Help!! Pioneer Elite VSX 54TX or Yamaha RX V2500

[trev2401]

Hi...
I'm searching for a receiver for my room, and well.. i'm stuck between the yamaha 2500 and the pioneer elite 54 tx.

They both seem equally good.. and i'm looking for a set mainly reference listening and a bit of home theatre functions..

perhaps anyone out there could lend a view or 2 about either one of these receivers?

Thanks

 

[Xsound]

After much research and looking around I narrowed my short list down to those same 2 receivers. I went with the 54 for a couple of reasons. I am using Monitor Audio speakers which have a tendency to be (choose one) bright, detailed, cool,etc. I wanted something to "warm" up the sound. The elite line uses mosfets which have a more warm sound. The pioneer has a larger power supply and bigger capacitors, for home theater in my room with my speakers this was a big plus. My older MA speakers can present some funky loads, so the supply, capacitors and the mosfets seem to have a more powerful presentation.

When I did side by side comparisons, I went to a tweeter store and spent a few hours going back and forth between the 2500, the 54, and the Denon 3805. My listening impressions in regards to the sound left me feeling that I could be happy with any of the 3. I felt like I could hear a difference in the way the 3 presented the soundstage. The Denon soundstage seemed to start at the speaker line and come out into the room. The Yamaha seemed to be anchored on the plane of the speakers, though it extended to the left and right of the speakers. The Pioneer seemed to start at the speaker line and present depth behind the speakers. Many people characterize the Yamaha sound as being bright. I found that it was probably the most neutral of the 3. The Denon seemed to me to be more bright and the Pioneer seemed to be more warm.

Both units are THX certified. Both units offer good technology in movie processing. While I really felt that I could be happy with either of these units, I went with the 54 for some of the reasons mentioned, (warm sound character, mosfet amp, beefy power supply and caps) plus the fact that the 54 was designed to be able to bi-amp using the rear channels. I am bi-amping my MA 700 golds, it's pretty cool. It is a simple procedure and is covered in the manual.

I have had the unit since january, and continue to love it. I have listened to more music since January than I have in the last several years. It is an incredibly smooth sounding piece, and the power is almost deceptive. It is so clean that I am often unaware of how loud I listening until the phone rings or someone tries to talk to me. I have yet to hear any sign of strain on the part of the amp, and I push it pretty hard.

 

[bri1270]

I was also in the same position not all that long ago. And I also had my choices narrowed down to the 2500, the 3805 and the 54TX. I ended up getting the Pioneer. There are a few things I preferred. 1. Dual 48 bit processors 2. MOSFET Amp 3. 2 x 22,000 uf capacitors 4. Video Up conversion - (actually works pretty well). Some people say to never run your video through the receiver, and I never did before the 54, but it works, and it works well. The MCACC was another nice option, does a pretty good job; it nails the distance dead on, sets the size and delay correctly, and EQ's pretty nicely. It looks nicer, in my opinion, than either of the other two, and most importantly (again IMO) it sounded better than the other two. Pioneer doesn't get much recognition in this forum, and unjustifiably so in my view. The Elite stuff is great, and if you go to other forums, like AVS for example, many people praise the 1014. I'm happy with My 54...sometimes wish I bit the bullet and got the 56TXi for the Ilink, but oh well.

 

[Leprkon]

Hi...
I'm searching for a receiver for my room, and well.. i'm stuck between the yamaha 2500 and the pioneer elite 54 tx.

perhaps anyone out there could lend a view or 2 about either one of these receivers?

Thanks

can you tell us a little about your speakers ? the Yamaha is a great unit (I have a 2500 in my main HT and an HTR 5740 in the bedroom HT), but it doesn't do well with 4 ohm speakers...that might be a limiting factor.

 

[WooHoo]

After much research and looking around I narrowed my short list down to those same 2 receivers. I went with the 54 for a couple of reasons. I am using Monitor Audio speakers which have a tendency to be (choose one) bright, detailed, cool,etc. I wanted something to "warm" up the sound. The elite line uses mosfets which have a more warm sound. The pioneer has a larger power supply and bigger capacitors, for home theater in my room with my speakers this was a big plus. My older MA speakers can present some funky loads, so the supply, capacitors and the mosfets seem to have a more powerful presentation.

