Features of different receivers

T

Timma

Enthusiast
Ok, I have just gone through the first over 30 pages of threads in this forum and have gained considerable insight into my choice for a new HT receiver. The bottom line that I keep hearing is features features features. My budget is prob between 500 and 800 (the lower the better) and so I have been looking at models such as the denon 3805, yamaha 2500, pioneer elite 52, 54, 74, harman kardon 635, onkyo 703, 803. I am probably going to be pairing it up with a full set of sapphire speakers as I have a discount through my corporation which makes the set half off:
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20174

Everyone says that these receivers are extremely similar in terms of sound quality which i tend to wholeheartedly believe and that the deciding factor should come down to the features of the individual units. Unfortunately, I have had a hard time finding references and comparisons of these features.

As a result, I would like to poll all you guys on this class of receiver. What features of the models in this price range have made you all hot and bothered? aka GUI, setup, configurability, bells and whistles, etc. I am not too into the video switching and conversion but any positive feature is always a plus.

Also, if anyone has links to this sort of information or up to date pricing, bargain info, that would be sweet. Thanks guys.
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
Timma said:
... I would like to poll all you guys on the $550-$800 class of receiver. What features of the models in this price range have made you all hot and bothered? aka GUI, setup, configurability, bells and whistles, etc. I am not too into the video switching and conversion but any positive feature is always a plus.
Here's what matters in the long run

Amplifier power - look for 75 to 100 watts per channel rated at continuous power (RMS) from 20 to 20,000 Hz at 8 ohms impedance at a stated level (usually no > 0.1%) of total harmonic distortion (THD). Do not sweat differences of 10-20-30 watts as it will make little difference. To make a real difference, you must double or triple the power.

Input & Output Jacks - Count up all the gear you plan to plug in to your receiver. You probably have a TV, DVD player, possibly a VCR or a cable box, and maybe a phonograph. Check out the manufacturers websites for pictures of the assorted jacks on the backs of the AV receivers and decide if they meet your current and future needs. This can be complex, but is important. You don't want to run out of input jacks.

Bass Management - Allows you to integrate the sound of a subwoofer with the other speakers. Look for crossover points that allow you choices as low as 40 or 60 Hz and as high as 80-100 Hz.

Owner's Manual - A good manual is very important when you first start using your receiver. Later their importance fades. I mention this because Denon manuals (I have a Denon receiver) are famous for being terribly written. I have looked briefly at Onkyo and Yamaha manuals and they appear to be much better. Despite this, you should still consider Denon.

Auto Setup & Room Equalization - In the old days, 2-channel stereos had a balance knob that you adjusted until the 2 speakers sounded equally loud, balancing the left and right channels. Now that there are 5 or more channels, balancing them is not so easy. Most AV receivers come with a method, using a built-in pink noise tone, which allows you to adjust the volume of each channel, one at a time, until they were all equal in volume. This is hard to do by ear, and is much better done with a hand-held sound meter. Buy or borrow one (Radio Shack - about $50). I didn’t know how important this was until I eventually got a sound meter and balanced all the channels properly. It should definitely be done. It is somewhat complicated to do, and most people never bother to balance the channels at all, or try to do it by ear, which works poorly for most people.

Because multi-channel surround sound in movies also involves making moving objects sound realistic, the relative arrival times of sounds from the different speakers is important. This required telling the computer chip in the receiver how far away each speaker is from a central seating position, accounting for the numerous room sizes and furniture arrangements that people have. It can be easily done with a tape measure, but many people never bothered with that as well.

Yamaha was first to automate this whole process about 2 years ago. They called it Yamaha Parametric room Acoustic Optimizer (YPAO). It uses a small microphone (included with the receiver) and a computer chip to generate test tones, estimate the distances from each speaker to the microphone, and adjust the volumes of each channel to an equal level. I’ve never used it, but apparently it works pretty well. Only some of the higher priced models have it. Now the other makers are copying Yamaha, but they are probably still in the lead in developing this. Denon and Onkyo now have it too. Remember, it is a useful convenience, but it is not essential because you can always do it manually with a tape measure and meter.

Audio channels - Get at least 5 channels, although most AV receivers now have 6 or 7. Many people use only 5. Nearly all DVD movies have 5 discrete audio channels. The 6th and 7th channels (both in the rear) are artificially derived from those 5, and might be useful in a very large room. In movies, the most important channels are the front 3, left, center, and right. The rear channels are less important, and you shouldn’t spend a lot extra for them.

