Linking QUAD67 CD Player to Denon S770H

[TLS Guy]

@TLS Guy : Re the physics, I had been under the impression that the feed from the single RCA output had been digital as the installation guide said it was “reserved for future digital use“. Even if it had not yet been converted, the fact that it worked on the amplifier’s digital coaxial input meant that it was using the amp’s DAC rather than it’s own. That it won’t work on my amp because of the lack of a digital input remains. I hope that I will still be able to pass that physics exam as I admit I have forgotten much.



Tony

The optical connections are digital. So the output of the Quad at the RCA output is digital ahead of the Quad DAC. Now the converter converts the digital electron stream to an optical photon digital stream. The DAC in your receiver will then convert it to analog. Then you can hear it.

 

[Eppie]

The digital coax to optical converter that TLS Guy linked to will do the trick and allow you to use the optical input on the Denon (as that model lacks the coaxial digital input) but I see little benefit over simply using the analogue RCA inputs on the Denon. It's not like the DAC in the Quad is bad and you will likely not notice any difference compared to the DAC in the Denon. I think it would come down to how many devices you have connected to the Denon. If you are using the Cable/Sat and Media Player HDMI inputs and lack connections to support the Quad, the adapter makes sense, but if the Quad works fine on the analogue Cable/Sat or Media Player inputs, you can simply use the other HDMI inputs and just have to put up with mismatched labeling for your components, which I think lovinthehd already addressed. That model may allow you to re-label the inputs in the setup menu.

 

[tkray111]

@Eppie : Sorry, I saw your suggestions (with which some I discuss below only after I had posted the following. In particular I have noted my concern with the DAC converters, that I have no RCA or coaxial HDMI connection and that using the Media Player path has not worked so far):

Denon themselves seem to have pointed the way to the DAC converters. So far their other suggestion of using the assignable Media In with the RCA cables and then naming the Media Input 'CD' (as suggested already on the forum) hasn't worked.

I have considered changing to a Yamaha AV Receiver RX-V4A which has the coax input but is a bit more expensive rather than buying a converter. This is because the reviews about such converters that I have read on Amazon show roughly 9-15% of problems or failures such as poor sound, poor volume, distortion or unwanted sounds.

In my search for an answer I would very much appreciate if there are any recommendations or advice from members about DACs

With thanks for any response,

Tony

 

[mtrycrafts]

...

Denon themselves seem to have pointed the way to the DAC converters. So far their other suggestion of using the assignable Media In with the RCA cables and then naming the Media Input 'CD' (as suggested already on the forum) hasn't worked.

I have considered changing to a Yamaha AV Receiver RX-V4A which has the coax input but is a bit more expensive rather than buying a converter. This is because the reviews about such converters that I have read on Amazon show roughly 9-15% of problems or failures such as poor sound, poor volume, distortion or unwanted sounds.

In my search for an answer I would very much appreciate if there are any recommendations or advice from members about DACs

With thanks for any response,

Tony

In your original post you said "via both the Phono outputs and the TOSlink cable (which I ended up using more). " If this is correct, the Toslink is optical and your new 770 has two optical inputs. Or, I missed something.

 

[TLS Guy]

@Eppie : Sorry, I saw your suggestions (with which some I discuss below only after I had posted the following. In particular I have noted my concern with the DAC converters, that I have no RCA or coaxial HDMI connection and that using the Media Player path has not worked so far):

Denon themselves seem to have pointed the way to the DAC converters. So far their other suggestion of using the assignable Media In with the RCA cables and then naming the Media Input 'CD' (as suggested already on the forum) hasn't worked.

I have considered changing to a Yamaha AV Receiver RX-V4A which has the coax input but is a bit more expensive rather than buying a converter. This is because the reviews about such converters that I have read on Amazon show roughly 9-15% of problems or failures such as poor sound, poor volume, distortion or unwanted sounds.

In my search for an answer I would very much appreciate if there are any recommendations or advice from members about DACs

With thanks for any response,

Tony

If you assign a pair of line analog RCA inputs correctly, it will work.

