Help me setup my room! Advice wanted :)

[quiksr20]

Hello All,

This is one of my first posts so first ill introduce myself, I got interested in home theater and audio about 6 years ago ( home ) I was into car audio alot when I was a little younger.

I now know a little but I still consider myself a novice and always welcome constructive criticism & advice.

So I just bought my first place, a condo and I have complaining neighbors already. I had my sub in the front right corner and it sounded great but it must of been sending vibrations down the wall right into there place and they were annoyed. I have labeled where my sub was as OLD and where it is now as NEW. In its new location it doesn't sound half as good as it did, It also makes my stage look un-even, But its in the center of the condo now instead of along a wall that runs into there place.

I'm looking for some advice on my sub placement as well as if there's anything I can do to help its sound ( i know its not the greatest sub ). Would a piece of granite under it instead of carpet help? Possibly a different location?

I also have some rear channel questions. Currently im runnning a 5.1 setup but debated a 7.1 setup. Is it worth it? I want to upgrade my rears eventually and I have over 2 feet behind my couch to setup a 7.1 setup.

For now with 5.1 should I have my rears positioned to the side of my couch or the back? Also how far should my fronts, sub be from the wall?

I will attach a few pics below to help out. I really appreciate the help, I feel I have a pretty ideal layout for a great sounding setup with a little tuning and advice.

Thanks in advance,

 

[ParadigmDawg]

That's a good looking system.

I just dont think that moving the sub from one side of the sound-stage to the other is going to calm the neighbors. Maybe if you put it near-field you could play it lower and still get some effect from it without PO'in the neighbors????

I find 5.1 is plenty and I have a huge room but it's up to you. The side surrounds should be to the sides and just a little behind you (1-3 ft)

 

[the grunt]

Moving your sub out of the corner means It’s getting less help from the walls and corners to reinforce it’s sound which is one reason it sounded better there. Problem is that anyplace in your room that duplicates that sound is also likely to cause more to carry over to the neighbor.

I found the best position in my room by doing the “sub crawl”

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/speaker-setup-guidelines/crawling-for-bass-subwoofer-placement

I live in an apartment and have managed to avoid your neighbor problem by putting a transducer on my couch. I got a Buttkicker because it was on sale but there are other brands also out there.

Using the Buttkicker allows me to turn my sub down to neighbor friendly levels while still feeling the impact of the bass. Not quite the same as the sub turned up loud but darn close if it’s tuned in right.

I don’t think you will see much improvement with 7.1 especially with only 2 feet behind you.

 

[quiksr20]

Cool the 7.1 was just an idea I think ill just upgrade my rear channels then to a better set. So currently the rear surrounds are just that about 1/2 foot from the back corners of the couch.

Judging by the diagram are you suggesting I move them to the sides instead of rear?
( Sorry i really didnt understand to the sides but yet behind you? ) Did you mean to the sides and like 1
foot form the couch? If so easy fix..

The neighbors aren't terribly complaining but they did once and it was on music. I had it up pretty loud and in that corner. I'm wondering if I just tune the sub to sound better where its at it will disturb them a little less. If you were to put your ear to the wall when it was in the corner the sound seemed much more amplified through the wall then where it is now.

Another sub question.

Ive read to set the Hz on the sub its best to up it to the max like 120hz and then tune it from the receiver down to 75-80hz anyone know if that will make it sound better? Is the x-over most likely better in my receiver? Also I have the gain on the sub at 7 out of 12 and the receiver at 0 should that change?

Like I said i am still a novice and just trying to make the best out of my setup.

Appreciate the help guys!

Daryl G

PS Greg, Nice system checked out the pics in your sig

 

[ParadigmDawg]

I looks like the best option for your surrounds would be the side walls. Place them out there and see how they sound. I would go around 2 feet behind the couch and all the way out to the walls.

Diable your sub crossover or set it as high as it will go and use the AVR crossover. Run the auto calibration and then go back in and manually set the speakers to "small" and then recheck the crossover and make certain it is around the 70-90hz mark. The gain should be set to where ever the AVR recieves a strong enough signal to activate the auto-on. 0-4 should do it.

 

[quiksr20]

I looks like the best option for your surrounds would be the side walls. Place them out there and see how they sound. I would go around 2 feet behind the couch and all the way out to the walls.

Diable your sub crossover or set it as high as it will go and use the AVR crossover. Run the auto calibration and then go back in and manually set the speakers to "small" and then recheck the crossover and make certain it is around the 70-90hz mark. The gain should be set to where ever the AVR recieves a strong enough signal to activate the auto-on. 0-4 should do it.

