Home networking PC & AV gear

[MACCA350]

Here's what I have connected:

Cable modem----->Linksys WRT54GP2

Linksys WRT54GP2------>Main PC
Linksys WRT54GP2------>VOIP house phone
Linksys WRT54GP2------>HTPC in lounge room

Now I'm looking at getting a XBox 360, so I'll need a second connection in the lounge room. Instead of running a second cable from the Linksys WRT54GP2 to the lounge room(about 30mtr) I'm thinking of getting another router or a switcher for the lounge room that to give me extra Ethernet ports(for future components) in the lounge room without running another cable.

So my question is what is best in this situation? Router, Switcher, Hub or something else? Or maybe something that possibly has Ethernet, Wireless, USB, universal card reader and something else I haven't thought of in the one unit?

cheers

 

[MDS]

Without looking up the Linksys model number I'm going to assume it is a router (because you show it connected to a cable modem). If you have an ethernet cable from the router and through the walls that emerges in the lounge room and now want to add a second device in that room, you need a switch.

A hub is like a 'dumb switch'. It's simply a splitter and will broadcast every packet it receives to each device connected to it. Only the device whose mac address matches will actually accept the packet and all others will drop it but because it broadcast to every device your bandwidth is reduced. [If you have 5 Mbps incoming and had two devices in the lounge room running simultaneously, each will see only 2.5 Mbps bandwidth] A switch on the other hand learns which mac address is connected to which cable and will send the packet only to that device so each device gets the full bandwidth available.

 

[MACCA350]

Yes the Linksys WRT54GP2 is a router with wireless and 2phone line outputs for VOIP.
So a switcher will do the job, will this allow the pc's and 360 to connect together as well as internet access? Is there any benefit to using another router?

cheers

 

[MDS]

A router is a switch with a firewall and also acts as the 'default gateway'; ie any packet that does not have a local address gets sent out its WAN port to the internet.

If all of the wires from each room are connected to the router, then every one of them will have internet access and every machine on the network will be able to see every other (unless of course you define your own static routes).

To put things in perspective, here is how my house is wired:
Every room has a wall jack with an RJ-45 jack and each room's wire runs to a central location. In that central location I have a Linksys switch and that switch ties all the rooms together.

Now in my office I have the cable modem connected to the cable outlet and the router (Netgear) connected to the modem. The wall jack in the office is connected to the router and the machines in the office are connected to the router. So the machines in the office communicate directly with the router to access each other and the internet. If I plug my laptop into the wall jack in the living room (I do because I work from home), packets from the laptop go to the switch, which goes to the router, which go out to the internet. The switch ties all of the rooms together.

Your case would be slightly different, but the same result. If I understood correctly, the lounge has a wall jack for the network and the other end of that wire is connected to the router in another room. Now instead of connecting that wall jack to one device, you connect it to a switch and to the switch you now connect two devices. The two devices connected to the switch can communicate directly via the switch. If one of those devices has the capability to send a request that would have an internet address, the switch will learn that none of the directly connected devices have that address and will send the packets through the wall jack, which is connected to the router, which has access to the internet.

A router instead of a switch would work too, but is not necessary. A 4 port switch is under $20 and requires zero setup - just plug it in.

 

[jonnythan]

MDS, you might want to brush up on your terminology.

A router is a device that connects two networks. You can spend thousands of dollars on a Cisco router that's just a router. What's sold as a consumer router these days is a combination of 3 things: router, switch, and wireless access point.

A router that does NAT traversal acts as something of a firewall by isolating the internal network, but it's a total misnomer to say that it is "a firewall" or that a router is a switch "plus firewall." A router is a basic piece of gear the same way a switch is, and a consumer router is a router plus a switch (plus wireless AP).

Anyway, to add connections on the LAN (the "inside" part, the local network, as opposed to the WAN, or the Internet side of the router) all you have to do is add a switch. You can add as many as you want wherever you want. It's that simple. Just connect them with ethernet cables.

 

[MDS]

Did you misunderstand the original post? It is OBVIOUS that he is talking about a consumer router in his house. There is no reason to go into all the subtle differences between router/switch/firewall/bridge/gateway.

A router may loosely be defined as a 'device that connects networks' but you know what - so is a bridge and so is a gateway (save the explanation of how they are different - I know). Manufacturers like Ciso make devices that blur the distinction between a router and a switch. Is that relevant to the question?

There was nothing inaccurate about describing a consumer router as a switch+firewall as that is exactly what it is. It is certainly a switch and it qualifies as a firewall because many of them do stateful packet inspection and of course you can block incoming ports, which makes it kind of behave like a proxy server now doesn't it?. Pardon me for not describing NAT traversal and not writing an entire thesis on networking and data communications.

If anyone ever asks how the All-Pairs Shortest Path algorithm works, I'm sure you're the man to describe it in gory detail.

The question was what kind of network device do I need. I answered that and provided additional information to make it clear how it would work. Some people actually like to know that kind of stuff and in conversations with macca350 before I think he is that kind of person. He would say if it was information overkill or not.

But thanks for verifying that a switch is 'all you need'.

 

[MACCA350]

OK, so if I connect like this:

...........................Cable modem
..................................|
...............................Router---VOIP phone
............................../........\
............................/...........PC 1
....................Switcher
.................../.........\
................PC 2.......360

Everything will have internet access and everything will communicate with each other right? eg PC1----PC2, 360----PC1, 360----PC2.

cheers

 

[jonnythan]

I answered that and provided additional information to make it clear how it would work.

I felt that your information was misleading. To say that a router is a "switch plus firewall" is wholly wrong. The statement doesn't even make sense. To say that a consumer router is really just a router with a built-in switch is much more accurate. "Router" describes an actual piece of networking gear. "Switch" describes an actual piece of networking gear. "Firewall" does not - at least, not in the sense of anything that a consumer router does.

Anyway, you're right that this is OT, so I'll drop it.

 

[MACCA350]

I felt that your information was misleading. To say that a router is a "switch plus firewall" is wholly wrong. The statement doesn't even make sense. To say that a consumer router is really just a router with a built-in switch is much more accurate. "Router" describes an actual piece of networking gear. "Switch" describes an actual piece of networking gear. "Firewall" does not - at least, not in the sense of anything that a consumer router does.

Anyway, you're right that this is OT, so I'll drop it.

OK, but that didn't answer my question

cheers

 

[jonnythan]

OK, so if I connect like this:

...........................Cable modem
..................................|
...............................Router---VOIP phone
............................../........\
............................/...........PC 1
....................Switcher
.................../.........\
................PC 2.......360

Everything will have internet access and everything will communicate with each other right? eg PC1----PC2, 360----PC1, 360----PC2.

cheers

Yes that will work perfectly.

BTW, it's a switch, not a switcher

 

[MACCA350]

Yes that will work perfectly.

BTW, it's a switch, not a switcher

Thanks, I'll get a switcher

cheers

 

[MDS]

I felt that your information was misleading. To say that a router is a "switch plus firewall" is wholly wrong. The statement doesn't even make sense.

How about consumer routers 'also contain a basic firewall to block incoming connections'? It's only misleading to someone like yourself that thinks things must be neatly compartmentalized into separate devices and there can be no combination of functionality in a single device and only a dedicated 'firewall' is qualified to use that term. Take up your rant with the router manufacturers - they could use your wisdom and learn to stop calling their devices firewalls.

 

[MACCA350]

Thanks again MDS, much appreciated

cheers