Is my screen too big???

Mad-Max

Mad-Max

Audioholic Intern
Hi guys,

After showing this plan to two different sales rep I was given different advice.

Rep# 1 - your 106" screen is too big for the height of your ceiling, I should go with 96"

Rep#2 - no problem, it will fit perfectly.

The reason I ask is that I was having some concerns with the bulkhead obtructing the projector and also having the top of the screen too close to the ceiling ( reflection ) issues. I was told that flat black paint will take care of that.I will have about 10 to 12" to the top of the ceiling.

Thx

Mad
 

Attachments

Mad-Max

Mad-Max

Audioholic Intern
trying to attach pics but it always " fails "...:mad:
 
J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
10-12" is plenty of space with flat black ceiling. Look towards, in order, Rosco Supersaturated 6003, Benjamin Moore flat black, and Behr Mouse Ears flat black.

For any obstruction, I would just mount the PJ, and fire the pic at the blank wall to know for absolutely certain. Make sure to use a 16:9 AR movie.
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
That's about where my screen is. I have 8' ceillings, but have a motorized screen which I put in a soffit which is 12" deep. So, about 7' to the floor. Then it has about 12" of black mask. I actually shortened it up a bit, but I could have left it going lower.

With the projector that low, you really need to be using a projector with lens shift like the Epson 8350, 8700UB, Panasonic AE4000, or a JVC model.
 
Mad-Max

Mad-Max

Audioholic Intern
The idea of of shooting it against a blank wall is a good idea, does it matter if the wall is black?

As for the projector, the two Epson model you quote are the two I was looking at, I just can't decide/understand which is best...

- Epson 8350 has 2000 lumens of color and white light output and contrast ratio of up to 50,000:1.

- Epson 8700UB has 1600 lumens color and white light output and contrast ratio up to 200,000:1.

I have never owned nor bought a projector, I always had plasma's, so this venture is totally new to me.

I know the lumens is the amount of light the projector is capable to throw out and the contrast ration is the " clarity ", I think the amount of pixels used to recreat the image...I think.

So I am confused as to which is better, higher lumens or higher contrast ratio?

I will have my projector set up at approximately 14' away form the screen and the lighting in the room will be 100% controlled. I was very wary about buying any projectors because of the " sacrifice " of colour and clarity versus the plasma TV's but I have seen several projector set ups in show rooms that have showed me and my wife that you can still acheive excellent picture quality with a projector under the right conditions...

Looking for some more advice and opinions please.

Thx

Mad
 
gmichael

gmichael

Audioholic Spartan
The 8700UB is better, but that's why it costs more. It depends on how much your budget is, as far as which would be better for you.
I think that the 106" would be just fine. I have no trouble with reflections with mine.
Trying it out on a blank wall is a great idea. It will help you decide what size looks best to you in your room. A black wall may be a problem though. Maybe a white sheet would help.
 
A

arkight

Junior Audioholic
just put a sheet on the wall if you thikn you need to.
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
The idea of of shooting it against a blank wall is a good idea, does it matter if the wall is black?
Yes, but put a sheet up or something else that is white. Some poster board or something that is brighter.

As for the projector, the two Epson model you quote are the two I was looking at, I just can't decide/understand which is best...
The 8700UB is better.

Contrast ratio is the difference between the deepest blacks and the brightest whites. Typically this is listed as a dynamic number so it isn't truly achievable, but it is still important. Product reviews do a far better job at seeing the real world results so not only read reviews here at Audioholics, but check out Projector Central and Projector Reviews (.com) for the skinny on these models.

So, when you get a projector with deeper blacks, it helps the rest of the colors appear more saturated and accurate. Deep shadow contrast and black levels are important.

It's a number of things really, but when you get a more expensive projector you often get:
Better contrast, better image processing, a better lens, better color management, more accurate colors, better shadow details, a brighter post calibrated image, and better overall build quality.

Sometimes you get some of those things, sometimes you get NONE of those things, which is why reviews are important.

The JVC HD250 is probably the best projector under $3000 right now. Extremely reliable, very good optics, and a bright post calibration image with top shelf real world contrast.