I have edited my picture to roughly display the new location of the rears is this where you are suggesting?

If so cool I will pull my speakers away from the couch a foot or so and push them more to the sides. currently there directly behind the couch. 2 feet would put them right in walkin distance and my cats will knock them right over.

All my speakers are already set to small I just have the bass management being done by the sub. I cant disable but I will turn it to the highest settings and dial it back on the receiver.

Is the auto calibration a feature of my receiver? What should the gain on the sub be? Right now its around 7 of 12 and the receiver is on 0. Are you saying the gain on the sub should be at a spot where 0-4 on the reciever turn the sub on?

Thanks for the help I cant wait to get home from work and dial in some of these settings.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Two feet wouldnt be in your walkng path if they are close to the side walls. They should be beside and slightly behind you you facing towards the listening area.

I am not familar with Harmon Kardon but I would assume it has some type of auto-cal; if not then you need to get a cal disc and SPL meter or you have no way of properly adjusting levels, delays...etc...

The only way to know where your gain should be set on your sub is with a SPL meter. You want to blend it in wth the speakers so it doesnt draw attention to itself; it just provides an extension of the speakers.

 

[quiksr20]

Two feet wouldnt be in your walkng path if they are close to the side walls. They should be beside and slightly behind you you facing towards the listening area.

I am not familar with Harmon Kardon but I would assume it has some type of auto-cal; if not then you need to get a cal disc and SPL meter or you have no way of properly adjusting levels, delays...etc...

The only way to know where your gain should be set on your sub is with a SPL meter. You want to blend it in wth the speakers so it doesnt draw attention to itself; it just provides an extension of the speakers.

Gotcha, Well if you look at my diagram, That red line towards the hall way isnt a wall its just a line to show where the living room kinda ends, the living room goes right into the dining room / hall area.

Now that i think about it. My receiver does have an auto-calibration. it has an input on the Remote and a little mic that came with it. I guess that goes in the listening position to setup? I can actually set the mic on my tripod ear level from the seat.

Its starting to sound more and more like I will be having a much better sounding setup by this evening. I never calibrated my system like this just by my ears. I mean I measured out my centers and set levels but never with a utility like this. I have no delays setup and only have my levels set by ear.

Fronts at 0 center at +1 and rears at + 1 ( no data but my ears to back the settings )

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Gotcha, Well if you look at my diagram, That red line towards the hall way isnt a wall its just a line to show where the living room kinda ends, the living room goes right into the dining room / hall area.

Now that i think about it. My receiver does have an auto-calibration. it has an input on the Remote and a little mic that came with it. I guess that goes in the listening position to setup? I can actually set the mic on my tripod ear level from the seat.

Its starting to sound more and more like I will be having a much better sounding setup by this evening. I never calibrated my system like this just by my ears. I mean I measured out my centers and set levels but never with a utility like this. I have no delays setup and only have my levels set by ear.

Fronts at 0 center at +1 and rears at + 1 ( no data but my ears to back the settings )

There is just no way to get close by ear; yes set your mic on the tripod at ear level. turn off all noise makers (ceiling fan, heater, wife) it must be completly quite and hit the auto set-up. It usually gets the crossover and size wrong so go back and set those after the auto. It may look like it sets the distance wrong but dont mess with that as it is more of a delay setting vs. actual distance.

You have yet to hear what your system will produce; you are going to have a blast tonight!

 

[quiksr20]

There is just no way to get close by ear; yes set your mic on the tripod at ear level. turn off all noise makers (ceiling fan, heater, wife) it must be completly quite and hit the auto set-up. It usually gets the crossover and size wrong so go back and set those after the auto. It may look like it sets the distance wrong but dont mess with that as it is more of a delay setting vs. actual distance.

You have yet to hear what your system will produce; you are going to have a blast tonight!

I cant thank you enough.. I am getting ready to calibrate it now. I have moved my rears to where I belive you recomended and it sounds better already with my crappy calibration.

Before

After

 

[ParadigmDawg]

I cant thank you enough.. I am getting ready to calibrate it now. I have moved my rears to where I belive you recomended and it sounds better already with my crappy calibration.

Before

After

They may be a tad too far back but try it and see. The calibration is what is going make your system shine

Why is it that the cat hasnt moved even though the speakers have?

