For a 2.1 system is a surround sound A/V receiever necessary, or just a stereo receiver?

[SonomaComa]

Hi I am fairly new to the audiophile knowledge and am trying to get a nice sound package to go with a new 65" TV in the bedroom. I had a Bose Cinamate 2 little speaker set up in my bedroom where this TV is. I liked it because it came with speaker stands and I was able to place them real close at the foot of the bed. They did have "big sound" but they were missing clarity. Besides when they were loud to me it was not that loud throughout the house. But I was thinking, for a total price of about $800.00 I could get some nice speakers and a receiver that would blow those away. Things escalated for me and I started looking at $5,000 systems. Overkill!
All I really need is some high quality bookshelf speakers on stands and a sub. That would be fine for the bedroom. But what kind of receiver would be needed for that? Can a regular Stereo be used or would it be better to get an actual A/V receiver? It is just going to be a 2.1 sound system and I am not going to try all of the zoning and streaming music from everything possible. I am just after some really good sound for watching Movies and regular TV. Would it be possible to get that to happen on a budget of around$1,500 - $2,000? I'm just not sure about the receiver.

 

[sholling]

A surround receiver (AVR) is a better value and bring a lot more to the party. A better value because of economies of scale. The big electronics companies sell thousands of A/V receivers for every stereo receiver that they sell and that allows them to pack in a ton more features for not much more money. What's missing from most stereo receivers are HDMI support, bass management (subwoofer integration), and room correction. If you're in the US I'd look at a factory refurbished Denon AVR1713 from Accessories For Less.

For speakers I'd look at a couple of different things. At the low end you occasionally find Infinity Primus P163 (reg $140ea) on sale for $80ea. In P163 are front ported and can be placed fairly close to the wall. A step up would be Ascend Acoustics CBM-170SE (for small rooms) or even better their CMT-340SE. Both are rear ported and will need a few inches between them and the wall.

I'd contact Hsu Research and have them size a subwoofer to your room.

 

[jliedeka]

You need to find a receiver that has a subwoofer out. I haven't looked lately but you probably could find a stereo receiver that has it. The other part you may want to consider is video switching. That's harder to find. If you want a receiver that can decode audio from Blu Ray discs, that will probably put you in AVR territory.

I have a secondary system in my bedroom that is sort of overflow from my living room. I have a turntable, VCR,DVD and a couple of older game consoles. I went with a 5.1 receiver that can handle the video switching. I only have two bookshelf speakers, some Energy RC 10s that give me enough bass. The receiver is an older NAD t744 that is rated at 55wpc but 70wpc for two channel. I could also add a sub but that isn't really a priority.

A low end AVR should have enough power and all the features you need. You'd probably spend as much for a stereo receiver with video and sub out. I was doing this research a couple of years ago and concluded that an AVR was the best solution for me. Lower end AVRs offer a lot more for your money now than they did even two years ago. I recommend a 5.1 receiver from Yamaha, Onkyo or HK plus some decent monitors. You could easily stay under your original budget. A good sub will add to that. SVS and Hsu offer great subs for decent prices.

 

[bikemig]

I run a 2.1 HT system and I really like it a lot. It make the set up dead easy and I find the quality of the dialog to be very high. You can easily use an AV receiver for this and it has some advantages over a stereo. One is that AV receivers have a crossover for the sub; the other is that it can play pretty much anything you throw at it. You will want to set the AV receiver to a 2 channel setting which is easy enough. So while an AV receiver is not necessary, it is really helpful esp. since most TVs lack analog outs.

 

[3db]

A surround receiver (AVR) is a better value and bring a lot more to the party. A better value because of economies of scale. The big electronics companies sell thousands of A/V receivers for every stereo receiver that they sell and that allows them to pack in a ton more features for not much more money. What's missing from most stereo receivers are HDMI support, bass management (subwoofer integration), and room correction. If you're in the US I'd look at a factory refurbished Denon AVR1713 from Accessories For Less.

An AVR is not necessarily the better value. It really depends on the following factors. If the receiver is never to be used for more than 2.1, if room correction isn't used and digital inputs aren't being used, than all these staples of an AVR will not make an AVR be a better value than a stereo receiver. There are fellow Audioholics here that don't use room correction with their 5.1 system. In two channel mode, I don't use RC and I also don't use my sub leaving my towers to run full range. Off course this all personal preference.

