Creating My Lossless Library

[joshk03]

The members I met in the 'Dream Home System Planning' thread were very helpful and knowledgeable. Now I am experimenting with a new hobby

I decided to create a lossless music library. But it takes a lot of time, so I have a few questions to make sure I get it right the first time. So far I have only done 1 CD. I downloaded 'Exact Audio Copy v1.3' to create my CRC-verified-FLAC files. This gives me peace of mind that my scratched CDs were read correctly, and gives me a lossless master so I never need to do this time-consuming process again. But I was wondering why there is a choice of bit-rate for FLAC?

Then I used Audacity to make make my 320kbps MP3s. The bit-rate modes are Preset/Variable/Average/Constant. I assume Constant is the most loss-less? I also opted for Stereo instead of JointStereo.

Edit: Removed last paragraph because I discovered that completely removing the ID3 tags fixed the metadata issue.

 

[lovinthehd]

Some info on EAC flac here http://wiki.hydrogenaud.io/index.php?title=EAC_and_FLAC

Might try downloading Foobar2000, couldn't tell you much about WMP, rarely used it. You could use Foobar2000 with an MP3 encoder, too. I've downloaded Audacity and just looked around more than used it, but am quite happy with Foobar2000.

Try this wiki for VBR/CBR differences https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_bitrate

 

[Ponzio]

Like MP3's, the more bits, the better the quality. the FLAC format works on the same principle.

Seriously recommend giving dBpoweramp conversion software a twirl. More flexible & lighter processing footprint compared to Exact Audio Copy. I've tried both and found dBpoweramp to be more reliable.

 

[lovinthehd]

Like MP3's, the more bits, the better the quality. the FLAC format works on the same principle.

Seriously recommend giving dBpoweramp conversion software a twirl. More flexible & lighter processing footprint compared to Exact Audio Copy. I've tried both and found dBpoweramp to be more reliable.

From the link I provided from HA about EAC/FLAC "Since Flac is always lossless the effect of the compression level is small and cannot be compared to the compression of lossy formats."

 

[joshk03]

Some info on EAC flac here http://wiki.hydrogenaud.io/index.php?title=EAC_and_FLAC

Might try downloading Foobar2000, couldn't tell you much about WMP, rarely used it. You could use Foobar2000 with an MP3 encoder, too. I've downloaded Audacity and just looked around more than used it, but am quite happy with Foobar2000.

Try this wiki for VBR/CBR differences https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_bitrate

Hmm, flac.exe was included with my EAC download, but I can't tell what version.
I haven't checked into my player options yet. WMP is low on the list.
Foobar2000 was a great suggestion, that is far better about naming the files. I have Audacity already because it is great for editing narrated vocals. The 'normalize' and 'compress' effects are incredible. If you are mastering audio, it's worth a second look... even though it looks like crap.

Like MP3's, the more bits, the better the quality. the FLAC format works on the same principle.

Seriously recommend giving dBpoweramp conversion software a twirl. More flexible & lighter processing footprint compared to Exact Audio Copy. I've tried both and found dBpoweramp to be more reliable.

I'm not sure lossless would sound different with a lower bit rate, that's why I thought it was odd.
When you say dBpoweramp is more reliable, do you mean like less read errors? EAC could not verify the CRC on tracks 6 and 7 of my second disc. But the test and read matched. Otherwise it's been good.

 

[Ponzio]

From the link I provided from HA about EAC/FLAC "Since Flac is always lossless the effect of the compression level is small and cannot be compared to the compression of lossy formats."

and yet when i rip a cd from the lowest to the highest compression level in FLAC format i can hear a difference. realistically if joshk3 wanted the best possible copy of his cd's he should convert all of his cd's to WAV format. it all comes down to how much data storage do u have and can u personally hear the difference? someone with "golden ears" would insist on a WAV conversion, settle for the best compression level in FLAC or have to settle for 320 kbps CBR (constant bit rate) in MP3 format.

if i'm joshk3 i would rip 4 or 5 of my favorite tracks/cd's in each format & at different sampling levels and go from there. there is no right or wrong way to go. it's all subjective.

