Killed my record deck?

[joerobo1975]

Hi folks,
I don't know if anyone out there can help but I think I've goosed my deck.
I suddenly had a really low sound from it so ordered a pack of needles. A few day later new ones arrived but are slightly different but did come with a cartridge so I 5hought I'd connect it up to make sure the needle was my problem, it was, so ordered new correct needles, unfortunately I didn't notice the deck was still powered up when I was removing the new cartridge I think I shorted the wires. There is no noise from the thing at all now where there was a him if you touched the connections.... what have I done.... ?

Sorry for long story....

Many thanks

 

[lovinthehd]

What are the specifics of the make/model of gear involved?

 

[joerobo1975]

It's a 1 by one record deck

 

[joerobo1975]

It's not the amp or cable, all checked separately. Definitely no signal from the head connection.

 

[joerobo1975]

1byone 3-Speed Semi-Automatically Belt-Driven Turntable with Magnetic Cartridge, Adjustable Counterweight, USB Vinyl to MP3 Record Player https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07B48CLPF/ref=cm_sw_r_apan_glt_fabc_WKA9CQA1WNGRM51A9BDW?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

 

[lovinthehd]

Like this? What stylus/cartridge did you order?

ps LOL forgot to post the link, but yes that's what I found (altho never heard of that brand before)

 

[joerobo1975]

8 Pieces Replacement Record Player Needle Set Including 2 Pieces Record Player Turntable Cartridges 6 Pieces Record Player Stylus Needles for Turntable Record Player LP Phonograph https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B08HVLCVSF/ref=cm_sw_r_apan_glt_fabc_XJDS6KXZV0P127MEMHV4?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

 

[joerobo1975]

I realise it's wrong but when I ordered it I wasn't beside the Dec and thought it was generic. Oops! Think I may have fried a preamp?

 

[lovinthehd]

I realise it's wrong but when I ordered it I wasn't beside the Dec and thought it was generic. Oops! Think I may have fried a preamp?

Yeah definitely wrong stuff to buy. So what did you do when you tried to install that stuff particularly? Assume you had four leads for the old cartridge (what is it, some sort of Audio Technica as in the pictures?). In the future, you need to buy a specific stylus for a specific cartridge, but as to low output, the stylus being worn isn't likely to be an issue. Did you do something to damage the stylus that made you think that was the reason for a drop in performance? So the loss of performance was a loss of volume originally? What pre-amp are you using? The built-in one or an external one?

 

[joerobo1975]

Hi thanks for taking the time.

Yeah one record finished all fine put next record on, volume all but gone. Tried a few discs, all the same result. Jumped to conclusion that the sudden problem would be the needle or cartridge. Connected the new cartridge to the wires as you said to see if it was the problem but could not mount it properly so just ahem tacked it to the old one and hey presto had sound, so popped correct needle in my virtual basket. It was when I was disconnecting the new cartridge that I shorted the leads I think without switching off the deck. It's an onboard preamp. Thanks

 

[Eppie]

Hi thanks for taking the time.

Yeah one record finished all fine put next record on, volume all but gone. Tried a few discs, all the same result. Jumped to conclusion that the sudden problem would be the needle or cartridge. Connected the new cartridge to the wires as you said to see if it was the problem but could not mount it properly so just ahem tacked it to the old one and hey presto had sound, so popped correct needle in my virtual basket. It was when I was disconnecting the new cartridge that I shorted the leads I think without switching off the deck. It's an onboard preamp. Thanks

Shorting the leads temporarily on the cartridge would not do any damage to the unit. Only shorting the speaker wires while the unit is on would you damage the amplifier. When connecting the cartridge you have to make sure to follow the proper wiring, but usually the wires are colour coded and the cartridge terminals are colour coded to match. Make sure that the cartridge is mounted perfectly square and that the counter weight has been adjusted to the proper tracking weight as well. The new cartridge manual will give a weight range, typically 1.8 to 2 grams. The anti-skating dial should be set to the same value as the counter weight.

 

[joerobo1975]

Shorting the leads temporarily on the cartridge would not do any damage to the unit. Only shorting the speaker wires while the unit is on would you damage the amplifier. When connecting the cartridge you have to make sure to follow the proper wiring, but usually the wires are colour coded and the cartridge terminals are colour coded to match. Make sure that the cartridge is mounted perfectly square and that the counter weight has been adjusted to the proper tracking weight as well. The new cartridge manual will give a weight range, typically 1.8 to 2 grams. The anti-skating dial should be set to the same value as the counter weight.

Hi mqn6 thanks, yes wiring was done exactly as was, the problem is there is now zero signal coming from the connector wires to the amp. Before if you touched them there would be a noise picked up by the amp, now nothing, nanda, zip. I'm guessing something has either come adrift inside or a component has failed. Will have a look over next day or two, suspect there will be little I can do though as this kind of modern set is tend to be disposable rather than repairable. There wouldn't be any fuses in the pre amp?

