Denon X4700H (2020) vs the new yet to be released X4800H (2022-3)

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Chas373

Audiophyte
Hi All I'm asking for opinions on the 4700 vs the new 4800. As of today Thanksgiving weekend the 4700 is available for an unheard of $1500 as it has been selling for 1900 then 2000 and in most places still $2100. The 4800 is $2500 and there doesn;t seem to be many differences at all in features that would matter to me. I'm looking for 3 zones 1st a 5.1 set up, 2nd a 2.1 and 3rd a 2.0. The 4700 will certainly do that. The newer 4800 has 4 sub outputs which I will never go beyond 2. The amp/preamp specs seem to be exactly the same including power output. I will use this to watch movies and to listen to the same music in three rooms simultaneously, wired. Anybody have opinions on whether it makes sense to save $600 on a 2 year old model (but brand new from Denon.) that seems like it will do for me what the new model will do, but for $2500?
 
everettT

everettT

Audioholic Ninja
Independent sub calibration and the option for Dirac would be of benefit for me and hopefully improved performance over the 4700..
 
ban25

ban25

Enthusiast
Well, the key differences as I see them would be:

1) 6 HDMI 2.1 inputs (8K/4K120) vs 1 HDMI 2.1 input
2) 4 independent Sub outputs
3) Direct Live upgradable in March 2023, DLBC upgradable sometime in 2024
4) 1080p on-screen-display vs ancient 480p

Lastly, have you considered the 3800? Given that Denon has added both independent amplifier disconnect and Auro3D to the 3800 -- features previously exclusive to the 4xxx series -- it seems you could go with that model for $1700 and be substantially future-proofed relative to the aging 4700.
 
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C

Chas373

Audiophyte
Well, the key differences as I see them would be:

1) 6 HDMI 2.1 inputs (8K/4K120) vs 1 HDMI 2.1 input
2) 4 independent Sub outputs
3) Direct Live upgradable in March 2023, DLBC upgradable sometime in 2024
4) 1080p on-screen-display vs ancient 480p

Lastly, have you considered the 3800? Given that Denon has added both independent amplifier disconnect and Auro3D to the 3800 -- features previously exclusive to the 4xxx series -- it seems you could go with that model for $1700 and be substantially future-proofed relative to the aging 4700.

Thanks ban 25 for the reply. Here's what I want my set up to be. And what I have already. I have a HTPC with a 2080 TI Graphics card which handles 4 k video as well as the i9CPU. This is main PC also and it's in my bedroom where I spend most of my time when I'm home. It's connected to a Sony 4K LED which I use as a monitor as well as streaming. It connects with a single HDMI cable. I want to connect the TV sound output to the AV receiver. This will be the only video I will connect to the Receiver. (i am mid-60;s so this will be the last major upgrade/update I'll do in my life.) Maybe the TV. So I want to configure the bedroom with 5.1 surround sound and already have those speakers from my 20 year old Denon 5300 which bit the dust 3 years ago. On the other side of the bedroom wall is the living room which I may sometimes want to listen to music and /or watch a movie from there with 2.1 sound. Right now i don;t even have a TV for that room so just the 2.1 stereo sound for music for now. Lastly there's the kitchen one room over where I want just two speakers no sub. So 3 zones in all. it's ok to have all three zones playing one source at all times. This setup will not change till I get so old I won't care about upgrades. LOL.The 3800 doesn't support 3 Zones only 2. And when running nine channels the 20 watts per channel difference between the 3800 and 47 or 4800 I think might be worth having that extra power. keep in mind my old 5300 was good for 175 watts per channel so with the 47-4800 I am already 50 watts less. Two other wants I have, though I don;t think this setup will help with, is it would be great to have voice control over the large mp3 music library on my Windows HDD. I might be able to get it with my iPhone and Siri though.The other want would be to have setup in a web interface, where I can change settings anytime on a tablet or my PC (I'm thinking if I'm in the kitchen I don;t have to come to the bedroom to turn off all but the kitchen speakers or vice versa. Denon has their app for phones but I hear that it's outdated and menus are buried making it difficult to use. Anthem has a receiver in this price range with a web interface but only two zones and less power. I'm not willing to try a boutique company where repair options are limited to mailing it back to them. Just so you know if you haven't figured it out I am not an audiophile yet know good clean sound when I hear it. I think the Audessy room correction should be fine for my needs. So those are my desires and concerns. I thank you for all your input
 
everettT

everettT

Audioholic Ninja
What is your audio setup for each zone, number of speakers and make and model?
Edit:
I will add that if the speaker wire is of significant gauge, watts required to run backround music speakers shouldn't be that demanding. If they're in room higher quality, the wattage depends on how far away from the speakers you will be listening.
 
