Is it time for an upgrade?

cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
My setup:

Receiver​
Speakers​
Monoprice THX-465T Front & Heights​
Subwoofers​
I recently upgraded all of my speakers (including subwoofers) but not my receiver. I watch TV/movies approximately 80% of the time while listening to music (via Spotify connect) 20% of the time.

I am contemplating replacing the Onkyo with a Denon AVR-X3700H due to trouble I've been having lately streaming music. For whatever reason I have had issues with Spotify randomly stopping/failing to start (from multiple devices) recently. The app appears to be playing but I have no sound. If I rewind the track 10 secs it resumes working. I also tried SoundCloud via Google Cast but it was even worse. All firmware/software are updated. Another reason to upgrade would be to take advantage of the built-in heights on both my front and rear speaker (the Onkyo only has one set of heights).

My reading has led me to the X3700H but am open to suggestions (including separates) under $2k.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Well, I can't guarantee you won't have issues with BT/streaming, but I would upgrade to it for the MultiEQ XT32 for sure. I had a few other pre/pros and the MultiEQ XT32 really has done the best baseline calibration for me so far. It should support calibration of dual subs as well I believe I saw. Dual sub is listed for my AV7705, would expect the Denon may have it as well.
 
witchdoctor

witchdoctor

Full Audioholic
My setup:

Receiver​
Speakers​
Monoprice THX-465T Front & Heights​
Subwoofers​
I recently upgraded all of my speakers (including subwoofers) but not my receiver. I watch TV/movies approximately 80% of the time while listening to music (via Spotify connect) 20% of the time.

I am contemplating replacing the Onkyo with a Denon AVR-X3700H due to trouble I've been having lately streaming music. For whatever reason I have had issues with Spotify randomly stopping/failing to start (from multiple devices) recently. The app appears to be playing but I have no sound. If I rewind the track 10 secs it resumes working. I also tried SoundCloud via Google Cast but it was even worse. All firmware/software are updated. Another reason to upgrade would be to take advantage of the built-in heights on both my front and rear speaker (the Onkyo only has one set of heights).

My reading has led me to the X3700H but am open to suggestions (including separates) under $2k.
How big is your room? A separate streamer is a lot less expensive than a new receiver if that is the primary issue. 4 height channels make sense if you watch a lot of movies and the room is big enough.
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
How big is your room? A separate streamer is a lot less expensive than a new receiver if that is the primary issue. 4 height channels make sense if you watch a lot of movies and the room is big enough.
It is the entire front third of my open concept first floor - rears are 11' foot from the listening/watching position and the fronts are 9' away (10ft ceilings).
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Sounds big enough. How does it sound with the front heights only right now? I currently only have front heights in my setup too and I don't mind it. I would have to make room for another amp to add rears.
 
BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Overlord
My 2c - instead of upgrading your AVR, upgrade your media client to Nvidia ShieldTV.
Signed,
Proud owner of ancient but still working fine Onkyo TX-SR805
 
witchdoctor

witchdoctor

Full Audioholic
It is the entire front third of my open concept first floor - rears are 11' foot from the listening/watching position and the fronts are 9' away (10ft ceilings).
So try an Amazon Firestick, an Nvidia Shield, or a Roku. They all have music services. I would try something like that before dishing out for a new receiver. If you are going for a receiver I would go into beast mode so you won't need to upgrade again for around 5 years and it will be a significant step up.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
So try an Amazon Firestick, an Nvidia Shield, or a Roku. They all have music services. I would try something like that before dishing out for a new receiver. If you are going for a receiver I would go into beast mode so you won't need to upgrade again for around 5 years and it will be a significant step up.
Beastmode doesn't really work with AVRs. They are out of date within 2 usually. That depends if you need the new features though. I think things are pretty stable right now with not a ton of new features coming out, so it should be safe to go with a decent one. His current AVR looks to be from 2016, but the question did not seem to be about features.

Separates under 2K not going to happen unless they're used.
 
witchdoctor

witchdoctor

Full Audioholic
OK, "pitbull" mode then :) The new receivers with 8K switching are coming down in price, you may not ever need 8K but "just in case":

 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
So try an Amazon Firestick, an Nvidia Shield, or a Roku. They all have music services. I would try something like that before dishing out for a new receiver. If you are going for a receiver I would go into beast mode so you won't need to upgrade again for around 5 years and it will be a significant step up.
Funny thing - I do have a Roku and forgot I had Spotify on it. This worked and without the odd behavior of the Spotify to Onkyo connection. Unfortunately Roku does not have a SoundCloud app (and the Musicloud app is not good).
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
Beastmode doesn't really work with AVRs. They are out of date within 2 usually. That depends if you need the new features though. I think things are pretty stable right now with not a ton of new features coming out, so it should be safe to go with a decent one. His current AVR looks to be from 2016, but the question did not seem to be about features.
The only 'feature' I would definitely like is an additional set of heights - I do enjoy Atmos (even with bouncy-house heights) and another set in the rear would, I assume, be even better. More power wouldn't hurt, either. These Monolith speakers seem to require quite a bit more power than my old Infinitys.