I have never owned nor bought a projector, I always had plasma's, so this venture is totally new to me.
It's a completely different experience, that's for sure.

I know the lumens is the amount of light the projector is capable to throw out and the contrast ration is the " clarity ", I think the amount of pixels used to recreat the image...I think.
Lumens is the max total light output POTENTIAL - with a new lamp and horrible image quality. You have to read reviews to get a better understanding of real world light output, but generally it is about 400-700 lumens on home theater projectors. THX (movie) standards call for about 13-17 lumens per square foot of screen space for good results.

Contrast I described above and has nothing to do with pixels.

Pixel count is the resolution of the projector. It's an absolute. 1920x1080 is the same as 1080p. That's basically the class that most projector buyers should be looking at. Get a 1080p projector. It is sometimes called 'native resolution'. It is the ONLY thing that matters with resolution.

So I am confused as to which is better, higher lumens or higher contrast ratio?
Higher contrast. Contrast ratio, shadow detail, color accuracy, motion handling... they are all the most important things with front projection. Light just needs to be enough to fill your screen adequately, and a 92"-120" is EXACTLY the typical home setup and every single home theater projector on the market can do that size without significant issue.

I will have my projector set up at approximately 14' away form the screen and the lighting in the room will be 100% controlled.
I say this because I always say this...

Don't confuse turning off lights with controlling light.

A projector is a giant flashlight. It's VERY bright, and when that light hits the screen, it reflects throughout your whole room. To properly control light you can't just put up blinds and turn the lights off. You have to do it like theaters do it. Paint the room dark, use dark carpet, and make sure you paint the ceiling as well. Otherwise, you do NOT have 100% control of your lighting. In fact, you have almost no control.

Still, multiple zones of properly placed recessed lighting go a long way to making the room usable for home theater and other usage of the room. I recommend a light about every 4'-5' in the ceiling broken into at least two zones, typically more.

http://www.avintegrated.com/lighting.html

I was very wary about buying any projectors because of the " sacrifice " of colour and clarity versus the plasma TV's but I have seen several projector set ups in show rooms that have showed me and my wife that you can still acheive excellent picture quality with a projector under the right conditions...
Yes, this worries people, yet you go to a movie theater and you are perfectly happy with what you see on screen. The HOME cinema experience is quite often better than most local theaters if you spend some time and money to do it right.

Looking for some more advice and opinions please.
I'm full of them! :D ;)

The things people most often get wrong:
Not ENOUGH lighting in a theater.
Missing the $50 in paint to actually control lighting. (single biggest improvement in quality for the least amount of money!)
Not going with a dark room - floors and ceiling included.
Insistence on a grey screen when then don't need it.
Poor audio setup - sound is at least 50% of the experience.
Putting equipment at the front of the room... DO NOT DO THIS!!!
Thinking that it has to be a dedicated space to achieve all (or almost all) of this.
Listening to your wife nag that she doesn't want to live in a cave. They get the other 99% of the house, grow a set and insist upon a room that is different... A dark room is far more relaxing than a bright room!
Lousy projector mount - a good universal mount will make setup a snap and will never move, but allows for easy install/deinstall as necessary.
To small/large of a screen. Use THX standards and personal experience (not opinion!) to determine the right screen size for you.

CONDUIT IS YOUR FRIEND!
 
Mad-Max

Mad-Max

Audioholic Intern
First of all...Thx BMXTRIX, those were awson answers to some of my basic and repeated questions.

Quote:

The things people most often get wrong:
Not ENOUGH lighting in a theater. Done - 12 pot lights and a full LED strain of lights around the entire ceiling.

Missing the $50 in paint to actually control lighting. (single biggest improvement in quality for the least amount of money!). Done

Not going with a dark room - floors and ceiling included. Done black ceiling, Black and dark blue half walls, black colums. Medium grey carpet and black couches.

Insistence on a grey screen when then don't need it. This one I have not researched at all...I am a total screen " virgin"...:cool:

Poor audio setup - sound is at least 50% of the experience. I will install them all and have it calibrated by the local audio store.