When I did side by side comparisons, I went to a tweeter store and spent a few hours going back and forth between the 2500, the 54, and the Denon 3805. My listening impressions in regards to the sound left me feeling that I could be happy with any of the 3. I felt like I could hear a difference in the way the 3 presented the soundstage. The Denon soundstage seemed to start at the speaker line and come out into the room. The Yamaha seemed to be anchored on the plane of the speakers, though it extended to the left and right of the speakers. The Pioneer seemed to start at the speaker line and present depth behind the speakers. Many people characterize the Yamaha sound as being bright. I found that it was probably the most neutral of the 3. The Denon seemed to me to be more bright and the Pioneer seemed to be more warm.

Both units are THX certified. Both units offer good technology in movie processing. While I really felt that I could be happy with either of these units, I went with the 54 for some of the reasons mentioned, (warm sound character, mosfet amp, beefy power supply and caps) plus the fact that the 54 was designed to be able to bi-amp using the rear channels. I am bi-amping my MA 700 golds, it's pretty cool. It is a simple procedure and is covered in the manual.

I have had the unit since january, and continue to love it. I have listened to more music since January than I have in the last several years. It is an incredibly smooth sounding piece, and the power is almost deceptive. It is so clean that I am often unaware of how loud I listening until the phone rings or someone tries to talk to me. I have yet to hear any sign of strain on the part of the amp, and I push it pretty hard.

Xsound I have to hand it to you. That is one of the most well thought out responses to a "Which one should I buy?" post as I have read. My response might have been get the Yammi and I would have left it at that. Great job!

 

[trev2401]

Hey Xsound...

a big THANK YOU for one of the best replies i've read so far...

Well, i'm in the process of setting up a small lil room for my own listening, and don't have the mula to go for AR tubes, etc etc..

I havn't yet bought my speakers, but was planning on Ascend Acoustics CBM 170s for my front mains and center, and 2 fluance bi polar surrounds for my rear 2. (tight tight budget here as my wife's giving me loads on how i should spend the $$$ on the babies' college fund, bla bla)

Perhaps, you could also think of a few speakers for me, recoomendations, etc... to go with the pioneer 54tx.


OH YES... most of the webbies that sell the 54tx say that it has a USB port? Went to pioneer's page, but couldn't find any usb inputs on the 54tx...
is it true?


Once again,
Thanks guys, for the help.

 

[Xsound]

Thanks, glad I could help. The 54 does not have a usb port. the 56 does (2 in fact, 56 has i-link as well. Like bri1270 I wish I had the 56, but real world $$ kept me in line. One day she will be mine, oh yes, she will be mine!). 54 does have the rs232 thingy whatever, but I'm a mac guy and its only pc.

For speakers, I hear good things about the ascends, but I haven't actually heard them. If the surrounds aren't really what you want, why not try a little creative financing.

I can't believe I am about to suggest this, but first let me ask a question. Do you have or want a sub?

If you went for the VSX-1014k, which some places are selling for less than $350, you would get most of the sound and performance of the 54, and save $300+. The power supply is not quite as large, the caps are smaller, but that shouldn't be a problem with the ascends. I believe you lose the rs232 thingy and get 1st gen MCACC instead of advanced MCACC. You still get the Mosfet amp, THX, Dolby PrologicIIx, video upconversion. While I prefer bi/dipole surrounds, you could possibly save a few bucks by just finding a pair of old radio shack optimus speakers in a yard sale to use as surrounds for the time being. Take that money and put toward a sub. Next Christmas tell everyone all you want is money to finish out your stereo, take that cash buy the bipoles of your dreams (Axiom qs4s maybe), or maybe 3 more CBM 170s for a matching 6.1 system, and move the radio shacks to the zone 2 for music on the porch/deck. Just a thought, because you seemed not to be too jazzed over the fluance.