Separates under 2K not going to happen unless they're used.
I wish I had purchased a receiver with pre-outs - it's a lot easier to upgrade a piece at a time. If separates were on the table I was thinking just a 3 (maybe 5) channel to run the mains.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
My reading has led me to the X3700H but am open to suggestions (including separates) under $2k.
The X3700H really is tough to beat for the price even though it was listed for at least $400 less at launch time but that was before the supply chain issue and inflation set in. It has Audyssey XT32 that can do a good job integrating the subs with the mains, saving you time and manually trying to do it manually.

Because of the much increased price, if you can wait, then wait till the end of the year to see what happens with inflation (seems to start levelling or even trending down) and potential improvements that the succeeding model may offer.

If you are not interested in room correction, then Yamaha (such as the RX-A6A) is a great alternative to consider.

The so called "separate" is hardly separate as practically speaking they basically skip the power amps and add balanced outputs that make you feel good but no benefits unless your interconnect cables are very long such as more than 10-15 feet.
 
cbecker33

cbecker33

Audioholic
OK, "pitbull" mode then :) The new receivers with 8K switching are coming down in price, you may not ever need 8K but "just in case":

The AVR-X3700H is on that list.
 
Replicant 7

Replicant 7

Audioholic Samurai
The X3700H really is tough to beat for the price even though it was listed for at least $400 less at launch time but that was before the supply chain issue and inflation set in. It has Audyssey XT32 that can do a good job integrating the subs with the mains, saving you time and manually trying to do it manually.

Because of the much increased price, if you can wait, then wait till the end of the year to see what happens with inflation (seems to start levelling or even trending down) and potential improvements that the succeeding model may offer.

If you are not interested in room correction, then Yamaha (such as the RX-A6A) is a great alternative to consider.
@PENG Don't know if I'd go with the Yamaha RX-A6A. Not after Gene's test results. I'm experiencing some glitchy issues with my RX-A4A mostly HDMI, which I'm trying to isolate. I believe it is a CEC issue with my Hisense 65 U6G 4K. Also a web radio issue with my Yamaha RX-A4A. A couple maybe three will drop out randomly and the screen, OSD will pop up on the TV, back to just radio favorites and I got to go back and click back on the station. Does it intermittently and I believe it is also a CEC issue. I've disabled the HDMI link control on the Hisense TV and it seems to have stabilized internet radio of my AVR, stations aren't dropping out anymore weird huh? I know. I'm about to run optical audio out from the TV to the AVR and disabled all HDMI completely see what happens. I remember having that issue with my Vizio 65 4K and it did exactly that with my Yamaha RX-A1080. But not with internet radio streaming. Thing about that, you gotta use all your remotes for each device source with a optical out from TV, well not all of um. But back to OP post, I'd just go with the Denon 3700H that is a solid proven AVR. I do regret at least not giving Denon a shot last year when I went did a sit down look see listening session. About a half an hour, on the 4700H at BestBuy's Magnolia department. It was my 1st choice, ask Andrew, we talked about it he even recommend the 4700H to me over Yamaha RX-A4A. Andrew couldn't get me a good deal on the Denon like he did the Yamaha RX-A4A. But of course Andrew did rub it in on me, of reliability, longevity and service after the sale with Yamaha. Always trade offs with this hobby.

Oh one last thing, before I disabled HDMI link control of the Hisense TV, I'd use the TV remote to shut down everything. AVR would clicked back on like a second later doesn't do that anymore since I disabled HDMI link control of the TV. So that's why I believe it's a CEC issue of the Hisense TV.
 
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P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
@PENG Don't know if I'd go with the Yamaha RX-A6A. Not after Gene's test results. I'm experiencing some glitchy issues with my RX-A4A mostly HDMI, which I'm trying to isolate. I believe it is a CEC issue with my Hisense 65 U6G 4K. Also a web radio issue with my Yamaha RX-A4A. A couple maybe three will drop out randomly and the screen, OSD will pop up on the TV, back to just radio favorites and I got to go back and click back on the station. Does it intermittently and I believe it is also a CEC issue. I've disabled the HDMI link control on the Hisense TV and it seems to have stabilized internet radio of my AVR, stations aren't dropping out anymore weird huh? I know. I'm about to run optical audio out from the TV to the AVR and disabled all HDMI completely see what happens. I remember having that issue with my Vizio 65 4K and it did exactly that with my Yamaha RX-A1080. But not with internet radio streaming. Thing about that, you gotta use all your remotes for each device source with a optical out from TV, well not all of um. But back to OP post, I'd just go with the Denon 3700H that is a solid proven AVR. I do regret at least not giving Denon a shot last year when I went did a sit down look see listening session. About a half an hour, on the 4700H at BestBuy's Magnolia department. It was my 1st choice, ask Andrew, we talked about it he even recommend the 4700H to me over Yamaha RX-A4A. Andrew couldn't get me a good deal on the Denon like he did the Yamaha RX-A4A. But of course Andrew did rub it in on me, of reliability, longevity and service after the sale with Yamaha. Always trade offs with this hobby.

