Is it time for an upgrade?

AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
You gotta catch PENG when you can. He's kind of been a rarity on the AH. He is very knowledgeable, he is a retired Engineer.
I don't know how I would feel if you were to one day say, "That Andrew is a RETIRED Pharmacist". :eek: :( :D

Should never retire, right? :D
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
The only 'feature' I would definitely like is an additional set of heights - I do enjoy Atmos (even with bouncy-house heights) and another set in the rear would, I assume, be even better. More power wouldn't hurt, either. These Monolith speakers seem to require quite a bit more power than my old Infinitys.
Yep, they are all 4 Ohm and sensitivity is not low, but not high either, so they will likely enjoy plenty of power.

I wish I had purchased a receiver with pre-outs - it's a lot easier to upgrade a piece at a time. If separates were on the table I was thinking just a 3 (maybe 5) channel to run the mains.
I went this route first, had a Marantz next to top tier model but I had all 4 Ohm speakers at that time and I could hear it compress at higher SPL so I added the amp. That made a big difference. When the AVR was about 10, I replaced it with a prepro, but could have just as easily gone with an AVR. At the time, I got the Pre for less than a flagship AVR though, when multiple companies were trying to do separates, but most seem to have given that up.
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
Yep, they are all 4 Ohm and sensitivity is not low, but not high either, so they will likely enjoy plenty of power.

I went this route first, had a Marantz next to top tier model but I had all 4 Ohm speakers at that time and I could hear it compress at higher SPL so I added the amp. That made a big difference. When the AVR was about 10, I replaced it with a prepro, but could have just as easily gone with an AVR. At the time, I got the Pre for less than a flagship AVR though, when multiple companies were trying to do separates, but most seem to have given that up.
Way back I did something similar with a mid-tier Denon AVR and added an amp. I've only used AVRs since that setup and the amp sits unused in the basement. Its a shame, I liked the Kinergetics Research Chiro but it is too big for my cabinet.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Way back I did something similar with a mid-tier Denon AVR and added an amp. I've only used AVRs since that setup and the amp sits unused in the basement. Its a shame, I liked the Kinergetics Research Chiro but it is too big for my cabinet.
I went to the amp because my speakers were 4 Ohm then. Now they are all 8 again and I don't really need as much power as before and my room isn't as big as previous, but since I went prepro, that's just how it is now.
 
Replicant 7

Replicant 7

Audioholic Samurai
I don't know how I would feel if you were to one day say, "That Andrew is a RETIRED Pharmacist". :eek: :( :D

Should never retire, right? :D
LMAO!! You guy's!!! Lolo knuckleheads.. lolo.
Edited: can't say your a retired Engineer, even though you do have two bachelor's of science degrees. Because you do use both..One for Medical the other for AudioRx. Nope, most pharmacies I know they never retire. They live very long life's. 90..100 ..150 year easily.
 
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cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
I went to the amp because my speakers were 4 Ohm then. Now they are all 8 again and I don't really need as much power as before and my room isn't as big as previous, but since I went prepro, that's just how it is now.

I could squeeze a Monolith 3x200 or three Outlaw Audio 2220s in my cabinet but that doesn't leave a lot of dollars for an AVR or Pre-processor....
 
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AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I could squeeze a Monolith 3x200 or three Outlaw Audio 2220s in my cabinet but that doesn't leave a lot of dollars for an AVR or Pre-processor....
My feeling is, either just get a nice powerful flagship AVR and use it without an amp or just do all separates pre-pro + amp.

For example, in my HT room, I use a pre-pro + amp, but in my living room I just use a flagship AVR.
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
My feeling is, either just get a nice powerful flagship AVR and use it without an amp or just do all separates pre-pro + amp.

For example, in my HT room, I use a pre-pro + amp, but in my living room I just use a flagship AVR.
I'm assuming the AVR-3700H does not fit the bill as a 'flagship'?