 

[sholling]

The easiest way to rip large a number CDs is by making your own homemade RipMonster 3000 (see youtube video link below) or a smaller more affordable version. The second easiest way is with your PC, 2-3 CD/DVD drives and a $39 copy of dbPowerAmp Reference - see youtube video link below for details. Just remember to use a lossless file format and to make and store backups of your music. dbpoweramp's Batch Ripper automates the whole process.

 

[joshk03]

Well I doubt I have "golden ears". And from the last thread, I guess my taste in audio equipment is good, but not golden either. FLAC and 320kbps-MP3 will serve me just fine.
I won't be needing a dedicated ripper, in fact my laptop should be done ripping in under 24 hours.
As for backups, I'm covered there too. My rips are automatically backing up to network storage faster than they are ripping. And I have another harddrive in a fireproof safe I can get out and let sync when I finish.

Does anyone know the format/quality limits are of the Ford SYNC system? I just realized I should test that...

And on the player topic... I wonder how I'm going to play this on that Denon Heos I decided on in the last thread. Well off to bed, goodnight.

 

[-Jim-]

I too have been down this road and after trying EAC, I migrated to dbpoweramp.

Ripping a CD at 16 Bit in FLAC gives perfect copies. There is no benefit to going to 24 bit although some say they can hear the difference. I too keep my tunes on separate Hard Drives in case one fails.

Unfortunately my "old" 2011 car won't play FLAC so I use 320 Kbps MP3 files there.

As for how to play them. I have a small portable SSD that I plug into my Sony & Denon receivers via USB. The newer the receiver, the faster it seems to read it, and that allows you to move around quickly when browsing for the next tune. I used to play them over my home network but it was just too slow for my liking.

 

[sterling shoote]

I started down the CD ripping road when ripping was in its infancy. I can tell you this for sure, for the highest quality, convenience, and ease you cannot beat iTunes. You should just try it. Download the software, select from preferences one of 5 file types you want the rip to be stored: AIFF, wav, MP3, ALAC, or AAC, then, stick a CD in your drive, click import, and your CD will be placed in the iTunes Library with its album art. iTunes will even acquire track metadata. That's it. DONE! And, if you selected ALAC, the Apple Lossless Audio Codex file format you will not even have a statistical divergence between your CD and the ALAC file; but, you will not need to be concerned about running out of space as you might with wav. Now, what's really cool, as your library grows, iTunes will keep it logically organized, you can back-up files to iCloud, you'll have AirPlay wireless capability, you can have iTunes automatically put your library on iPhone and iPod, you can have iTunes create Genius Playlists, you can create CDs of your playlists, and so much more. There's nothing out there that's as easy to navigate. Also, iTunes will allow importation of files up to 24/192 if you have interest in hi-res downloading. At any rate, the bottom-line is iTunes being an integrated music access and storage suite, you not only have instant access to your CD's stored there, you have instant access and download capability if you wish from Apple Music or the iTunes Store to everything that's ever been recorded in recording history. And, one more thing, ALAC, AAC, and AIFF are file types which can be read on any universal player, or streamer out there today. No need to be saddled to flac, ALAC is the future.

 

[its phillip]

Here is a handy guide to set up EAC. I haven't ripped any cds in years so hopefully the info is still current:
https://beathau5com.wordpress.com/2015/07/28/exact-audio-copy-eac-how-to-install-and-setup-eac-to-make-flawless-rips-on-windows/

 

[lovinthehd]

and yet when i rip a cd from the lowest to the highest compression level in FLAC format i can hear a difference. realistically if joshk3 wanted the best possible copy of his cd's he should convert all of his cd's to WAV format. it all comes down to how much data storage do u have and can u personally hear the difference? someone with "golden ears" would insist on a WAV conversion, settle for the best compression level in FLAC or have to settle for 320 kbps CBR (constant bit rate) in MP3 format.

if i'm joshk3 i would rip 4 or 5 of my favorite tracks/cd's in each format & at different sampling levels and go from there. there is no right or wrong way to go. it's all subjective.

