Doing research, need suggestions on sub placement

[captain_tinker]

Folks,
I am trying to do my research by reading the articles on subs and placement, and trying to decide what would be the best way to go. It will be a while before I will be able to get a sub, but that is the next component on my list of upgrades for my HT system. I figure I do about 70% music, 30% movies on my system. I have an SACD/DVD-A/DVD player, just in case that makes any difference. My room is approx 15 ft wide, 21 ft long, the couch is close to the center of the room lengthwise. I have attached a few pics for reference.

I have 3 to 4 places I could potentially place a subwoofer. WAF factor will be very high in this decision, as will the kid factor. Kid factor meaning that I have a 3 year old and a 1 year old, both curious, and like to stick toys who knows where.

That said, maybe I should just forgo a sub for a few years, but you all know that that's easier said than done. In any case I have found that there seem to be many things to consider when looking for a sub. There is the direction it fires in, front firing, down firing, and the sealed box. There is the size of the driver, typically 8", 10", and 12". Then the styles of sub, box and cylinder. They all seem to have their pro's and con's. I have heard that a down firing sub tends to be easier to place in a room. It also sounds like it would keep prying little hands and toys away from the driver. So that sounds like something I may want to lean towards. I would be worried about a port having things stuffed in it though.

My music style is rather eclectic, mainly classical music with lots of oldies, classic rock, 80's and early 90's rock/metal, and even the occasional MoTab (Mormon Tabernacle Choir) thrown in. My kids listen mainly to Disney songs, while my wife listens to the occasional country disc, but sticks mainly to movies and TV.

I would like to find something that had the potential to blow the roof off for showing off to friends, and the occasional need for an 1812 overture fix, but would rarely run it very hard. In other words, no gangsta rap here. It would be mainly for taking care of the bass in music and lower movie frequencies (think Mission Impossible, Rocketeer, etc) that my Titan's cannot handle. They already do a pretty good job at it, but I am looking for that extra punch in the lower regions that they just cannot get to, also so I don't have to turn up the volume so far on the mains just to get that punch.

My receiver does not have speaker level outs to the sub, only a sub pre-out. So that will be important to think of. It would need to be a good match to my current speakers. I have looked at reviews of the Paradigm PDR series, and some praise them highly, and others lambast them for being weak. So I don't know what to think of that. I see that most people here seem to Love the SVS and HSU brand.

So I guess the question at this point is, considering size of the room, placement options, WAF, and Kid Factor, and music and movie listening habits, what do you recommend for size of sub, style of sub, brand of sub, etc. I value your opinions and recommendations and will give serious consideration to them for a future purchase. Thanks folks!

-capT

 

[Sheep]

Well, I've been playing with sub placement in my room for a LONG time. Its mostly for movies so I'm looking for extension, SPL, and tactile response.

I can safely say I found the best possible spot, right behind my couch on the back wall.

You say 70% music, so this spot might not be that ideal for you. The couch shakes alot, almost like I have a tactile transducer, and I don't like it for music, but I'm about 90% HT 10% music.

HTH,

SheepStar

 

[captain_tinker]

Just a quick note, I read something in another post somewhere that mentioned some Martin Logan speakers. I remembered that my local hifi shop sells Martin Logans, so I figured I'd check out online if they had some subs. They have two that sound like they may fit the bill logistically, but since I have not heard them, I cannot make a good judgement call on it.

The two I saw were the Dynamo (10 inch - $600), and the Abyss (12 inch - $900). They can be either forward firing or down firing, and they don't have any ports. So I could avoid having kids stuffing toys down the ports, or sticking fingers into the driver because I could have it down firing. I could also stick it in the corner next to the couch and maybe put an end table above it. The cover that would cover the front if front firing fits over the connectors on the back to keep those covered too apparently.

Next question is, has anyone had any experience with these subs? Would you recommend them at all? And with the size room I have, approx 300 sq ft, would the 10 inch or 12 inch be required, or would it matter?

-capT

 

[Sheep]

Just a quick note, I read something in another post somewhere that mentioned some Martin Logan speakers. I remembered that my local hifi shop sells Martin Logans, so I figured I'd check out online if they had some subs. They have two that sound like they may fit the bill logistically, but since I have not heard them, I cannot make a good judgement call on it.