Oh one last thing, before I disabled HDMI link control of the Hisense TV, I'd use the TV remote to shut down everything. AVR would clicked back on like a second later doesn't do that anymore since I disabled HDMI link control of the TV. So that's why I believe it's a CEC issue of the Hisense TV.
Thank you for the useful information. That's surprising as if I remember right, Yamaha tended to do more rigorous testing on HDMI related performance than others. Time for @M Code to chime in and shed some light on this. May be he can try to gather more updated info for us too on the RX-AXA, RX-VXA series reliability record (just in general), that may be tough to get though as those units probably has not been out long enough to establish any meaningful records.
 
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Replicant 7

Replicant 7

Audioholic Samurai
Thanking for the useful information. That's surprising as if I remember right, Yamaha tended to do more rigorous testing on HDMI related performance than others. Time for @M Code to chime in and shed some light on this. May be he can try to gather more updated info for us too on the RX-AXA, RX-VXA series reliability record (just in general), that may be tough to get though as those units probably has not been out long enough to establish any meaningful records.
You gotta check out @Trebdp83 post on HDMI bandwidth he has become a guru in my opinion. He's been doing some very interesting analysis of HDMI bandwidth, gaming stations, 4K TV's, that umm from his findings which are credible and factual he's got the numbers to back up his facts. Dudes work is impressive. Not saying he's on your or Gene's level with engineering and all.
No they haven't been out long enough. But I do remember a lot where being returned of the V6A/700 with a ton of issues. I had the V6A, I give that unit to my Son to give to his son. Yeah ton of HDMI/CEC issues.

Edit: Your on to something, Dam! Thanks for bringing that up, vetting HDMI that Yamaha it's supposed to be king at. Up until Yamaha unlocked all the HDMI's with the last update. My RX-A4A didn't have the issues I'm experiencing now. Seems like Yamaha hasn't worked out their HDMI issues yet, because my A1080 had those issues I'm dealing with now on my RX-A4A. F..kin Yamaha! Unlock the HDMI ports and used the same dam firmware from the older line! upgraded chip for more bandwidth already in the new line was all that was gained. :mad: The gaming guys got the latest greatest, but us who are not gamers are still stuck with issues we had with older models. :mad:

Edit: I'm really pissed off PENG, I do remember now, on the Yamaha thread I stated that I wasn't having any HDMI issues and or CEC issues. Up until Yamaha unlock all of the HDMI ports on my RX-A4A thats when all those HDMI issues I'm having again started cropping back up. Alone with 4K upscale also, that absolutely with conflict with a 4K TV. :mad: it's not my 4K TV, it is on Yamahas side of the HDMI issues. I have to state: Buyers beware of Yamahas HDMI issues. Just buy Denon or Marantz or something else, stay away from Yamaha for now if you want a AVR that has no HDMI issues.
 
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T

Trebdp83

Audioholic Ninja
The Denon X3700H is nice machine. I have used various Denons since the mid 90's and just like them. But, an Onkyo caught my eye a few years ago as it offered what I was looking for at the time for a very good price as it was an open box item. I've purchased two more Onkyo models since then and have been pleased.

If one is familiar with Onkyos from the last few years, they can adapt to a Denon more easily than a Yamaha. That's not to put any one of them down but Denon and Onkyo have display and setting similarities compared to Yamaha. Each also have features exclusive to their brand.

Spotify cut support to the built in apps on Onkyos awhile back and one has to use another device to cast it to their Onkyo these days. I wish Onkyo had Qobuz built in it. Luckily, Apple still offers the Onkyo Play-Fi app on my Mac mini M1 and it supports Qobuz. So, I use it to stream Qobuz whenever I use it and it supports hi-res over the network.

If one wants 9.1 processing and power for a 5.1.4 configuration, they can opt for the Onkyo TX-NR7100 and save a bit. If they want 11.1 processing and pre outs for the two non powered channels in a 7.1.4 configuration, they can opt for the Onkyo RZ50 or the Denon X3700H. Both Onkyo models are equipped with Dirac.
 
Replicant 7

Replicant 7

Audioholic Samurai
Well, this thread is heading off the rails.....
You gotta catch PENG when you can. He's kind of been a rarity on the AH. He is very knowledgeable, he is a retired Engineer. My post wasn't to derail your thread. If you read my post, your trying to decide which AVR your wanting. I recommend the 3700H. It is a solid AVR. I do apologize for being long-winded with it my post was AVR related.
 
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witchdoctor

witchdoctor

Full Audioholic
I have an Onkyo RZ630 9 channel receiver configured in 5.1.4 going in the mancave, it never disappoints.
 

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