 

[Verdinut]

In my opinion, the type of cartridge and needles you bought are not the right stuff. The styluses remind me of the ones which were used on 78 rpm records in the 1940's, and were good to play only a few of them.
Why don't you get a decent cartridge with a better stylus and your discs will last longer as well. Amazon has a nice affordable Audio-Technica catridge which should fit on your turntable arm. It is also available with a choice of styluses as you prefer:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Audio-Technica-AT-VM95E-Elliptical-turntable-cartridge/dp/B07JXD79Q1/ref=sr_1_17?crid=1RFRVK6VHQ84N&dchild=1&keywords=phono+cartridge+and+stylus&qid=1633448079&qsid=259-4000867-1304242&s=musical-instruments&sprefix=Phono+Cartridge%2Cmi%2C228&sr=1-17&sres=B01M27L6P5%2CB06XHVR5PJ%2CB07N3Q7G4K%2CB08X69G76N%2CB08WYYL1FD%2CB07R4RZZJF%2CB01KNW9L54%2CB08DKR87ZC%2CB000OY3CFM%2CB094MWZLDD%2CB07ZSJQNZK%2CB001IEPNN6%2CB07JXD79Q1%2CB000Q33ONG%2CB07DD6LYDJ%2CB01M3SYG4N%2CB07C2WB6NS%2CB06XYHTQCM%2CB000Q19QXA%2CB07Z4MZWVJ

 

[Eppie]

Hi mqn6 thanks, yes wiring was done exactly as was, the problem is there is now zero signal coming from the connector wires to the amp. Before if you touched them there would be a noise picked up by the amp, now nothing, nanda, zip. I'm guessing something has either come adrift inside or a component has failed. Will have a look over next day or two, suspect there will be little I can do though as this kind of modern set is tend to be disposable rather than repairable. There wouldn't be any fuses in the pre amp?

Ah, sorry, should have looked more closely at the unit. There is a slide switch on the back. Phono Direct will have a weak signal that bypasses the pre-amp. It needs to be connected to a phono input on that setting. If connected to a line level input (like Aux) then the switch is set to Preamplifier, so make sure you have the correct switch setting to match the connection on your amplifier / receiver / powered speakers.

You can unplug the RCA cable from the turntable and with the cable still connected to the amp, touch the center pin. You should get some noise (buzz) like before if the amp is working ok. If you get a buzz, then you need to diagnose the problem with the turntable. WIth the RCA cable connected to the turntable and amp, yes, it is normal to get a buzz when touching the cartridge wires (when not connected to a cartridge). Those wires are very fine inside so do not pull on them too hard or they could break internally. Try not to put any tension on the wires when changing the cartridge.

EDIT: There would not be a fuse on the preamp in the turntable. Maybe a single fuse on the power cord inside but then the unit would have no pwoer at all.

 

[joerobo1975]

Hmm sounds like I've possibly snapped the fine wires inside then as no buzz from the cartridge wires. Amp etc all working properly. Can't see it being the wires though as I would need to break all of them to have no signal at all. Will do a continuity test next time I'm near the rig, not home just now. Thanks for your help!

 

[Eppie]

Hmm sounds like I've possibly snapped the fine wires inside then as no buzz from the cartridge wires. Amp etc all working properly. Can't see it being the wires though as I would need to break all of them to have no signal at all. Will do a continuity test next time I'm near the rig, not home just now. Thanks for your help!

No problem. You'll have to remove the bottom cover to access the other end of the tone arm wires. Continuity test won't work through the pre-amp to the RCA jacks. You'd have to pull pretty hard to break the wires, but it's something to consider if you have no output. Start at the cartridge and work your way down. With the slide switch set to Phono Direct you should have continuity from the cartridge to the RCA plugs.

 

[Eppie]

BTW, the cartridge that you linked to is a "P-mount". It does not use screws and is meant to plug into a headshell that has a socket for P-mount terminals (no attaching wires). You need a standard cartridge that either has threaded holes like the one Verdinut linked to, or has slots so that you can use a nut and bolt to mount the cartridge.

 

[3db]

Hmm sounds like I've possibly snapped the fine wires inside then as no buzz from the cartridge wires. Amp etc all working properly. Can't see it being the wires though as I would need to break all of them to have no signal at all. Will do a continuity test next time I'm near the rig, not home just now. Thanks for your help!

How do you think you snapped the fine wires inside your tonearm/turntable? Im curious because I don't see how you could. Also, how much did you pay for the TT?

 

[lovinthehd]

Not sure what this means "Connected the new cartridge to the wires as you said to see if it was the problem but could not mount it properly so just ahem tacked it to the old one and hey presto had sound, so popped correct needle in my virtual basket". Can you explain more since you got sound somewhere in here?

So you've tried using both the tt's internal phono pre-amp and an external one on your amp (what is the amp?)? No sound either way? Did you do this before messing with the cartridge/stylus?

Did something particular happen before you messed around with the cartridge/stylus, i.e. when the problem first appeared?

 

[TLS Guy]

I am totally confused about what you did. How on earth did you attach a p-mount cartridge to a standard one? You had to have done something highly irregular.

So you need to get a multimeter and check the connectivity from the head-shell to the preamp input, as has been suggested.

Turntables are particularly fragile devices, and may not be your cup of tea, as you strike me as an unusually ham fisted gentleman.