pushing the speakers at my dealer into the corner and see how they sound, though I know I'm going to loose much of the transpanency and sound stage that makes me love them. If this fails then I think I am going to try auditioning the Vandersteen's when I get back to the city in a couple weeks. I hope that since they are a direct radiating speaker they will work better in the corner and becasue they are di-pole they will retain some of the spaciousness. Though the center channel speaker is redicoulsly expensive and might be out of my price range. By the way, I haven't heard a center speaker as accurate as the CC3 before in any set-up that I auditioned.

I can't give up the MC1's for surround speakers, their mounting configuration is abso,utely perfect for my setup and I'm hoping that mixing and matching surround speakers will not lead to too much degredation in the cinema experience.

Does distance from the side walls matter that much with the sound quality of the Maggies? I was hoping that since these are technically a di-pole like speaker that the null region beside the speaker would help prevent interactions with the side wall. As far as space behind, I think I can have as much as 1' of space, one will be tucked in a corner and the over next to a very large piece of furniture taller than the speaker (a wardrobe.) Do you think that this will be enough room for the Maggies to breathe without too much degredation of the sound?

~Andrew

 

[The13thGryphon]

Does distance from the side walls matter that much with the sound quality of the Maggies?

Maggies are funny creatures. EVERY minute movement causes a change in either timber, clarity/transparency, or soundstage. I've honestly never seen another speaker that was as sensitive... but oh boy, when you do get them dialed in... WOW!

All I can say is try them out in or near a corner and see what you think. Push them into the room and back toward the wall, closer to you and farther back, toe them in bit by bit. It will be a lengthy evaluation, and I kid you not that mere inches will make a huge difference.

About the third time I was in Definitive Audio-Video in Seattle to listen to the MG-1.6QRs my salesman told me to go on into the room and throw on whatever I wanted to... he'd be with me when he was finished with his current customer. I put on one of my favorite albums and was very disappointed with the sound... it was not at all what I remembered. My wife was along with me and she had the exact same reaction. The bass was muddy and overblown, and the midrange was not nearly as transparent and "liquid" as I'd remembered.

My wife and I looked at each other in puzzlement. These were the speakers we'd been drooling over for almost a year (well, I was drooling... she's too much of a lady for that). We played cuts from four different artists and had the same reaction with each one. Pure disapointment.

The salesman came into the room, listened for less than a minute and said "Something's not right. I'll bet someone moved them again." He went over to the Maggies and moved them away from the wall by about 1.5" and toed them in about an inch more... and SHAZAM! There were my wonderful, beautiful, transparent, musical, lifelike, gotta have 'em or I'll die Maggies.

Play with them a lot before you make a decision, and see if you can get them to let you take them home for the final evaluation.

 

[AndrewLyles]

The salesman came into the room, listened for less than a minute and said "Something's not right. I'll bet someone moved them again." He went over to the Maggies and moved them away from the wall by about 1.5" and toed them in about an inch more... and SHAZAM! There were my wonderful, beautiful, transparent, musical, lifelike, gotta have 'em or I'll die Maggies.

Play with them a lot before you make a decision, and see if you can get them to let you take them home for the final evaluation.

This is a good thing to know and I will definately have to play with them at the store, but the more I learn about them and the more I research the more depressed (is this the right word?) I get about them. I know that the limitations of my apartment are significant and my flexability for placement is very strict due to space contraints. I was thrilled at the oportunity of such a wonderful speaker that didn't suffer from the same woes of big box placement that I gave up with my last set. My old infinities were monsters with extremely superb sound but it came at a cost of sheer mass and size, they were definately too heavy to move around by myself and what enourmous when compared with most of todays floorstanding speakers.

I will definately spend a lot of time with them at the dealer when I get back, but I'm trying to start looking for a back up plan in the event that they do not keep a sonic quality that is pleasing once they are pushed into the confines where they would actually be working. I'm really not sure where to start again, having looked at so many different types of speakers already, I'm running out of brands that I know about. I still have to look at the vandersteens, but I won't lie... I'm not married, but these things are just plain ugly, lol and present me with the same obtrusive placement issues I dealt with when dealing with my Infinity's.

Who knows, I may luck out with this though and they may end up sounding just as incredible. I was looking at the MUG (Magnepan Users Group) website and going through pictures of different systems that the users have. There were definately a lot that had given them a significant amount of space to breathe, but there were more than a handful that had close rearwall positioning or corner placement.

One review I've read so far even ended up doing a similiar placement in the corner due to space limitations which is promising. I'm still going to start looking at other brands while I have to time to research, but my hope is that the Maggies will come through in a corner placement. I won't be devistated by slight frequency boosts or mild bass re-enforcement so long as it is not muddy. Now I just have to find other speakers that are going to present an amazing sound stage without carrying the Top of the line ML or B&H price tag.
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_8_3/magnepan-16-speakers-9-2001.html


Hopeful,
~Andrew

 

[highfihoney]

magnepan make's some of the best sounding speaker's in the world & i have owned several pair's in the past but they have big drawback's.

you never mentioned what you planned on using to power the maggies with,maggies love power & high current power too,magnepan's will clip a lot of amp's at no where near reference level's,i would be willing to bet that the dealer where you heard them was running them on a class a amplifier,big $$.

maggie's are also extremely placement specific,with 1 degree placement change in just one of the speaker's the sound can go from good to terrible,they are also not a very dynamic sounding speaker & have a very small sweet spot.

the experience you had at the dealer's is very common (been there & done that) but when you get them home & find out all the drawback's to them they become a head ache until you can get them right.

you would be alot better off sticking with full range floor stander's,try looking into m&k,polk,nht.

 

[AndrewLyles]

Energy and Anthony Gallo

the experience you had at the dealer's is very common (been there & done that) but when you get them home & find out all the drawback's to them they become a head ache until you can get them right.

highfihoney:
Thanks for the input. I'm definately not afraid of a little leg... er knee work to get the best sound out of my system. As far as what would be driving them I am looking at puchasing an outlaw 7125 to run the system which would be 195wpc @ 4ohms. This should be enough to run them fairly lould.

Unfortuneatly I agree with you recomendation about them needing space, in fact every one I have spoken with has warned me about placing these in a small apartment in a corner and right up against the rear wall so I am relenting, recognizing that $$$ spent on the wrong speaker for the wrong situation is going to be horrifying... to both the listening experience and the wallet.

A friend recommeded auditioning a pair of Energy speakers, this is what he recently switched his HT to after selling off his Maggies due to a limited dynamic ability. Additionally, I am very excited to audition a pair of Anthony Gallo Refernece 3 speakers at my local dealer soon. They look amazing and the reviews I read all praised the speakers. They are slightly more than the maggies, but still within reach if I'm patient. I have been trying to find some information on the boards about them but they seem pretty scarce around here. I will let everyone know once I get the chance to hear them for myself. I do like the fact that they can be a full range speaker, though I am wondering what to use for surrounds. Should I stick with the Maggie MC1s which are wall mountble and flat(this would be nice as my couch is right against the rear wall and they could swivel out into position), or look into the Due' speakers from Gallo which have a 180 degree tweeter?

Ahh the evolution of a HT system, and this is all before it makes it into the apratment.... I'm hoping that by being finicky upfront it will lessen the turnover once I bring it home, at least with the speakers.