[Help me] choosing amp for Klipsch reference ii.

[Khactuyen]

Hello,
My HT: klipsch rf7ii, rc64, rs62, rb61; pre onkyo 5509; amp B&K 200.7s2.
My plan to*upgrade amp for best match with KL Reference,
My short list: parasound A51+21, ATI 2000, Outlaw 7500.
Please give me some advise for best choosing amp (do or not) and the good 2nd price?
Thanks alot.
/// i do not live in USA so i can buy 2nd for cheaper and my friend will ship to me.

 

[fuzz092888]

The klipsch are pretty sensitive speakers so the B&K should be giving you all the power you could possibly need. Any of the ones you listed will perform fantastically, but if you're asking if any of them will sound better than the B&K, I remain skeptical. Is there any reason why you want to change from the B&K?

 

[Khactuyen]

The klipsch are pretty sensitive speakers so the B&K should be giving you all the power you could possibly need. Any of the ones you listed will perform fantastically, but if you're asking if any of them will sound better than the B&K, I remain skeptical. Is there any reason why you want to change from the B&K?

Thanks alot,
My friend want to buy this amp, other i think 5+2 is better than 7 chanels amp (i always listen music by 2 chanels)?
Infact, b&k 200.7 do not enough power to control rf7ii, bass not solid.....
Rgds,
Khactuyen.

 

[fuzz092888]

Thanks alot,
My friend want to buy this amp, other i think 5+2 is better than 7 chanels amp (i always listen music by 2 chanels)?
Infact, b&k 200.7 do not enough power to control rf7ii, bass not solid.....
Rgds,
Khactuyen.

If the 7 channel amp is well built and well designed you won't gain much with 5+2, other than maybe a little headroom for your front 2 speakers. If the bass sounds lacking, odds are it isn't the amp, but the subwoofer or lack thereof. If you don't have a sub, then you need new towers, not a new amp.

 

[Khactuyen]

If the 7 channel amp is well built and well designed you won't gain much with 5+2, other than maybe a little headroom for your front 2 speakers. If the bass sounds lacking, odds are it isn't the amp, but the subwoofer or lack thereof. If you don't have a sub, then you need new towers, not a new amp.

Thanks,
according to you, quality of b & k 200.7 is as good as ATI, Outlaw amp? Should I keep b & k200.7 and spend the money to other good subwoofer ... ?
For example: outlaw 7500 have bigger transformer (2x1600va of 7500 and 1500va of b&k) and B&K not design true balanced input.
My sub: Velodyne hgs15
Rgds,
Khactuyen.

 

[ImcLoud]

If you are considering the parasound units I imagine your budget will afford this pair...
XPR-5 | 400W x 5 | Emotiva Audio | High-end audio components for audiophiles and videophiles, spanning 2-channel music systems, as well as 5.1 and 7.1 home theaters. Products include multichannel amplifiers, stereo amplifiers, and monoblock amplifier
XPR-2 | 600W x 2 | Emotiva Audio | High-end audio components for audiophiles and videophiles, spanning 2-channel music systems, as well as 5.1 and 7.1 home theaters. Products include multichannel amplifiers, stereo amplifiers, and monoblock amplifier

that comes to $3148 shipped because of the sale, that will give you 3200 watts {so less than a dollar a watt} and you will have almost infinite headroom with them Klipsch speakers, lol. So the amps will hardly break a sweat { I seen an xpr2 powering a set of diamonds at a good volume for 12 hours, and it was ice cold}, and IMO its one of the best sounding amps I have heard, no need to spend more is my thinking... $3000 isnt bad for 200 lbs of amplifiers!!!

Another plus to having so much power is when you are ready to upgrade your speakers you can pretty much pick anything on the market since them amps will most likely drive any speaker you can buy... PLus them amps stacked up and glowing are pretty impressive...

Imagine adding a a pair of these XPR-1 Mono-block Power Amplifier | Emotiva Audio | Emotiva Audio | High-end audio components for audiophiles and videophiles, spanning 2-channel music systems, as well as 5.1 and 7.1 home theaters. Products include multichannel amplifiers, stereo amp powering a pair of these Dayton Audio 15" Ultimax Subwoofer and Cabinet Package 300-7097 for another $3200!!!

A side not on the BKs, I have owned a few, they were getting old and starting to break down {small stuff, power switches twice}, they ran super hot {which got worse as they aged}, my 5 ch. had a hum that never went away no matter what I did, and didnt feel like 200watts... I can honestly say my xpa2 sounds much better in ALL aspects compared to my BK 2-200, and the xpa5 vs my old bk 5 ch is also night and day, I feel like they are rated at more watts then they push or the emos are under rated because they were not as powerful as the emos, and my emo amps run coold vs my bks would get so hot you could smell them...

 

[fuzz092888]

A side not on the BKs, I have owned a few, they were getting old and starting to break down {small stuff, power switches twice}, they ran super hot {which got worse as they aged}, my 5 ch. had a hum that never went away no matter what I did, and didnt feel like 200watts... I can honestly say my xpa2 sounds much better in ALL aspects compared to my BK 2-200, and the xpa5 vs my old bk 5 ch is also night and day, I feel like they are rated at more watts then they push or the emos are under rated because they were not as powerful as the emos, and my emo amps run coold vs my bks would get so hot you could smell them...