Putting equipment at the front of the room... DO NOT DO THIS!!!...Hmmm, is it bad if I put it at the front but in a seperate room? I have an opening behind the screen of 4' x 13'6" where I have all my conduit running into and store all of my movies, which is access by a small 24" door.

Thinking that it has to be a dedicated space to achieve all (or almost all) of this. Done, we just finished building our house a few months ago, and my wife gave me that space as part of a trade off for her kitchen granite counter tops and full ceramic shower with full dual head and body shower.

Listening to your wife nag that she doesn't want to live in a cave. They get the other 99% of the house, grow a set and insist upon a room that is different... A dark room is far more relaxing than a bright room! Done...I guess I am one of the lucky ones, my wife is behind this theater room 100%.

Lousy projector mount - a good universal mount will make setup a snap and will never move, but allows for easy install/deinstall as necessary. again....braket " virgin "

To small/large of a screen. Use THX standards and personal experience (not opinion!) to determine the right screen size for you. I will try the white sheet trick and see . The reason why I asked if the black made a difference is because I saw a company advertising that " they " had the ebst type of screens and they are black.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1C4S2W4TRM


CONDUIT IS YOUR FRIEND!

This is actually part 2 of flexible conduit...and yes it is me and my French Canadian accent...lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8oGufRxByM

Again, Thx to everyone for all your advice. I would love to post some pics but everytime I try, it fails, maybe I just don't have enough post to access bigger attachments.

Later

Mad
 
J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
Max, please use the QUOTE tags or at least italicize portions you are quoting. It makes it easier to know when it's you responding, or easier to pull out your own statements/questions. Thanks.

Do you have the money for SI? It seems to work great, but the fact of the matter is that ambient light kills contrast, no matter what kind of TV, screen, etc, and it does so at an exponential rate.

If you had a LOT of money, you could go fancy rear projection with something like the Stewart Starglas60. You would need a luxury sports car price tag to pull it off though. :D:eek:



I just changed from a Dalite High Power (good for shedding offaxis ambient light), in favor of Seymour CenterStage XD. It is an improvement every which way I slice it. The fabric cost me $240 (if prebuilt, then it will cost well over a thousand more).

You can see some of the results of my very recently completed project here:
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=767982#post767982
 
Mad-Max

Mad-Max

Audioholic Intern
Max, please use the QUOTE tags or at least italicize portions you are quoting. It makes it easier to know when it's you responding, or easier to pull out your own statements/questions. Thanks.
Learn something everyday...Thx

Any ideas how to attach pictures to a thread?

Mad
 
Mad-Max

Mad-Max

Audioholic Intern
Max, please use the QUOTE tags or at least italicize portions you are quoting. It makes it easier to know when it's you responding, or easier to pull out your own statements/questions. Thanks.
Learn something everyday...just need to figure out how to quote the name of the writer...

Any ideas on how to attach pictures to a thread?

Thx

Mad
 
just-some-guy

just-some-guy

Audioholic Field Marshall
Any ideas on how to attach pictures to a thread?
you need more posts, idk how many. but its not a lot.

then click "post reply". a little below where you type your text, there is a "manage attachments". click that and load your pic/s.
 
just-some-guy

just-some-guy

Audioholic Field Marshall
could be the pic is too large. or, i have had pics that just would not load, for what reason i do not know.
 
AVRat

AVRat

Audioholic Ninja
You didn't mention your viewing distances, but I might push the size to 110".

Load your pictures to on-line service (Photo Bucket, Flickr, etc) then use image tags to show up in posts.
 
Mad-Max

Mad-Max

Audioholic Intern
I was aiming for about 14' viewing distance.

BUT NOW....I may have to put my HT project on hold, The Revenue Canada Agency( IRS) have decide to re assess my last filling and say that I owe them 4300.00$.....there goes my HT project for now....damm goverment, I even file with an accountant...the accountant should have to pay the difference if the're actually is an error....

http://s1228.photobucket.com/albums/ee446/Tyttus/?albumview=slideshow
Sorry the photos are not in order...don't know why but they are...lol
 
D

deedubb

Full Audioholic
Have you considered a 2.35:1 screen? You can go wider without having to have a lot of height and the experience is incredible. I'll never do 16x9 again.
 

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