 

[quiksr20]

Hes lazy hahahhah Acutally it looks like uploaded the same picture twice.. actually I just measured everything. from the right the speaker is 20inchs to the right and the left speaker is 20 inches off to the left. There actually at 4 feet back, which i noticed is definatly too far. Going to bring them in to 2 feet. The left will kind of be floating but thats ok.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Give this a look.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_entertainment/roomlayout2.html

 

[quiksr20]

A picture is worth a thousand words. I have my rears identical to that picture now. Off to calibration! Sorry if I sounded retarded it was just hard to get what you were saying earlier if though it was pretty straight forward!

Ill let you guys know how i make out

 

[ParadigmDawg]

A picture is worth a thousand words. I have my rears identical to that picture now. Off to calibration! Sorry if I sounded retarded it was just hard to get what you were saying earlier if though it was pretty straight forward!

Ill let you guys know how i make out

Yes; let us know what the cal turns out like.

 

[quiksr20]

OK just finished up moving the wiring and setting the rears to the proper locations.. Its too late to calibrate it now I will tommorow. It turns out my remote has an SPL Meter in it for the calibration. Its also a standalone SPL Meter ( not sure how good of one )

I was also trying to adjust my x-over on the sub down to 80 or so HZ so I could raise the x-over on the actual sub to 120 and bypass it but I couldnt figure out how to in my reciever. The manual states some settings but its partially going over my head. Maybe this screenshot will help?

Im wondering what hz I should set my fronts / rears / centers, Maybe Ill check Klipsch's site. If I leave them at default for small 100hz is that more than likely good enough?

Thanks again, Tommorow will be calibration day!

 

[the grunt]

Most people start by setting all speakers to small and the X-over to 80Hz. You can then adjust things from there based on the low frequency performance of each set of speakers, room interactions and your personal preferences.

On the back of your subwoofer you want to set it to “bypass” or the highest setting available if there is no bypass. You do this to take the subwoofer’s internal crossover out of the equation. That way all the bass management is being done in the receiver with the menu you pictured.

As Greg Gable said before after you run the auto calibration go back and reset the speakers sizes and x-overs to where you want them. The auto calibration will likely change theses around to something you may not want.

 

[quiksr20]

Gotcha, I was looking for a setting to set my sub to 80 hz. I just set all my other speakers to 80 or so hz and the sub will then pickup the hz below.

I think I should probaly set my rears to 100hz or so there small 4 inch Klipsch Quintetts, My center and fronts will probaly be fine on 80hz.

Do I leave the LFE on LEFT/RIGHT im assuiming to cover my Mains.

Pretty soon all this info with be common knowledge but right now its new and pretty exciting to get some equipment Ive had for some time sounding much better..

I just never had as much of the want when I was renting an apt.

Daryl

 

[the grunt]

Gotcha, I was looking for a setting to set my sub to 80 hz. I just set all my other speakers to 80 or so hz and the sub will then pickup the hz below.

Right!

I think I should probaly set my rears to 100hz or so there small 4 inch Klipsch Quintetts, My center and fronts will probaly be fine on 80hz

Sounds good. The best thing you can do is experiment a little bit to see what sounds best to you. For a while I had my sub very close to my seating and had set my center to 90 and surrounds to 100 but I didn’t like it as the sub became to easy to localize. There are just to may factors unique to your system, room and personal preferences that only you can figure out what will work best.

Just remember that one advantage of home theater is that you can have it your way. I only recommended conventional setting as a starting point. Feel free to throw convention out the window as you play with your system figuring out what you like. I have and am much happier for it.

Do I leave the LFE on LEFT/RIGHT im assuiming to cover my Mains.

I’m not sure how your receiver labels it’s setting. It’s probably best to start with your mains set to small and what ever setting sends all the LFE and main channel bass below the crossover to the subwoofer. From there you can play with the settings by doing things like lowering the crossover of the mains or having them play full range by themselves or even send the main channel bass to both the mains and the subwoofer. Only time and your ears will tell you what sounds best, but try the top suggestion first as it’s the simplest to calibrate then tweak from there.

If you haven’t already there are some tips you can check out here on this site in case you want to try something without waiting for someone on the forum to respond.

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/

I’ve had my full home (apartment) theater set up since last February and I am still trying different things to see if I like it. A word to the wise. If you start changing things try to keep a record the settings you changed from just in case you want to go back because the new settings don’t sound as good.

Dean

 

[quiksr20]

Thanks Dean I will check out that link tomorrow. I will also do some more research on my receivers settings.