How would I know if my AVR can drive floorstanders?

[Alex2507]

Follow-up question on this post. Is there any amplifier near the $200 range that will power the P362s marginally better and enable me to use the speakers' large capabilities

Sorry to tell you that the 362's do not have large capabilities. There is a thread around here somewhere regarding speaker size (Lg or Sm), would somebody post a link to it?

Here's an article that touches on the size issue:

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/get-good-bass/bass-management-basics-2013-settings-made-simple

Where is MinusTheBear when you need him?

 

[blued888]

Sorry to tell you that the 362's do not have large capabilities. There is a thread around here somewhere regarding speaker size (Lg or Sm), would somebody post a link to it?

Here's an article that touches on the size issue:

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/get-good-bass/bass-management-basics-2013-settings-made-simple

Where is MinusTheBear when you need him?

Alright, noted. Will be setting them to small no matter what.

I'm just wary of the phrase you quoted from Stereophile saying (The combination of 5.2 ohms and –45º phase angle at 93Hz will tax amplifiers rated at 8 ohms.)

 

[Alex2507]

Alright, noted. Will be setting them to small no matter what.

I'm just wary of the phrase you quoted from Stereophile saying (The combination of 5.2 ohms and –45º phase angle at 93Hz will tax amplifiers rated at 8 ohms.)

IIRC your receiver's amps will do 4,6 and 8 ohms. You're already good to go. Over the weekend I hooked my 360's up to a 2 channel amp being run off of my receiver's pre outs. Today I started the calibration process. I think it sounds great but I thought it sounded great before. The fan on the 2 channel amp is a pain. I really only did all that so that I could amplify an equalized signal for the L&R channels. I'm just playing around with equipment that I got from friends who weren't using it.

Back to the point. Around here I have seen a lot of people going for the Behringer EP2500 because they will never need more amp ... ever.

Here's their line up but I'm not sure if these are the best prices:

http://www.partsexpress.com/webpage.cfm?WebPage_ID=3&searchHeader=1&manufacturer=315 &sm=1 &CAT_ID=46 &ObjectGroup_ID=330

The A500 seems to fit your needs and budget. You just have to have a rec'r that has pre-outs. Did you already get the speakers? If it were me I would have those speakers hooked up to the rec'r mentioned in post# 1 and be good until I could get a rec'r with HDMI, pre outs and whatever other features I wanted (Yammy 663 ). Then comes external amplification (EP 2500 ) and equalization ( DSP 2496 ). But that's my audio fantasy.

 

[blued888]

A power amp really isn't an option now as my receiver doesn't have the necessary pre-outs. It only has a pre-out for the subwoofer. Thanks!

 

[mazersteven]

A power amp really isn't an option now as my receiver doesn't have the necessary pre-outs. It only has a pre-out for the subwoofer. Thanks!

Perfect excuse for an "Up-Grade".

Now your thinking like an Audioholic.

 

[blued888]

Perfect excuse for an "Up-Grade".

Now your thinking like an Audioholic.

I'd love to but my budget's pretty maxed out right now for the speakers and the subwoofer. Those'll have to wait.

 

[blued888]

I guess my receiver would be able to drive the Infinity Primus after all. I've connected a pair of 4 ohm Nominal Impedance JBL Control 5 Monitor Speakers (http://www2.jblpro.com/catalog/general/Product.aspx?PId=196&MId=5) and they sounded great to me without distortion.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

I guess my receiver would be able to drive the Infinity Primus after all.

There was never any doubt. As I mentioned earlier, the Primus line was designed for use with entry-level receivers. They present a very easy load (high efficiency and no major impedance dips.)

 

[allargon]

Sorry to tell you that the 362's do not have large capabilities. There is a thread around here somewhere regarding speaker size (Lg or Sm), would somebody post a link to it?

Here's an article that touches on the size issue:

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/get-good-bass/bass-management-basics-2013-settings-made-simple

I swear...this forum at times is waaaaaay too HT (specifically action and sci-fi) centric. For most music, the 362's perform just fine set to large. Even with hip-hop, the woofers of the 362's won't blow or break. I do agree for HT, they should be set to small and 80, but for music there's nothing wrong with taking them down to 40. I don't have a sub, yet. They work just fine with my Blu-Ray or AVR remixing surround stuff (opposite of Dolby Pro-Logic? ) to stereo. Of course, stereo music is well...played in stereo.