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Chas373

Audiophyte
What is your audio setup for each zone, number of speakers and make and model?
Edit:
I will add that if the speaker wire is of significant gauge, watts required to run backround music speakers shouldn't be that demanding. If they're in room higher quality, the wattage depends on how far away from the speakers you will be listening.
I previously listed the zone config's in my reply to ban 25
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
To me the primary features in 4800 over 4700 would be the four independent subs and potential for Dirac. 20wpc difference is negligible (takes a doubling of power to gain just 3dB spl); the third zone sounds like the only advantage over the 3800. I'd think the 4700 would be fine unless you want the four sub/dirac advantages......
 
C

Chas373

Audiophyte
To me the primary features in 4800 over 4700 would be the four independent subs and potential for Dirac. 20wpc difference is negligible (takes a doubling of power to gain just 3dB spl); the third zone sounds like the only advantage over the 3800. I'd think the 4700 would be fine unless you want the four sub/dirac advantages......
Thanks lovinthehd
 
everettT

everettT

Audioholic Ninja
I previously listed the zone config's in my reply to ban 25
Yes, but that didn't fully answer the questions I asked. You were kind enough the mention your computer, it's cpu and video card, which isn't really the meat of what your setup is...
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Thanks ban 25 for the reply. Here's what I want my set up to be. And what I have already. I have a HTPC with a 2080 TI Graphics card which handles 4 k video as well as the i9CPU. This is main PC also and it's in my bedroom where I spend most of my time when I'm home. It's connected to a Sony 4K LED which I use as a monitor as well as streaming. It connects with a single HDMI cable. I want to connect the TV sound output to the AV receiver. This will be the only video I will connect to the Receiver. (i am mid-60;s so this will be the last major upgrade/update I'll do in my life.) Maybe the TV. So I want to configure the bedroom with 5.1 surround sound and already have those speakers from my 20 year old Denon 5300 which bit the dust 3 years ago. On the other side of the bedroom wall is the living room which I may sometimes want to listen to music and /or watch a movie from there with 2.1 sound. Right now i don;t even have a TV for that room so just the 2.1 stereo sound for music for now. Lastly there's the kitchen one room over where I want just two speakers no sub. So 3 zones in all. it's ok to have all three zones playing one source at all times. This setup will not change till I get so old I won't care about upgrades. LOL.The 3800 doesn't support 3 Zones only 2. And when running nine channels the 20 watts per channel difference between the 3800 and 47 or 4800 I think might be worth having that extra power. keep in mind my old 5300 was good for 175 watts per channel so with the 47-4800 I am already 50 watts less. Two other wants I have, though I don;t think this setup will help with, is it would be great to have voice control over the large mp3 music library on my Windows HDD. I might be able to get it with my iPhone and Siri though.The other want would be to have setup in a web interface, where I can change settings anytime on a tablet or my PC (I'm thinking if I'm in the kitchen I don;t have to come to the bedroom to turn off all but the kitchen speakers or vice versa. Denon has their app for phones but I hear that it's outdated and menus are buried making it difficult to use. Anthem has a receiver in this price range with a web interface but only two zones and less power. I'm not willing to try a boutique company where repair options are limited to mailing it back to them. Just so you know if you haven't figured it out I am not an audiophile yet know good clean sound when I hear it. I think the Audessy room correction should be fine for my needs. So those are my desires and concerns. I thank you for all your input
Based on the info provided, if the 4700 is a brand new model from Denon, assuming you still get the 3 year warranty then I would say go for it. I like Dirac Live's user interface but a) it is not available for a while and ot everything is known at this point, b) not really sure if you can hear a $100 difference (assuming better) over XT32 SubEQ HT, let alone $1,000). $1,500 brand new for the 4700 is a good ideal if the Denon warranty is intact.
 
