HDCD Question?

[tcm5]

I just picked up the new Neil Young deluxe edition, which is a HDCD.I don't have any experience with these disks. My Oppo 981, which I have had for a few weeks now, supports this format. Question is,will this play through the optical connection to my Denon reciever or do I need to switch my receiver input to "Ext In" like I would for DVD-A or SACD. If it plays through the digital (optical) in, how do you know it's playing the HDCD portion of the disk and not the regular CD content.

 

[snickelfritz]

HDCD is a licensed dynamic range compression format. (I believe Microsoft currently owns the license)
There should be an LED on your Optical player front panel that lights when decoding is occurring. It should essentially just happen automatically, with no intervention required.

There is a "regular CD portion" of the disk, per se; the HDCD encoded material is simply played back without decoding by standard Redbook players.
The results can range from noticeably blunted dynamics to better than normal CD sound quality, depending on the encoder used to make the disk.

The ETX inputs are for high resolution multichannel audio formats like SACD and DVD-A; I seriously doubt that they would be a part of the HDCD specification, since HDCD predates this concept.

 

[MDS]

HDCD stands for High Definition Compatable Digital and encodes 20 bit samples in the normal 16 bit Redbook CD format. It was originally created by Pacific Microsonics but the rights to it are now owned by Microsoft as Snickelfritz said. You can go to the microsoft site and search for HDCD for more information if you want.

If the player supports HDCD encoding, it will decode it during playback. If it does not, it will still play normally just as playing a Dolby Surround encoded disc will still play normally if the receiver does not have a ProLogic decoder.

 

[mwheelerk]

I just picked up the new Neil Young deluxe edition, which is a HDCD.I don't have any experience with these disks. My Oppo 981, which I have had for a few weeks now, supports this format. Question is,will this play through the optical connection to my Denon reciever or do I need to switch my receiver input to "Ext In" like I would for DVD-A or SACD. If it plays through the digital (optical) in, how do you know it's playing the HDCD portion of the disk and not the regular CD content.

On my Denon 3805 Receiver when an HDCD disc is inserted a brief readout on the screen will show "HDCD". The digital connection can be used for this format.

 

[fmw]

Understand that your player must have an HDCD codec to decode the HDCD. Otherwise it will play just like any CD. I have one player - an Oppo - that decodes it. I also have a demo CD that has the same content encoded both ways for comparison. The difference is subtle but audible.

 

[snickelfritz]

Just to help clarify the "clear as mud" subject of HDCD playback connections:
(this is shocking IMO; why include this capability in a player and not clarify how it can be accessed?)

If the decoder is built into the CD player; analog connections to the amplifier should be used.
Digital connections will simply pass the digital content of the disk to the receiver, which will be decoded as Redbook CD if no HDCD decoder is present in the receiver.
Decoded HDCD is not transmitted over a digital connection, since the decoded result has already been converted to a high quality analog signal.

If the decoder is built into the receiver, a >96/24 digital connection must be used in order for decoding to occur.

If any of the above is untrue, please post links to the correct information.
Thanks.

 

[BGLeduc]

Just to help clarify the "clear as mud" subject of HDCD playback connections:
(this is shocking IMO; why include this capability in a player and not clarify how it can be accessed?)

If the decoder is built into the CD player; analog connections to the amplifier should be used.
Digital connections will simply pass the digital content of the disk to the receiver, which will be decoded as Redbook CD if no HDCD decoder is present in the receiver.
Decoded HDCD is not transmitted over a digital connection, since the decoded result has already been converted to a high quality analog signal.

If the decoder is built into the receiver, a >96/24 digital connection must be used in order for decoding to occur.

If any of the above is untrue, please post links to the correct information.
Thanks.

I am not sure about needing a 96/24 connection. AFAIK, Any optical of coax connection will work.

My NAD 762 does not support 96K connections, but it does support HDCD, and will illuminate the HDCD light with either an optical or coax connection from any of my digital players, assuming of course that I am playing an HDCD disc.

Brian

 

[tcm5]

Hdcd

Snickelfritz you are right I called Oppo and asked about the digital signal. If the reciever doesn't support HDCD you must use an analog out for the HDCD signal. Since I'm wired for DVD-A and SACD I'll switch the receiver to "ext in" and utilize the rt and lt front channels for the stereo HDCD or should I use the mixed stereo out of the oppo into a different receiver input. Would there be a difference.

 

[MDS]

Since I'm wired for DVD-A and SACD I'll switch the receiver to "ext in" and utilize the rt and lt front channels for the stereo HDCD or should I use the mixed stereo out of the oppo into a different receiver input. Would there be a difference.

Either way should work. Mixed stereo out just refers to the fact that if you set the player to PCM and use those analog outs, it will downmix 5.1 DD/DTS to 2 channels.

You only have to use the analog outs if you want the player to decode the HDCD. If you use the digital out, it will still play fine. I only have a few Van Halen HDCDs and I can't really tell any difference.

 

[snickelfritz]

I'm not sure.
Sounds like it should theoretically work OK, depending on how the SACD player is designed.

The reason why all of this is necessary is probably to prevent precious copyrighted digital data streams from being duplicated by pirates.
The "correct" way for manufacturers to implement these various music and movie soundtrack technologies is to build the decoders into the receiver, requiring a single digital connection from the universal player for all formats.

 

[mr-ben]

HDCD is a bit of a mysterious spec. Microsoft claims that it's 20-bit, but it order to be read by regular CD players and fit on a regular CD, the data is still stored in 16bit/44.1khz PCM, just like every other CD out there. I don't believe there is any open implementation documentation to prove/disprove this (typical Microsoft), but here's my understanding of how it works: There is no fancy codec or compression algorithm. After mastering the original recording is encoded at 20bit/44.1khz, then the lowest 4-bits of data is thrown away, because they're insignificant anyway, and the remaining data is recorded on the CD. A player that recognizes HDCD will logically shift the bits back up to 20 filling in the bottom 4bits with nothing, which provides greater dynamic range, but is less accurate than a "real" 20bit sample. A regular CD player will simply play the 16bit sample as-is, which will have reduced dynamic range compared to a HDCD player, but will sound just fine. With the dynamic compression given to most CDs today anyway, I doubt the increased range of HDCD is useful anyway. I think I have one or two HDCDs, but I've never noticed anything special about their sound.

Assuming the receiver can decode HDCD, I don't see any reason why the data coming out of the digital output couldn't be detected and decoded in the same way. If the receiver doesn't understand HDCD, you'll just hear it like any other CD player would play it.