 

[tkray111]

@mtrycrafts :

In your original post you said "via both the Phono outputs and the TOSlink cable (which I ended up using more). " If this is correct, the Toslink is optical and your new 770 has two optical inputs. Or, I missed something.

I have to apologise for this error. I had thought the word for my cable was TOSlink, whereas I have come to find that that means an oblong shaped connector. I should have used the correct Coaxial Digital term for the cable.

@TLS Guy : I don't understand your suggestion "If you assign a pair of line analog RCA inputs correctly, it will work." I have tried putting the Analog RCA inputs into the assignable Media Player inputs to the right of the phono MM inputs (which can't be reassigned) and then changing their assignment to Media Player while cutting out the HDMI input option and so far it has not worked.

So I admit I may have done something incorrectly, but what is the correct way?

Thanks

Tony

 

[tkray111]

I do have a related question, this time about the links between my DVD player and the Denon receiver.

When I link the DVD player directly to an HDMI input on the television, it works perfectly.

However, if I try to play it through the receiver's HDMI inputs then from the receiver to the TV's HDMI input, it doesn't play. Could this be the fact that I am using an HDMI 1.2 connection? This seems unlikely as it worked through my 2011 Denon.

Again, I'm mystified either as a result of my inadequate understanding of modern equipment, or perhaps not seeing the obvious.

Hoping I am not being too much of a pest with all my different questions, whileI deeply appreciate all you have done for me so far,

Tony

 

[TLS Guy]

I do have a related question, this time about the links between my DVD player and the Denon receiver.

When I link the DVD player directly to an HDMI input on the television, it works perfectly.

However, if I try to play it through the receiver's HDMI inputs then from the receiver to the TV's HDMI input, it doesn't play. Could this be the fact that I am using an HDMI 1.2 connection? This seems unlikely as it worked through my 2011 Denon.

Again, I'm mystified either as a result of my inadequate understanding of modern equipment, or perhaps not seeing the obvious.

Hoping I am not being too much of a pest with all my different questions, whileI deeply appreciate all you have done for me so far,

Tony

It is clear to me that you have not done the input assign correctly, and I suspect your unit is not set up at all. Get out your manual and study the set up procedure and then do it.

Modern units are NOT plug and play. They can not be used right out of the box. You have an hour or two of homework before the unit is functional.

 

[lovinthehd]

It is clear to me that you have not done the input assign correctly, and I suspect your unit is not set up at all. Get out your manual and study the set up procedure and then do it.

Modern units are NOT plug and play. They can not be used right out of the box. You have an hour or two of homework before the unit is functional.

Good grief, it takes you an hour or two to understand/implement manual? Wow.

 

[TLS Guy]

Good grief, it takes you an hour or two to understand/implement manual? Wow.

About that to really fine tune the set up. There a lot of menu screens to go through and vital adjustments to make.

When I got the AV 10, I think I was tweaking things for about two to three days, with listening and measurements. I have not touched it for months now.

 

[lovinthehd]

About that to really fine tune the set up. There a lot of menu screens to go through and vital adjustments to make.

When I got the AV 10, I think I was tweaking things for about two to three days, with listening and measurements. I have not touched it for months now.

What tweaks were you making manually?

 

[TLS Guy]

What tweaks were you making manually?

Crossovers and levels mostly based on measurements and listening, Also BSC, but that is unique to jmy set up.'

One of the things that takes a lot of time is all the hunt and peck with the remote to correctly re-label and assign all the inputs. Then all the input levels have to be set, to make sure there is not a huge level difference switching devices. Getting things really correct takes time and care, so the system operates seamlessly. I admit I have more devices to accommodate than most. I also use calibrations discs with my mic. I don't use auto programs like Audyssey.