-Jim-

-Jim-

Audioholic General
@Chas373 I agree with the majority here on the 4700 for you. Your system sounds similar to my Man Cave / Junk Room (less so since my Misses and I sorted it a bit). My main PC feeds via HDMI to a Denon receiver along with a Cable Box & Blue Ray Player. (It has my extensive library of MP3s and FLAC tunes.) Then there's only one feed only to the TV. Even though the TV is capable of streaming I almost never use it for that, but I made certain to use an HDMI cable capable of transmitting ARC (Audio Return Channel) in case I ever did.

So that's my suggestion for you. Ensure your HDMI Cable feeding the TV can handle ACR (or the newer spec eARC if you want lossless sound) so it will feed the sound quality you want to the receiver.

Then just enjoy!
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Spartan
Thanks lovinthehd
Unless you plan to run 4 subs or are invested in Dirac I think the 4700 is the best deal and you should go for it. We still don't know when Dirac will be ready to go on the new 4800 and how well it's going to work when it's first rolled out. You can always flip the 4700 and then get the 480p down the road if the new 4800 and Dirac turns out to be a huge game changer. Plus you get to let everyone else be a beta tester before you purchase! :D
 
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Mike Up

Audioholic
Well, the key differences as I see them would be:

1) 6 HDMI 2.1 inputs (8K/4K120) vs 1 HDMI 2.1 input
2) 4 independent Sub outputs
3) Direct Live upgradable in March 2023, DLBC upgradable sometime in 2024
4) 1080p on-screen-display vs ancient 480p

Lastly, have you considered the 3800? Given that Denon has added both independent amplifier disconnect and Auro3D to the 3800 -- features previously exclusive to the 4xxx series -- it seems you could go with that model for $1700 and be substantially future-proofed relative to the aging 4700.
RIght now the X4700H costs $1500 and the X4800H costs $2500. $1000 is a lot for some more inputs, HD On-Screen (nice but who cares), Dirac, and more subwoofer outputs. Get the Denon AVS-3 if you think you'll need more 8K inputs for the future, for $150 and save $850. $850 might be worth it if you plan to utilize all those features but then maybe not. I'm saying a No for most. Even the AVR-X3800H is still $200 more than the AVR-X4700H!
 
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Mike Up

Audioholic
Oh yeh, don't think you are future proof with 8K/4K120 inputs! Some 2019 and 2020 Receivers had 4K60 inputs but were not compatible with HDR10+.

These inputs may not be compatible with future HDR formats or higher frame rates of even 4K.

Then again the early 4K HDMI receivers didn't have HDCP 2.2. They couldn't play copyrighted 4K video when it became more mainstream. Those receiver's were 1.4 HDCP and couldn't even pass HDR.

For all we know 3 years down the road when 8K gets popular, the video will only play if your hardware is HDCP 2.4/2.5 compliant or higher, with new HDR formats that are as important for quality as the 8K resolution.

With 4K120, I honestly don't know why people wouldn't want the least amount of lag and connect HDMI directly to TV and use eARC for the audio to the receiver. With the new receivers, they have remote apps for your phones so you can use your phone to see all settings and information displays.

I'm still impressed with my inexpensive AVR-S960H.

It has so much better, more dynamic bass output compared to the Onkyo TX-NR6050. It just makes music sound better even if it's only the bass. It follows my AVR-2312ci in sound quality. I was immediately disappointed in the Onkyo's bass on the first listen. It got better but never 'right' like the Denon's bass.

Not any issues at all either, unlike the Onkyo. No fidgeting around with the receiver because it's quirky, glitchy or weird acting like the Onkyo. The S960H is just "RIGHT".
 
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CharlotteWalker

Audiophyte
Well, the key differences as I see them would be:

1) 6 HDMI 2.1 inputs (8K/4K120) vs 1 HDMI 2.1 input
2) 4 independent Sub outputs
3) Direct Live upgradable in March 2023, DLBC upgradable sometime in 2024
4) 1080p on-screen-display vs ancient 480p

Lastly, have you considered the 3800? Given that Denon has added both independent amplifier disconnect and Auro3D to the 3800 -- features previously exclusive to the 4xxx series -- it seems you could go with that model for $1700 and be substantially future-proofed relative to the aging 4700.
Thanks for the suggestion. Don't panic if you have an essay due for college assignment but are unsure about the subject. You may find a range of essay writing themes on my website, WritingUniverse, at https://writinguniverse.com/exploratory-essay-topics/. These subjects can assist you in writing your exploratory essay and allow you to complete it more quickly, which will save you time.
Thanks for the suggestion.
 
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