I don't have any B&K amps or experience with them, only B&K preamps of which they were all very high quality. As to the emos vs anything else, they run cool due to topology, not because of how much power they have. That being said I have no idea why your B&K's ran hot, but the two most likely possibilities are that they were indeed pushed beyond their limits or they were high bias class A/B.

FWIW, my Threshold is only rated at 150 @ 8, but idles at around 350 watts and 120 degrees. Ain't nothing wrong with that amp.

 

[ImcLoud]

B&K's are known for running hot, I couldn't tell you why... My Emotiva amps run cool, I thought because they were over sized, because when I ran my xpa200 hard -it got warm, but my xpa2 pushed never gets hot... Technically I have no idea why, probably the "topology" you mentioned... They sounded good, and for when I bought them {not much else available in their price range, and they were bought locally} they were really nice...

 

[fuzz092888]

B&K's are known for running hot, I couldn't tell you why... My Emotiva amps run cool, I thought because they were over sized, because when I ran my xpa200 hard -it got warm, but my xpa2 pushed never gets hot... Technically I have no idea why, probably the "topology" you mentioned... They sounded good, and for when I bought them {not much else available in their price range, and they were bought locally} they were really nice...

A big reason really is topology, bias and design. The AB International 1100A I have running my dual opposed never gets hot. It only ever gets warm and that's with the fan unplugged and that thing is driving two LMS Ultras to 100+db occasionally to clipping. Whereas, the Aragon and the Threshold get on the hot side of warm just sitting there with the power light on. It's also why class D amps can push kilowatts of power and only get warm. If everything is running right and isn't a POS, then it's probably being pushed beyond it's limits or runs high bias.

I've never heard anything emo, but I've always been curious. They're definitely not high bias, especially with the transformer sizes they have in some of the amps and many of their models won't crush their rated output ACD (not that that is a big deal although some won't even hit it), but they seem well made and I'd like to try one out. Hopefully I can pick up an XPR used in when they're a little older and cheaper. That class H is interesting.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Thanks,
according to you, quality of b & k 200.7 is as good as ATI, Outlaw amp? Should I keep b & k200.7 and spend the money to other good subwoofer ... ?

I think you should keep the B+K amp. ATI owns B+K and Theta Digital. Great amps. ATI also make some amps for Mark Levinson, Lexicon, JBL Synthesis, and Cary Audio.


CEA Standard 2 Meters SPL @ 20/32/40/50/63 Hz:


$4000 Velodyne DD15+: 97.0/102.0/109.0/109.0/112.0
$2200 JL Audio F112: 92.8/112.4/116.2/113.3/117.6
$9,000 Paradigm Sig Sub2: 106.4/109.9/113.2/116.9/120.2
$1022 Hsu VTF-15H: 103.9/113.0/115.7/115.7/115.6
$5,000 Velodyne DD18+: 103.4/113.0/115.8/116.8/115.3
$2,000 SVS PB13 Ultra: 110.6/113.5/115.5/117.5/117.8
$1,400 Rythmik FV15HP: 108.1/117.0/119.5/119.1/118.8
$2,000 Funk 18.0: 103.6/114.9/119.9/121.4/121.9

 

[ImcLoud]

acu out of curiousity what does doubling the amount of subs do, in other words a funk 18 is $2K but an HSU 15 is $1000 so what would 2 hsu's look like against one funk 18?

 

[fuzz092888]

Frequency response is heavily dependent on the room, therefore strategically placing two subwoofers in a room will create a smoother bass frequency response while also increasing output 1.5 db or if they are co-located you will gain 3 db in output as long as you are comparing all the same subwoofer. In the case of two HSU vs a single funk 18, they would probably end up being about equal in output, but the HSU would yield a smoother overall frequency response in room. However, the distortion would probably be lower with the funk 18 and with EQ it would probably be pretty similar.

I would also expect the funk to play with a bit less distortion and the test results seem to show that. The other difference is that the VTF is ported and has the ability to be variably tuned.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

acu out of curiousity what does doubling the amount of subs do, in other words a funk 18 is $2K but an HSU 15 is $1000 so what would 2 hsu's look like against one funk 18?

I think doubling the number of speakers or subs increases the SPL by 3dB.

The HSU is an excellent sub for sure, especially at $1K. And the powered Funk 18.0 is actually $3,200 (unpowered is $2K), so 3 HSU for $3K might have the same or even slighter higher SPL than a single 18.0.

But for me, it's not just about SPL. I want only unpowered subs and customization.

If I could do it all over again, I would not buy any other speakers or subs other than 5 Salon2 plus 4 Funk 18.0 unpowered subs. I would just use my Denon 5308 to power all five Salon2 and an AT3004 to power my 4 Funk 18.0 subs.

So although I may have regrets about all the speakers and subs I've bought, I have no regrets at all about the Salon2 and Funk 18.0. Well, okay, the only regrets I have is that my Salon2 and Funk are not all piano gloss black.

 

[Steve81]

FWIW, co-location of subs theoretically yields a 6dB gain. Non co-located subs in a real room obviously varies considerably by frequency and as mentioned is useful for smoothing in room response.