Besides if your HT/stereo is beyond rocking, maybe the kid grows up to be a rock star or movie director, gives the parents a couple of mil to say thanks for bringing me up, and pays tribute to dad's HT/stereo as the inspiration from his childhood! hey, it could happen.

enjoy
X

 

[trev2401]

Hello xsound...

Thanks once again for the reply...

hmmm oh yeah.. forgot to mention that i already have an old JBL PB12 which i saved up for to power my computer system with an onkyo mc35 mini system. (yes i love bass )

Hmmm ok... sounds good, the vsx 1014. But like u, i've been blown away with the performance of the elites, hearing my neighbour's 52tx, and drooling over the 56...

Perhaps you could recconmend me to some good sounding speakers for mains and surrounds? The axioms look sooo nice and have had tons of good reviews too, but ultimately, they're made in china.... so i'm still kinda worried about the qc, and how long it'll last. The ascends, i've heard them... and they're FLAT and ACCURATE as hell in my opinion, but i'm still in the process of collecting reccomendations from people.

Once agian, Thanks SOOO much for the help...

Regards,
Trevor

 

[Dumar]

most of the webbies that sell the 54tx say that it has a USB port? Went to pioneer's page, but couldn't find any usb inputs on the 54tx...

Trevor,

Just in case you don't already know this, Pioneer authorises just a few select online dealers (see their web site). If you buy from the others you get a better price, but no warranty.

I like Elite also ... especially the 56TXi.

 

[trev2401]

Thanks dumar.. for the warning... kind of risky, especially from some of the companys in new york.. .got quoted DARN GOOD prices for the 56txi (850$) but alas, some persian chap on the line claimed that ALL online stores didn't offer pioneer's warrenty..

I told him that he had listed his site as an authorized dealer... and *click* he hung up.. hmmmm

 

[bri1270]

Trev - I have the Ascend 340M's and a 340C. They replaced three Paradigm LCR 350's that I was using for my 3 front channels. It was the single best upgrade I have done to my system...period. They definitely need a sub, but it looks like you have that covered. I can't speak directly to the 170's since I don't own them, but you will find a plethora of people that are more than pleased with them. I went for the 340's because I like the MTM style, really more than any other reason. I was going to do some A/B testing with my Paradigms, but once I hooked up the Ascends and listened to them for about a minute, I knew it wasn't even worth the effort. Huge sound stage, outstanding highs, and perfect mids (all in my opinion of course). I will say that if I buy a peice of crap, I say I bought a peice of crap. I'm not one of those that feels it necessary to force myself to like something because I paid for it. Like I said, the Ascends were easily THE BEST upgrade I made to my system. Customer service is outstanding, shipping prices are better than fair, and the cost of the speakers is a steal! They could easily sell the 340's for $800 and still be offering a good deal.

 

[Xsound]

I have had good luck with elegantaudiovideo.com. That's where I bought my 54. They will service my unit for me. Since there is no Pioneer service center locally, I have to box and ship the unit anyway, might as well ship it back to the people I bought it from.

I am pairing my elite with Monitor Audio Silver series. I have an older (12 yrs old) 700 gold pair of bookshelfs that sound awesome. I just bought my S-LCR from e-bay for $350(it retails for $600, authorized dealer was going to sell for $450). I know that is out of your ball park, but they really sound awesome with the elite. The closest thing to the 170s would be the S-1, but it is still more expensive, probably $450 at elegantaudiovideo. Of course it is a real wood veneer, that adds some to the cost.

I looked at the Axioms, but didn't have the chance to hear them. I was intrigued by the reviews, etc. But for your budget, needs, and likes, it really sounds like the Ascends are the ticket. You ahve heard them and seen them, most importantly you like them. If you really want to give the Axioms a try, order them and the ascends. You get an in home demo, and if you like the Axioms best, the return shipping on the Ascends is free, I beleive. Don't know what the return shipping for the Axioms is, but woudn't imagine it would be too high. May be worth it for the peace of mind.