To the OP, Harmon Kardon and Outlaw are the only receivers I know off that do bass management.

 

[j_garcia]

Nearly all stereo receivers today have a sub pre-out, however AFAIK, NONE of them (except the RR2150) have bass management. I looked up the H/K and I don't see any mention of bass management or x-over, so can someone who has one confirm that it does?

 

[sholling]

Nearly all stereo receivers today have a sub pre-out, however AFAIK, NONE of them (except the RR2150) have bass management. I looked up the H/K and I don't see any mention of bass management or x-over, so can someone who has one confirm that it does?

I believe you're right. A few stereo receivers have a place to plug in a subwoofer but the only one that I'm aware of that actually has a crossover/bass management is the Outlaw and it's more expensive than a lot of very-very capable AVRs that can do a whole heck of lot more.

 

[Adam]

The OP could also do bass management through the sub if the sub had speaker-level inputs and filtered outputs. Not as handy as an RCA cable, but plenty of people do it.

 

[macddmac]

HK990 and I believe NAD makes one too with RC/ bass management .. They're both over 2k though.
cheers, Mac

 

[markw]

I gotta say, I set up a nice sounding little stereo system for a friend who just wanted more than decent sound at reasonable levels in a medium sized room. She wasn't a stereo/HT nut, just someone who wanted better than average sound with no bells and whistles.

I got her a little Sherwood 4105 receiver, some small Polk bookshelves and a little 10" Polk sub. Total cost: Less than $300.

No fancy receiver, no sub out. I just ran the amp to the sub's speaker level in, let the sub handle the cossover duties, and connected the bookshelves to the sub's speaker outs. Result? Pretty impressive sound without any fancy gyrations. Even to me it sounds pretty durn good, partuicularly considering the price.

You can go down the rabbit hole as far as you want, but this is just a suggestion that worked.

 

[3db]

I believe you're right. A few stereo receivers have a place to plug in a subwoofer but the only one that I'm aware of that actually has a crossover/bass management is the Outlaw and it's more expensive than a lot of very-very capable AVRs that can do a whole heck of lot more.

I agree that AVRs can do a lot more but if the features aren't being used or are planned to be used in the future, then the heck of a lot more amounts to absolutely nothing.

 

[3db]

The OP could also do bass management through the sub if the sub had speaker-level inputs and filtered outputs. Not as handy as an RCA cable, but plenty of people do it.

I thought about that too but shied away from that because its a little more involved in the setup.

 

[Adam]

I thought about that too but shied away from that because its a little more involved in the setup.

A little bit, yes, but luckily nothing complicated. Depending on sub location and room decor, the added wires running to/from the sub might be unsightly, but the connections are really easy.

 

[Hobbit]

.... It is just going to be a 2.1 sound system and I am not going to try all of the zoning and streaming music from everything possible. I am just after some really good sound for watching Movies and regular TV. Would it be possible to get that to happen on a budget of around$1,500 - $2,000? I'm just not sure about the receiver.

I just scanned through the posts, so apologize if I'm just repeating information

First of I would consider going 3.1. Even start with a 3.0 and add a subwoofer later. If you want good sound for movies and tv, IMO, a center channel is more important than a sub. Second, if you have cable/satellite and any modern dvd/bd player, they are going to be able to output dolby and dts. Therefore, why not get an avr receiver that can decode these formats and manage these formats to a 3.1 (or higher) system?

For $1500 to $2K you can get a decent setup. Some people around here are happy with their sound bars. Some of these are powered, have wireless subs, easy hdmi connections and decode all the modern formats.

Cheers.

 

[bikemig]

I just scanned through the posts, so apologize if I'm just repeating information

First of I would consider going 3.1. Even start with a 3.0 and add a subwoofer later. If you want good sound for movies and tv, IMO, a center channel is more important than a sub. Second, if you have cable/satellite and any modern dvd/bd player, they are going to be able to output dolby and dts. Therefore, why not get an avr receiver that can decode these formats and manage these formats to a 3.1 (or higher) system?

For $1500 to $2K you can get a decent setup. Some people around here are happy with their sound bars. Some of these are powered, have wireless subs, easy hdmi connections and decode all the modern formats.