In fact, the Onkyo is rated at 110w @ 8 ohms vs. the 3700 @ 105w...
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I'm assuming the AVR-3700H does not fit the bill as a 'flagship'?

In fact, the Onkyo is rated at 110w @ 8 ohms vs. the 3700 @ 105w...
Flagship would be like Denon X6700 and X8500 or Yamaha RX-A6A and RX-A8A.
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
Flagship would be like Denon X6700 and X8500 or Yamaha RX-A6A and RX-A8A.

I cannot forsee ever needing 11 channels (due to the room layout). If I went with the X4700H over the X6700H I would be give up some power but also have $1200 to put towards an amp (if I feel it is needed). Are there any other major difference between these two?
 
Verdinut

Verdinut

Audioholic Ninja
I'm assuming the AVR-3700H does not fit the bill as a 'flagship'?

In fact, the Onkyo is rated at 110w @ 8 ohms vs. the 3700 @ 105w...
It's not necessarily the power rating per channel that designates whether a product is a flagship model. The flagship classification is based on a multitude of features contained in a product.
For example, the Denon X3700 has a power rating of 105 watt/ch. The X6700 has a rating of of 140 watt/ch which is less than 2 dB more powerful, a really negligible difference in loudness possibility which shouldn't be the main decisive factor for buying one.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I cannot forsee ever needing 11 channels (due to the room layout). If I went with the X4700H over the X6700H I would be give up some power but also have $1200 to put towards an amp (if I feel it is needed). Are there any other major difference between these two?
Are there any sound differences? No.

It depends on how your brain is programmed. Buy 2 “cheaper” non-flagship components (AVR + amp) or one flagship component.

Based on my experience, most people don’t require that much power, so a single AVR will usually do just fine.

IMO, it’s usually not about power requirement for most people (unless they are hard of hearing). It’s about other things.

My bad-robot brain is programmed for either a SINGLE COMPONENT Flagship AVR (like Yamaha RX-A8A) or a pre-pro (like Yamaha CX-A) + amp (like Yamaha MX-A or ATI amp), not an AVR + amp.

IOW, if I am buying an AVR, I’m not planning on buying an amp.

So just depends on how your brain is programmed.
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
Thank you - I misunderstood the rationale for purchasing a flagship AVR. I am leaning towards the X3700H and adding a 2-3 channel amplifier (if needed) for music.
 
Teetertotter?

Teetertotter?

Full Audioholic
@cbecker33, I believe your current Onkyo came out in 2017. I change out my Denon every 5 years, due to possible new improved engineering and design. I recommend you go with Denon.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I'm assuming the AVR-3700H does not fit the bill as a 'flagship'?

In fact, the Onkyo is rated at 110w @ 8 ohms vs. the 3700 @ 105w...
105, 110, 150 W makes little difference. To our human ears (think log scale characteristics), going from 100 W to 150 W will get you 1.76 dB, that would be about 3 clicks on the X3700H's volume dial.

from 100 W to:
110 W.................. 0.414 dB (less than 1 click on volume)
120 W.................. 0.8 dB (less than 2 clicks)
130 W.................. 1.14 dB

so there won't be noticeable difference between 100 and 130 W but the bigger amps usually have larger power supplies and heat sinks, that could help in driving more demanding loads.

Also, when comparing power output you can't just look at the rated output in watts, but also the load conditions (e.g. the impedance of the test load), distortions, frequency dependence, and damping factor etc.
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
....

so there won't be noticeable difference between 100 and 130 W but the bigger amps usually have larger power supplies and heat sinks, that could help in driving more demanding loads.

Also, when comparing power output you can't just look at the rated output in watts, but also the load conditions (e.g. the impedance of the test load), distortions, frequency dependence, and damping factor etc.
This is far beyond my understanding but would you consider the Monolith's to be a 'demanding load' when running all channel stereo at loud volumes (I know this is relative term). I do prefer my music (mostly EDM) at high levels when having a 'dance party'.
 
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