Most of what I have read and seen indicates that the quality on-line brands like Axiom and Ascend are great speakers. For the price they are huge bargains. You may catch a sale on a traditional speaker that equals the value/$$, but that's not the everyday case. If I was you, I would go ahead and pull the trigger. You can research and research; you may wind up being a day too early to catch some big surprise, or a week too late to get another awesome deal, you just never know. But you do know that you like the sound of the Pioneer Elite and the sound of the Ascends. You think its a good value. You are way ahead of where most people are when they are looking to make a purchase. You have been exposed to good equipment, and know what you like.

 

[trev2401]

Hello X sound, Bri1270..


Thanks once again for the wonderful help both in reccomendations for equipment, AND testimonials about the Ascends... Really helped alot.

For now, i'll wait till the next pay cheque comes, and my wife to leave the country (going to her parents in 2 wks) before i make my purchase. (evil grin).

I'm even toying with the idea of scringing up for the 56txi and letting it sit in the box for 1 month before buying a set of speakers for them.

But on the overall, i'll bang my buck on the elite and the ascend 170s...

Now the only thing is to find an AUTHORIZED dealer that doesn't blow my pants off with the pricing... sigh...

thanks to all once again...


Trevor

 

[trev2401]

oh yes... xsound...

would u happen to know if the elite 54tx & 56txi have pure direct modes for stereo listening, & if so, how do they fare to the yamahas ( when u were comparing the 2 models)
i couldn't seem to find any specifications on this on pioneer's webbie, and from the pdf manuals.

thanks;
Trevor

 

[Xsound]

the 54 and the 56 have a "stereo" mode that includes the fronts and the sub and the MCACC adjustment. They also have a "Direct" mode that is the fronts and sub without the MCACC adjustments. If you go to the Pioneer web-site (and the Yamaha's web-site as well) you can download the owners manual. (Oh, I see that you seem to have already downloaded the manuals) I found this very helpful. You will see on the remote a stereo/direct mode button. If you are in a theater mode or surround music mode, you push the button once to go to "Stereo" mode, and again to toggle to Direct.

 

[rgriffin25]

I bought a 53TX over a year ago and I still love it! I bought mine Here and I must say I was pretty satisfied with their service. Looks like they have the 54TX at a pretty good price. They also do ebay, that is how I bought mine.

I must say I am impressed, I have been a member here for over a year and this has been the most I have ever heard Pioneer Elite talked about. I am glad you all are as happy as I am!

 

[Tommy]

Trevor, you stated in an earlier post that you heard your neighbours Elite 52Tx and liked it. Just wanted to say that the Pioneer 1014 is said to have the same inside components of the Elite 52Tx, the only difference being the gloss black front panel on the 52Tx. I have the Pioneer 56Txi with all Energy speakers including Energy C-8's for fronts. I had a Yamaha DSP-A1 before and it sounded kind of bright when turned up with the Energy's where as the Pioneer never gets bright sounding even when pushed to higher levels. You won't regret going with Pioneer .

 

[trev2401]

Hey Tommy...

Thanks.... will definitely be getting the pioneer... gunning for the 56txi, only thing now is the wife.... who's not taking too well to this. (told her that this new black box will bring joy and happiness to the family AND the living room). I'm still in the process of shopping aroudn the internet, with the 54tx still providing a strong draw due to its price... Also, authorized dealers are HARD to find online, and that their prices are also quite hard to swallow compared to the unauthorized ones.

Energy speakers... i've always wanted to listen to them, unfortunately at the Good Guys (dealer) near to me, the staff there's mainly college kids or arrogant salesmen who can't be bothered to demo the sets unless u whip out your card/cheque book.

How are the C6, 8s in terms of accuracy when coupled to your 56txi? And what kind of applications are they better for, in your opinion of course?... thanks..

Regards
Trevor

 

[Tommy]

I really like the Energy C-8's, I have had them for around maybe 6 years now. In my opinion they sound great for music and home theatre. They have 2-8" drivers each,aluminum dome tweeters, they put out a lot of bass and seem to like all the power you can give them. The C-8's are not made anymore and the new Connoisseur series doesn't seem to be made with quite the same quality as the old ones. I have listened to the newer C-5's,C-7's and C-9's and they do sound good for the price though.