Appearance & Remote Control - Appearance always matters. It’s your decision. The remote control is also important, ultimately it’s more important than the control panel of the receiver. Unfortunately, I don’t know how to judge whether or not I like a remote control without first using it for a month or two.

Price & manufacturer's warrantee (if any)

I think all those other features are much less important.
 
T

Timma

Enthusiast
Good info, thanx

I appreciate the info guys. The only thing is that all the features you mention appear to be extremely similar between the receivers I am comparing. I'm calling out more to people who own some of these receivers and can tell me what particular options and features they believe sets their unit apart from the rest for them. It can be real frustrating and costly (shipping) to buy and return numerous receivers trying to compare feature sets. And it is impossible to really get down and dirty with the demos at the stores. This way, I have an idea on what people believe makes each receiver unique so I have a good idea what to look for.

Also, that price on the yamaha on ubid looks great but I am a little wary on the refurbished models and the lack of warranty. What would the standard warranty be on a new or authorized refurbished one?

Also, does anyone have an opinion on the speakers i referred to?
 
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M

markw

Audioholic Overlord
Why not simply decide what features you need and want?
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
Timma said:
The only thing is that all the features you mention appear to be extremely similar between the receivers I am comparing. I'm calling out more to people who own some of these receivers and can tell me what particular options and features they believe sets their unit apart from the rest for them.
That was the hidden point buried in all the verbiage I wrote. Those receivers are pretty similar. They all have more similarities than they have differences. Probably the biggest difference among the various makes is in reliability and customer service. If you stick with Denon, Onkyo, Harmon Kardon, or Yamaha, you will get a good product. They are among the most honest at advertising power ratings. I am not familiar with Pioneer receivers.

Timma said:
Also, that price on the yamaha on ubid looks great but I am a little wary on the refurbished models and the lack of warranty. What would the standard warranty be on a new or authorized refurbished one?
Another good website is http://www.pricegrabber.com/ where you can quickly compare prices, including shipping, from a number of different internet sellers. This includes new and refurbished models. Amazon.com and Froogle.com are also useful. Remember, even if you want to buy from a local dealer, it is good to know what discount prices are available online when it comes to getting him to come down in price. I'm sure the dealer knows the online prices, why shouldn't you?

The important thing to remember with internet purchasing is that some manufacturers only offer their warranty with purchase from an authorized dealer who usually charges full retail price. Yamaha is especially rigorous about enforcing that http://www.yamaha.com/yec/customer/warranty/warranty_main.htm. Most, if not all, warranties are for 1 year and most AV recievers last much longer than that. If the price is significantly lower than retail, then it may be worth it to not have a warranty. Most reputable internet sellers offer a 2 or 3-week return policy (sometimes with a 15 or 20% return fee - check for this in advance of ordering) if a product is defective. I have found that AV recievers are either good for a long time, or defective straight out of the box.

Timma said:
Also, does anyone have an opinion on the speakers i referred to?
You don't ask for much do you? :D Sorry, I haven't heard those speakers.
 
X

Xsound

Full Audioholic
I can't confirm, but I believe I have read that they are a "house" brand for Tweeter. Not sure about that, though.

X
 
Hi Ho

Hi Ho

Audioholic Samurai
Swerd said:
Only some of the higher priced models have it. Now the other makers are copying Yamaha, but they are probably still in the lead in developing this.
Actually, all models from the the HTR-5860 ($350) and up have YPAO.

Swerd covered the important features well. I would say most others are extras that may or may not be useful to you.

Yamaha is known for very good DSP's. Most of the DSP's I have heard from other manufacturers simply introduce terrible sounding reverb effects. Yamaha's DSP modes can actually improve the sound.
 
F

fredejo

Junior Audioholic
i personally bought the denon 3805 3 months ago & love it, wish i would have spent the extra $ for the 3806 w/ hdmi switching... but, everyone said the yamaha was the same but cheaper, they are all basically the same though.... i went to sound advice (same as tweeter) & told them the online price which was $220 cheaper & they came down w/ the price to make a sale. it cost me $60 more than online BUT i got an extra 4yr warranty & they are right down the street. happy hunting
 
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