Follow-up question on this post. Is there any amplifier near the $200 range that will power the P362s marginally better and enable me to use the speakers' large capabilities (i.e. for the bass extension)? Would one of the following be a significant improvement over my current receiver?

Honestly, I think your current receiver is fine. However, if you want to make sure that it doesn't run out of gas (ignore the pre-out stuff), check out the AudioSource AMP300. Althought it lists for $300, it is often on sale at various Fry's Electronics every other weekend or so for $150+tax.

(I'm spending that $150 on a subwoofer amp.)

 

[voltainthesky]

I am highly considering getting a pair of Infinity P162's for my bedroom... but the receiver I have is a entry level Onkyo TX-SR506... it's rated at 75w/ch at 8ohms... how would I know if my receiver would be capable of running them, seeings as they have quite significant impedance dips?

 

[TLS Guy]

Uhm, so overall my amp should pretty much still take it okay, right? I have a switch in the back for impedance selection. It's either 8 ohms for main/center/surrounds or main = 4 ohms / center = 6 ohms / surrounds = 6 ohms.

I should be selecting all 8 ohms when I get my speakers because that is their nominal impedance, correct?

I don't want to get $525 for a pair of floorstanders and fry them in the long run. I plan to change the AVR sometime in the future and possibly add an external power amplifier but that might be in 2 to 3 years time because the external power amplifier alone would cost a great bit of money.

Btw, someone told me that it is better to have a more powerful amplifier than having an underpowered amplifier. That means too little power would damage the speakers along the way. Is that true?

As I have often stated, nominal impedance means absolutely nothing. If a speaker has two bass drivers it is effectively a four ohm speaker far more likely than not, and the speakers you are considering are no exception.

The phase angles are adverse. The crossovers are fourth order with a large component count, which adds to the drive difficulty. If you play the speakers softly, you will get away with it. However I hate to admit, that the salesman is basically right, and those speakers need amps very comfortable with four ohm loads, if they are to be driven to their capability.

 

[voltainthesky]

So your saying I need something stronger than a Onkyo TX-SR506 to run them loud?

 

[mike c]

So your saying I need something stronger than a Onkyo TX-SR506 to run them loud?

you'll be fine.

he's talking to the OP with the floorstanders.

i've run floorstanders with dual 8's 'large' with no sub with an 85wpc receiver in a 3k cubic foot room 2.5meters away from listening position - id go deaf before i used up all that power.

 

[3db]

Cosine 45 degree=0.707
Cosine 30 degree=0.866

So at 45 degree, the power factor=0.707, meaning for every 1W required by the speaker, the amp has to deliver 1/0.707=1.414VA. Any 6 or 4 ohm speakers, combine with this kind of power factor will likely be hard to drive unless the tough phase angles and low impedance dips coincide with the less power demanding higher frequencies.

That being said, I doubt you will find too many speakers with this kind of phase angle. I have never see a graph of any speakers that shows 45 degree or higher, regardless of frequencies. That does not mean such speakers do not exist though. (Edit: Thanks to Alex, I have now seen one such speaker, the Infinity Primus 360 )

Agreed but even then you may not be in trouble. You forgot to mention where in the frequency curve this dip occurs. If its in the midrange, the receiver should be OK. If this dip occurs near or in the bass region, the receiver will have its work cut out for it. The phase angle measurment must be accompanied by the frequency at which it occurs to make it truly meaningful.

My PSBs are nominally rated at 6 ohms and I don't where the dip is or how low the impedance drops. I have a Technics SA930 receiver driving them and it'll comfortable drive them into the high 80dbs without any audable strain. Mind you the room is smallish. about 12' x 24' but the llistening position is within 7' to 8' of the speakers.


To Mr Volta, I think that the Onkyou should pose very little problem driving them as long as teh room is small to medium size.