 

[TLS Guy]

@TLS Guy : Re the physics, I had been under the impression that the feed from the single RCA output had been digital as the installation guide said it was “reserved for future digital use“. Even if it had not yet been converted, the fact that it worked on the amplifier’s digital coaxial input meant that it was using the amp’s DAC rather than it’s own. That it won’t work on my amp because of the lack of a digital input remains. I hope that I will still be able to pass that physics exam as I admit I have forgotten much.



Tony

The RCA pairs under 2 on your receiver are analog inputs. So you should be able to connect your CD players outputs to one of those pairs and if you select that input on your remote then you should hear it, as long as you also have main zone selected on your remote.

If you don't hear anything then see if you can hear the test tones from the receiver. If you can't hear test tones with the main zone selected, then that receiver is a dud and needs to be returned.

 

[tkray111]

Thanks for all the help you have given so far.

Just to make it clear, I studied the manual for a couple of days, going through the manual, page by page, and checking every single setting in the in each menu, continually tweaking (as so many of you have done) and doing what I believed to be correct. I have done this always with every new piece of electronic equipment I have bought over the last forty years at least.

There have been many developments over a short time span. There have been constant changes in the specifications of each component, constant updates to software, and increasing complexity of interactions between hardware and software components.

Because of the often long gaps between purchases there are obviously large changes.

I agree it would be nuts to just turn on any machine nowadays without having read the manual. I know from bitter experience that the skeleton ‘setup guides’ that come in the box are totally inadequate when it comes to working out complex interactions between components that may be of different eras. Manufactures no longer provide hard copies of 200 page manuals.

Therefore I don’t think it to be very surprising that someone might not fully understand some of the instructions. In my case I hadn’t understood, for example, why analog outputs might not work with analog inputs. I cannot yet understand why an HDMI output from the amplifier might not work with its input to a TV.

This is the same with other questions I have raised. In this forum in the newbies’ section which seems to be for the purposes of helping newcomers to solve problems they come across and so far I have been struck by the kind and wonderful help so many of you have given. This has been the same for me in other forums for complex issues in construction, thought or understanding. I really value this and always use this facility when coming across problems in other fora. I have never hesitated to admit ignorance or stupidity in my questions.

I should also point out that I have gone to Denon, QUAD, and B&W to ask specific questions about interactions with other components — some of which helped and others not. Denon in particular have not bothered to read accurately my questions and I have had to repeat them so they can provide some way of overcoming the problem in question.

I have learnt it would be a mistake to think I do so without having studied the complete manual which makes huge suppositions about the level of knowledge of the reader about these really complex machines.

I do apologise for this lengthy screed and have already done so for being a pain in asking so many questions that some may be tired of helping with, especially if they are experts in this field.

So I agree that help is always necessary, as perhaps some of you have experienced either by training or making mistakes.

Thanks again for all the patience you have given me in answering my questions.

Tony

 

[TLS Guy]

Thanks for all the help you have given so far.

Just to make it clear, I studied the manual for a couple of days, going through the manual, page by page, and checking every single setting in the in each menu, continually tweaking (as so many of you have done) and doing what I believed to be correct. I have done this always with every new piece of electronic equipment I have bought over the last forty years at least.

There have been many developments over a short time span. There have been constant changes in the specifications of each component, constant updates to software, and increasing complexity of interactions between hardware and software components.

Because of the often long gaps between purchases there are obviously large changes.

I agree it would be nuts to just turn on any machine nowadays without having read the manual. I know from bitter experience that the skeleton ‘setup guides’ that come in the box are totally inadequate when it comes to working out complex interactions between components that may be of different eras. Manufactures no longer provide hard copies of 200 page manuals.

Therefore I don’t think it to be very surprising that someone might not fully understand some of the instructions. In my case I hadn’t understood, for example, why analog outputs might not work with analog inputs. I cannot yet understand why an HDMI output from the amplifier might not work with its input to a TV.

This is the same with other questions I have raised. In this forum in the newbies’ section which seems to be for the purposes of helping newcomers to solve problems they come across and so far I have been struck by the kind and wonderful help so many of you have given. This has been the same for me in other forums for complex issues in construction, thought or understanding. I really value this and always use this facility when coming across problems in other fora. I have never hesitated to admit ignorance or stupidity in my questions.