Cheers.

I've been very happy with my 2.1 set up and have never felt the need to have a center channel. Obviously people's mileage on this will vary depending on how the room is set up as well as individual taste. I'm just saying it can work very well.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I would just get a great mid-priced AVR from Denon, Yamaha, Pioneer, HK. Bookshelf speakers + Subs sounds good to me.

And IMO, I would never buy anything REFURBISHED. I would buy new or open box from authorized dealers w/ full manufacturer warranty.

 

[sholling]

I agree that AVRs can do a lot more but if the features aren't being used or are planned to be used in the future, then the heck of a lot more amounts to absolutely nothing.

True and in a pure 2.0 music only system that's the case. But not many people want to buy a SPL meter to balance the speakers and sub or have a friend to do it for them or have the knowledge to figure out crossover points if they figure out how to use the sub's crossover. That's why for most people an AVR with an automatic setup routine is a better choice. But people have the right to put themselves through as much work and frustration as they like to save $100. However in this case we have someone that plans to use his 2.1 system with a new 65" TV and unless his new 65" is an old CRT he could probably make use of HDMI on the receiver for cable/satellite and Blu-Ray - both for source switching and for sound.

 

[Irishman]

Hi I am fairly new to the audiophile knowledge and am trying to get a nice sound package to go with a new 65" TV in the bedroom. I had a Bose Cinamate 2 little speaker set up in my bedroom where this TV is. I liked it because it came with speaker stands and I was able to place them real close at the foot of the bed. They did have "big sound" but they were missing clarity. Besides when they were loud to me it was not that loud throughout the house. But I was thinking, for a total price of about $800.00 I could get some nice speakers and a receiver that would blow those away. Things escalated for me and I started looking at $5,000 systems. Overkill!
All I really need is some high quality bookshelf speakers on stands and a sub. That would be fine for the bedroom. But what kind of receiver would be needed for that? Can a regular Stereo be used or would it be better to get an actual A/V receiver? It is just going to be a 2.1 sound system and I am not going to try all of the zoning and streaming music from everything possible. I am just after some really good sound for watching Movies and regular TV. Would it be possible to get that to happen on a budget of around$1,500 - $2,000? I'm just not sure about the receiver.

LOL. Things do frequently escalate into ridonkulous territory when you let yourself think about the possibilities in an AV setup, eh? That said, from just a practical standpoint of making sure everything works, it very much depends on what you want to play through it.

Blu-ray player? Automatically means you'll need a surround AVR in order to connect it via HDMI. Same with most HD cable or satellite boxes, set-top streaming boxes (AppleTV or Roku). Do you want a .1 system because you want monitor speakers - something compact? Or is there another reason you want to go that way?

This B&W 685 monitor compares VERY well to its floorstanding brother the 683, and paired with a good sub, Bowers and Wilkins 612" 2Way Bookshelf Speakers Pair 685B - Best Buy (I'd echo the recommendation give by other forumites of a Hsu sub). As for an AVR, alot of folks are finding the Marantz SR5007 to be quite feature-rich with one of the more full-featured versions of Audyssey MultEQ XT, Marantz 700W 7.2Ch. AV 3D Pass Through Home Theater Receiver SR5007 - Best Buy.

For stands, I find these work quite well. http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Bowers+&+Wilkins+-+24"+Universal+Speaker+Stands+(Pair)/1502082.p?id=1218264251967&skuId=1502082&st=speaker stands B&W&cp=1&lp=1

I hope this helps.

 

[bikemig]

If all you want is something dead simply that improves on the TV sound quality, you could get a sound bar and call it a day. Some of them come with a separate sub. I like the ZVOX 580: ZVOX Audio - Single-cabinet surround sound home theater systems

The sound quality is very good and the set up couldn't be easier.

 

[SonomaComa]

Awesome markw. Nice sound without making it so complicated. It keeps seeming like the more I learn, the less I know. I thought I found a nice Marantz AVR (SR-5007) that would leave some room for future upgrades but I don't think it's 4ohm rated. I don't know if it is a typo but some specs on it said it had 10% THD at 6ohms! Isn't that way past the limit for being audible? Marantz SR5007 - AV receivers - CNET Reviews