I was just quoting, haven't experimented but it doesn't make sense that one lossless is different from another....think I read somewhere about priority for the rip being affected? I'd always used the highest rate, didn't experiment....now I'll have to....

 

[sterling shoote]

EAC, dbpower amp? Come out of your comma. Just kidding; but, the technology today has superseded or made these technologies as passé as they are moot. You can get all there's to get from a CD simply ripping to iTunes or other with preference for ALAC. ALAC also carries ALL metadata. In addition if you are importing a CD-R made from wav file to iTunes, iTunes will seek track metadata from just the album title and artist. No need for grace or dbpower amp for that purpose either. This stuff is so simple in fact today that a cave man can do it; and, the result will be absolutely indistinguishable from CD with whatever equipment.

 

[slipperybidness]

I started down the CD ripping road when ripping was in its infancy. I can tell you this for sure, for the highest quality, convenience, and ease you cannot beat iTunes. You should just try it. Download the software, select from preferences one of 5 file types you want the rip to be stored: AIFF, wav, MP3, ALAC, or AAC, then, stick a CD in your drive, click import, and your CD will be placed in the iTunes Library with its album art. iTunes will even acquire track metadata. That's it. DONE! And, if you selected ALAC, the Apple Lossless Audio Codex file format you will not even have a statistical divergence between your CD and the ALAC file; but, you will not need to be concerned about running out of space as you might with wav. Now, what's really cool, as your library grows, iTunes will keep it logically organized, you can back-up files to iCloud, you'll have AirPlay wireless capability, you can have iTunes automatically put your library on iPhone and iPod, you can have iTunes create Genius Playlists, you can create CDs of your playlists, and so much more. There's nothing out there that's as easy to navigate. Also, iTunes will allow importation of files up to 24/192 if you have interest in hi-res downloading. At any rate, the bottom-line is iTunes being an integrated music access and storage suite, you not only have instant access to your CD's stored there, you have instant access and download capability if you wish from Apple Music or the iTunes Store to everything that's ever been recorded in recording history. And, one more thing, ALAC, AAC, and AIFF are file types which can be read on any universal player, or streamer out there today. No need to be saddled to flac, ALAC is the future.

I hate iTunes!

"Saddled with FLAC"......FLAC is open source, I much prefer that to the closed Apple ecosystem.

Then, the way that Apple tries to lock you into their ecosystem, it's a big part of the reason I dropped my iPhone for an Android instead.

I'm firmly in the camp of EAC / FLAC / FOOBAR2000

 

[joshk03]

I hate iTunes!

"Saddled with FLAC"......FLAC is open source, I much prefer that to the closed Apple ecosystem.

Then, the way that Apple tries to lock you into their ecosystem, it's a big part of the reason I dropped my iPhone for an Android instead.

I'm firmly in the camp of EAC / FLAC / FOOBAR2000

I completely agree. I know better than to use an Apple-only encoding. I do like my iPhone, but I will never go down the path of vendor-lockin with anyone. As for iTunes, it was my player of choice in college. Then I bought a track on there... They made me download an apple-proprietary format. They did allow conversion to mp3, but only up to 192kbps. I was a bit bitter about the low bitrate and the hoops it took to get out of the Apple garden. So I un-installed iTunes and never went back. I had experimented with bit-rate and even just listening on Compaq speakers I could tell a difference all the way up to 256kbps. I wasn't much into music, but I did my research to be sure I was getting what I paid for. I didn't feel I should be limited to less than perfect if I paid full price.