I should also point out that I have gone to Denon, QUAD, and B&W to ask specific questions about interactions with other components — some of which helped and others not. Denon in particular have not bothered to read accurately my questions and I have had to repeat them so they can provide some way of overcoming the problem in question.

I have learnt it would be a mistake to think I do so without having studied the complete manual which makes huge suppositions about the level of knowledge of the reader about these really complex machines.

I do apologise for this lengthy screed and have already done so for being a pain in asking so many questions that some may be tired of helping with, especially if they are experts in this field.

So I agree that help is always necessary, as perhaps some of you have experienced either by training or making mistakes.

Thanks again for all the patience you have given me in answering my questions.

Tony

What I want to know is whether you can hear the test tones from the receiver? I am starting to think you have a dud.

 

[tkray111]

@TLS Guy : Thank you very much indeed. I am truly sorry about not having seen your question before my last posting. My excuse was that I had a waking moment last night at 5am and rushed into the lengthy screed that now looks well over-baked. I should remember always to leave a post until I had checked everything!

Anyway, now down to the nitty gritty. It is all my fault, not the amps - as you suspected when you asked if I had done it all correctly. I thought that as I had gone over all the settings twice that I must have done so correctly: clearly an arrogant mistake. I had not noticed a previous mistake in the reassignment of the Media Player input. I had accidentally assigned it to input 1 (the CBL/SAT) rather than to input 2 (Media Player).

I grovel in my arrogance and fully apologise to all. The sound is now as sweet as it used to be and I am delighted.

I would not have achieved this without the enormous help all of you have given, and I have learnt much in the process both about the electronics and of myself!

Now no more questions, at least until the next piece of equipment comes up, something which I don't hope will happen with my varied pieces of equipment from different ages.

One thing I am miffed about is why Denon allows the use of the digital coax to American customers while refusing it to those in the UK. Even the Denon engineers didn't spot that I might have a different model and didn't ask where I was based. It seems stupid to me, or perhaps they presume that in the UK nobody buys CD players any more and therefore don't put the necessary instructions in the manual Although they do say that some inputs are assignable, they don't give the full detailed instructions of the steps needed.

Thanks again for the patient help with which you have nursed me through all these steps.

Tony

 

[TLS Guy]

@TLS Guy : Thank you very much indeed. I am truly sorry about not having seen your question before my last posting. My excuse was that I had a waking moment last night at 5am and rushed into the lengthy screed that now looks well over-baked. I should remember always to leave a post until I had checked everything!

Anyway, now down to the nitty gritty. It is all my fault, not the amps - as you suspected when you asked if I had done it all correctly. I thought that as I had gone over all the settings twice that I must have done so correctly: clearly an arrogant mistake. I had not noticed a previous mistake in the reassignment of the Media Player input. I had accidentally assigned it to input 1 (the CBL/SAT) rather than to input 2 (Media Player).

I grovel in my arrogance and fully apologise to all. The sound is now as sweet as it used to be and I am delighted.

I would not have achieved this without the enormous help all of you have given, and I have learnt much in the process both about the electronics and of myself!

Now no more questions, at least until the next piece of equipment comes up, something which I don't hope will happen with my varied pieces of equipment from different ages.

One thing I am miffed about is why Denon allows the use of the digital coax to American customers while refusing it to those in the UK. Even the Denon engineers didn't spot that I might have a different model and didn't ask where I was based. It seems stupid to me, or perhaps they presume that in the UK nobody buys CD players any more and therefore don't put the necessary instructions in the manual Although they do say that some inputs are assignable, they don't give the full detailed instructions of the steps needed.

Thanks again for the patient help with which you have nursed me through all these steps.

Tony

Thank goodness that one is solved! Well done.

 

[tkray111]

Well done yourself. A lot of work and patience there . Thanks.