The two I saw were the Dynamo (10 inch - $600), and the Abyss (12 inch - $900). They can be either forward firing or down firing, and they don't have any ports. So I could avoid having kids stuffing toys down the ports, or sticking fingers into the driver because I could have it down firing. I could also stick it in the corner next to the couch and maybe put an end table above it. The cover that would cover the front if front firing fits over the connectors on the back to keep those covered too apparently.

Next question is, has anyone had any experience with these subs? Would you recommend them at all? And with the size room I have, approx 300 sq ft, would the 10 inch or 12 inch be required, or would it matter?

-capT

From what I've heard about Martin Logan, I would strongly endorse an audition.

SheepStar

 

[westcott]

Just a quick note, I read something in another post somewhere that mentioned some Martin Logan speakers. I remembered that my local hifi shop sells Martin Logans, so I figured I'd check out online if they had some subs. They have two that sound like they may fit the bill logistically, but since I have not heard them, I cannot make a good judgement call on it.

The two I saw were the Dynamo (10 inch - $600), and the Abyss (12 inch - $900). They can be either forward firing or down firing, and they don't have any ports. So I could avoid having kids stuffing toys down the ports, or sticking fingers into the driver because I could have it down firing. I could also stick it in the corner next to the couch and maybe put an end table above it. The cover that would cover the front if front firing fits over the connectors on the back to keep those covered too apparently.

Next question is, has anyone had any experience with these subs? Would you recommend them at all? And with the size room I have, approx 300 sq ft, would the 10 inch or 12 inch be required, or would it matter?

-capT

I have auditioned the Martin Logan Descent and the Depth and can say with no hesitation that they were two of the best sounding subwoofers I have ever heard. I realize the smaller models do not have position feedback but I agree with Sheep that they would be well worth the time to find a dealer to audition them.

 

[captain_tinker]

Folks,
Well I did finally get around to auditioning the Martin Logan Dynamo 10 inch subwoofer. Wow! I must have looked just like this while listening to it. I brought the Telarc 1812 Overture sacd, and the Dynamo was hooked up to their new Pioneer Elite Blu-Ray player (which looked VERY nice by the way), with some other Martin Logan speakers in the wall, (I think they were the Passages or something). They only had it hooked up via HDMI, so the SACD signal wasn't going to pass through it, so they did it with the CD layer. Even with that, I was still blown away by it. And not just by the cannon fire either. Each timpani, each bass drum hit just as though it were right there. (Of course the mains contributed nicely to this as well in this case.) I was pleasantly surprised at just how small it was! That and it was in my price range. The salesman wanted me to compare it to some of the Paradigm subs that they had. The one that he compared it to, that was the same price, was the Paradigm PS-1000. It was also a 10 incher, but it was huge in size, and really shook the room! It was actually almost too much boom though. It hit, and it hit hard, though it seemed a bit late with some of the sounds. It was like I heard the sound first through the mains, and then a split second later, it came through the sub. The shock wave actually made me jump a few times. He also showed it to me with the movie Pearl Harbor, during the bombing scene. I believe it worked VERY well for movies, but not quite what I was looking for for music. The Dynamo worked really well for both. It was VERY tight bass. Very controlled. My wife likes the way it looks. Very small, and simple.
Though I was pleasantly surprised to hear how nice it sounded, I also began to realize that maybe what I really need is to fix where my speakers are currently placed first. They had their Titans away from the wall about 4 to 5 feet off the floor on a small shelf. They really sounded a lot better than mine do. Though, they were using a different receiver too, so that COULD have made a slight difference. But when I heard the Martin Logan mains, I knew that setting up the main speakers correctly would probably make more of a difference than just simply getting a sub. The sub would just add to the enjoyment. So, I am still learning. I guess that's good. But now I am starting to get the upgrade-itis bug. Now I know how some of you feel. After hearing those Martin Logan speakers, wow! That was a neat experience. I may just have to save up for some of those...

-capT

 

[westcott]

Folks,
Though I was pleasantly surprised to hear how nice it sounded, I also began to realize that maybe what I really need is to fix where my speakers are currently placed first. They had their Titans away from the wall about 4 to 5 feet off the floor on a small shelf. They really sounded a lot better than mine do.

After hearing those Martin Logan speakers, wow! That was a neat experience. I may just have to save up for some of those...

-capT

Congratulations! Glad you found a dealer. I would say you are ahead of the game. Some people go their whole lives without ever properly placing their speakers.