 

[sterling shoote]

I completely agree. I know better than to use an Apple-only encoding. I do like my iPhone, but I will never go down the path of vendor-lockin with anyone. As for iTunes, it was my player of choice in college. Then I bought a track on there... They made me download an apple-proprietary format. They did allow conversion to mp3, but only up to 192kbps. I was a bit bitter about the low bitrate and the hoops it took to get out of the Apple garden. So I un-installed iTunes and never went back.

You have been out of college for awhile since iTunes Store music sold today is 256k AAC; and, BTW, Apple does not make, force, demand, that you do anything. But, for sure, there are a multitude of reasons to have iTunes on your computer, especially for creating a digital file library from CDs. If you ever think this "locked" you in or out of something, think again, since no matter what format you rip to in iTunes you can transfer files to foobar to convert to flac with a single click if you ever thought you were being locked-in. It's a no-brainer. And, you can even import CDs to iTunes as wav files too, so there's absolutely no getting locked in. You might want wav since you are apparently sold on technology/information that actually does go back to when 128k was all you got if you did not have the space for wav. But hey, I don't really care what you do. You obviously are not actually looking for suggestions, just attempting to have your notions on it all accepted here. One of your notions, that you know it takes a lot of time, is only true if you go about it the way you're heading. That's why I mentioned iTunes in the first place. Also, the notion that flac is open sourced and ALAC Lossless is not, is totally moot today. There's not a streamer or universal player out there today that won't do ALAC. Why, because it is now the defacto standard. Look at the specs on any DAC, all of them today do ALAC, why, because more people use iTunes than all of the other players out there combined. But, if you want hard, time consuming, and less convenience by all means go about learning how to do it with obsolete means. Your end product will have no better sound than doing it the easy way.

 

[lovinthehd]

EAC, dbpower amp? Come out of your comma. Just kidding; but, the technology today has superseded or made these technologies as passé as they are moot. You can get all there's to get from a CD simply ripping to iTunes or other with preference for ALAC. ALAC also carries ALL metadata. In addition if you are importing a CD-R made from wav file to iTunes, iTunes will seek track metadata from just the album title and artist. No need for grace or dbpower amp for that purpose either. This stuff is so simple in fact today that a cave man can do it; and, the result will be absolutely indistinguishable from CD with whatever equipment.

Except that iTunes sucks. I used to use iTunes, never again. Maybe if I had an apple computer, but I don't, the pc version certainly sucks.

 

[slipperybidness]

How about actually setting up the info that you see, where the panels are located, and what is displayed in each panel?

Pretty simple when using FOOBAR2000

Last time that I used iTunes, this was not possible, and I'm guessing that it still is not.

I understand why some people may like iTunes and use iTunes, but I ditched it a long time ago for greener pastures (for me, my needs and wants, and how I expect software to work).

 

[sterling shoote]

Except that iTunes sucks. I used to use iTunes, never again. Maybe if I had an apple computer, but I don't, the pc version certainly sucks.

You might want to explore it again. There's absolutely nothing about it that sucks for the desires most folks have today for a music player: CD ripping, iTunes Store, Airplay via Airport Express, auto export to iPhone and iPad, Apple Music, Genius Playlist, Music Browser, iTunes Match, CD burning, Radio, metadata and album art retrieval. It's all in there. My Windows 10 executes iTunes flawlessly and your PC will too. By your comments, I'm guessing you have not experimented with iTunes for over a decade. I'm I right about that bro.

 

[joshk03]

...

It was a quite a while ago when I used iTunes last. I can't recall all my reasons for leaving it. One more that just came to mind - when placed on random (my favorite way to listen) it would fixate on the songs that got the most play. One problem - the random algorithm wasn't very random, so it would repeatedly play the same 6 songs like 200+ times. drr!!! Anyway, I am here for all opinions. I read everything you write carefully. But like I say, my memory of why I un-installed iTunes has faded, but the feelings that caused it remain. Sorry if I can't explain further. It's been so many years.