"Home theater" speakers vs "musical" speakers

TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
I think you might be misunderstanding a bit (or else I am). I don't think TLS Guy is advocating towers and ditching a sub; he's advocating a speaker that can deliver 80Hz on up with authority, and you're not going to find that in a small bookshelf speaker with a single 5.25" mid-woofer. I mean, consider the E55ti vs the E5Bi: down low you've got 3-6.5" woofers per side versus a single 5.25" woofer. Even with both crossed to a subwoofer at 80Hz, it's pretty clear which is going to deliver a more exciting HT experience. You could say its an unfair comparison given the price difference, but you'd still see the same thing if you popped in a pair of Ascend Sierra 1s in place of the E5Bi.
What gave you that idea? I was advocating no such thing. I was again pointing out the fallacy of the common view point on these forums, that the sub does all the work. That is just not the case. The spl contributed to the total sound field by the subh is very small compared to the front three speakers.

Just because I have actually built a true pair of full range speakers that have a prodigious clean bass output, that also capture the LFE output, does not mean that I think everybody should. That makes for a very complex piece of engineering, and would be prohibitively expensive to produce. However having a truly integrated full range sound source really is something to behold. There is no other speaker system in the world I'm aware of that is configured like mine. I'm not about to suggest that system is for all. However I really enjoy it, and to me the effort was worth it.

I use subs in my downstairs system.

I will say this though, excluding HT, if I had to choose a better set of speakers with a good response to the 40 to 50 Hz range and no sub and lesser speakers and a sub, I would go for the better speakers every time.
 
ImcLoud

ImcLoud

Audioholic Ninja
I like a good 3.1 too, but IMO even a cheap pair if tiny surrounds is better than none, I like when I hear the surrounds fire and not that they distract you but they bring your attention to what is happening off to the sides or rear of the action...
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
So I went to the HTD office yesterday. All I can say is based on the way I was treated, I would buy from them without hesitation. I talked with one of their guys for half an hour before I listened to anything. I had forgotten the pricing for their speakers, so when I actually did listen I was floored by how good they sounded for such a low priced speaker. I haven't had the ability to listen to higher quality speakers in a while, but over the years I've sold over 13 different brands of speakers I was around every day all day. Those include Adam audio, dynaudio, KEF, and the rest of the usual suspects, so I'd like to think I know a good speaker when I hear one (which is why I have to get new ones, mine just aren't good enough anymore). I'm definitely not in the same league as most of you when it comes to my ears, but it doesn't take long for me to recognize when something sounds good.

So, here's what I noticed when comparing the level two to the level three: The ribbon in the level three adds another dimension to the sound. What I mean by this is when listening to the test material you could easily tell which instruments (triangle in particular) were closer to the mic in the studio. I haven't listened to too many speakers that are capable of that without breaking the bank. The level two sounded great, but did not have that extra dimension the level three's had. When he first turned on the system and the level two towers were the only ones playing I would have sworn he had turned on multichannel or something because the soundstage was so huge. It wasn't until I turned an ear toward the speakers that I could tell it was in fact two channel (he noticed and pointed it out too). The funny thing about that is the room wasn't a good room. No treatments, random open areas, and lots of flat surfaces. Didn't matter, they sounded great.

I've auditioned and listened to many, many speakers over the years and one of the first things I do when I listen is try to decide if what I'm hearing is worth the money. An example is when I auditioned the Dali's that were ~$25k per pair I came away with a "that's it?" feeling. Don't get me wrong, they sounded good, but not $25k good. The B&W 800 sounded WAY better to my ears and IIRC don't cost $25k. When I heard both sets of towers and bookshelf's I remember thinking that their pricing didn't sound correct for how good those speakers sound. All of them. It's really hard to believe that a $400 set of speakers ($360 on sale right now) sound that good. Don't get me wrong, I've heard more $400 sets of speakers than I can remember, and NONE of them ever sounded good enough for me to not think I was getting ripped off. These would make me feel like I stole them.

The guy also happened to have a few level two and three cabinets, drivers, and crossovers on his desk so I got to see every piece of the speakers. Good cabinet construction, solid looking crossovers, and high quality drivers. Very nice. Didn't expect to be able to see all of that.

I'll say this, as good of a deal as the Pioneer's seem to be, they have a hard battle to win now. I don't see how they could even begin to compete with these. I realize they are half the price, but I've taken 6 years to buy speakers so I'll pay extra to get more. He even said that if I wanted I could bring any speaker with me to do a side by side. I think that what impressed me the most is not once did he ever try to sell me a speaker. He was just as passionate about everything we are. Excited to show someone their products. It was refreshing. Too bad not everyone has that level of customer service.

Now, on to more auditions.
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Slumlord
A good speaker is a good speaker and will perform duties for music and HT equally well. I would shy away from speaker companies that advocate one use over the other..ie music over HT or visa versa. That's just tells me that there are too many design compromises at play. The issue of full range speakers versus speaker/sub combination is an entirely different animal all together. Speaker/sub systems may have been spawned from HT applications initially but so what. If designed competently, sub/speaker combos should play equally well in either application. The other incorrect assertion I saw in this thread is a multiple 5.25 driver speaker verses a single 5.25" speaker. This again has nothing to do HT verses music but has everything to do with room size and desired loudness levels. Just my opinion.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
A good speaker is a good speaker and will perform duties for music and HT equally well.
That's been covered :)

The other incorrect assertion I saw in this thread is a multiple 5.25 driver speaker verses a single 5.25" speaker. This again has nothing to do HT verses music but has everything to do with room size and desired loudness levels. Just my opinion.
The comments were not saying that had anything to do with music or movies, it was regarding output only.
 
J

James Sokol

Audiophyte
Very nice of you. Thanks. I'm in DFW so not too terribly far.

I do agree the only real way to tell is auditioning in the room they will live in. Only way to do it correctly, you never know how they will sound until you get them in-room.

I think you guys have given me a good strategy. I'm going to audition some and decide on the front 3. Once I make my decision and am happy with it (I will be, almost anything is better than what I have) I'll grab the surround speakers after that point.

You guys have been very helpful, and I'm glad to know my head was somewhat in the right place. I'll probably go to BB after work today to check out the pioneers.
If you're in D/FW, i recommend you take a look at the Infinity Primus 363s from Fry's. The Irving store is much cleaner, but I got mine from the Arlington store. They had them in store last weekend for $117 each (Irving).
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
If you're in D/FW, i recommend you take a look at the Infinity Primus 363s from Fry's. The Irving store is much cleaner, but I got mine from the Arlington store. They had them in store last weekend for $117 each (Irving).
The Pioneers previously discussed here and in other threads are already a few bucks less than that at $100/ea. (though the P363s were previously $99/ea at Frys) By all accounts, the Infinitys don't quite stack up. I have the P163s and BS22s, and the P163s are the ones that are back in their boxes.
 
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