Buying High End Speakers On the internet

[macersl]

Even though posts that compare brand A to B are generally discouraged, noobs (including myself) continue to do it. I know the answer to these questions is to just listen and see what speakers fit your tastes. My problem is that I plan on buying a set of mains in the near future and they probably will not be from a conventional store but off the internet. I have a hard time paying full price for anything. How does one have the opportunity to listen? There are some high-end stores in my area but I feel very guilty taking their time and resources only to turn my back on them and buy the same product online. Yet I'm sure most people who buy from internet based companies (Axiom, etc.) have never heard the speakers they just plunked their hard earned money down for.

Is this sufficient? Are these people satisfied? Is doing tons of research and blindly (or deafly) buying the product you think's best, good enough?

 

[cornelius]

I bought my current speakers online, a pair of Ohm Walsh Series. This was an internet direct thing - they don't have a retail network, it's all factory direct. The service was very good and the trial period was 4months. I wouldn't recommend buying speakers with retail distribution from the net. Many companies don't stand behind their speakers that are not sold in one of their stores.

I'm really picky when it comes to gear, so after trying tons of unappealing speakers over a long time, I just figured the Ohms were worth a try. Although I don't rely on reviews, I did find a couple of reliable ones on sixmoons.com, and even emailed the reviewer a couple of times before trying them out (because I couldn't hear them first).

I'm very pleased with the speakers, I didn't feel obligated to keep them just because they were in my home, or that I paid for shipping. I actually picked them up myself, and I would have definitely returned them, if I wasn't VERY into how they sounded. In a nutshell the Ohms are very, very impressive little speakers. During the trial period I continued to listen to other speakers (familiar and unfamiliar, in stereo stores (many in my area), hi-fi shows and recording studios). I kept the Ohms.

 

[Methost]

Most reputable online speaker makers stand behind their products and offer generous return policys. If they don't, then I would think about not buying from them.

 

[jaxvon]

I'm not sure about some brands, but Axiom has a list on their message boards of people who own systems and are willing to let you visit their houses for a demo. All you have to do is find someone near you, join the message board, and send that person a private message asking about an audition.

 

[j_garcia]

The company I bought my speakers from sent me a pair to audition for the price of shipping them to the next auditioner. I had them for about 2 weeks and it certainly didn't take that long for me to make up my mind on whether or not I was going to buy them based on what I heard. Had I not heard them, that might have been a different story.

Every one of the well known internet direct companies has a return policy that does cost you something, but at least you aren't trying to unload them on e-bay or something on your own, and they are counting on the quality of their products to convince you that you don't need to return them. Many that I see who do audition in this method, end up keeping the speakers.

For a few brands, you can check www.audioenvy.com to see if there are locals with speakers you may be interested in who are willing to let you audition.

 

[bpape]

Sorry in advance but this strikes a nerve with me.

The whole reason you can't get the same price from the local guy is that he provides you a service - the ability to go listen to the product before you buy. That costs money.

If you want to continue to be able to listen before you buy, I'd suggest patronizing your local brick and mortar store. Mind you, I'm not suggesting paying retail prices. Pretty much any brand may be had at a discount - just don't expect anything ridiculous.

I've been known to drive a couple hundred miles to listen to something that i was considering. You know what? When I want to again, if I've already bought from them and they know I'm serious, they let me do things like take a demo piece from the store and keep it for the weekend and then return it.

THAT is why I don't mind paying the extra.

 

[shokhead]

Right,and they are setup in such a perfect home like place where they will sound the same when you get them home. You have just as good a chance of getting the right pair without listening as you will at the local rip off place. Either way,they can be returned. I'll support them more when they bring the prices down and if they cant,it there problem and loss,not mine.

 

[20to20K]

I agree with this post 100%...and one more point

Sorry in advance but this strikes a nerve with me.

The whole reason you can't get the same price from the local guy is that he provides you a service - the ability to go listen to the product before you buy. That costs money.

If you want to continue to be able to listen before you buy, I'd suggest patronizing your local brick and mortar store. Mind you, I'm not suggesting paying retail prices. Pretty much any brand may be had at a discount - just don't expect anything ridiculous.

I've been known to drive a couple hundred miles to listen to something that i was considering. You know what? When I want to again, if I've already bought from them and they know I'm serious, they let me do things like take a demo piece from the store and keep it for the weekend and then return it.

THAT is why I don't mind paying the extra.

The guy that works in the audio shop is paid to sell speakers. If you take your precious time to visit his shop to audition a pair of speakers you already have an obvious interest and it's then HIS job to try to sell them to you. He's fully aware of your ablity to buy those same speakers online for slightly less so it's also his job to sell you on the advantages of buying them from him.

My salesman from Tweeter successfully sold me on these advantages without me even having to mention I was considering buying online. If he doesn't offer enough advantages (support, demos, delivery, moderate discount, upgrade/return policy etc.) then it's his fault...well maybe fault is a bit strong...it's his shortcoming that makes you decide to buy them online. And you shouldn't feel guilty about that...he had his shot.

My personal opinion is that the advantages most reputible shops offer far
out weigh the discounts that are offered online in MOST cases...especially for speakers.

As a frame of reference I paid $1500 for my Polks at Tweeter than I could have gotten for about $1200 online and I don't regret for a moment that
I made that decision because of the support I continue to get from my salesman.

 

[shokhead]

What kind of support?

 

[j_garcia]

I get just as good, if not better, customer service from the Internet direct companies as I usually do from B&Ms. I DO have great rapport with the local shops that treated me well, and I send them a LOT of referrals because of that. For receivers, I tend to buy them locally for exactly the reasons listed above, and because I am a repeat offender, they always give me deals. Speakers on the other hand, well the brands I'm interested in just aren't readily available to listen to and I can generally find something of similar or better quality than at the local stores for the same price or less. It just makes sense to me.

I definitely want to keep the good local shops in business, because they DO offer worthwhile services and a selection of stuff for me to audition, try out, etc... The shops I have good rapport with also let me borrow stuff. I brought home a brand new pair of Studio 40s for almost 2 weeks from one store. When my PM-7000 had one channel die on me, I took it back to the shop after 2 YEARS, and they gave me 100% credit toward the current model. THAT'S what rapport can do for you, and that is worth a little more to me.

For speakers, I don't mind paying a little more for certain things, but I WON'T pay more if I can get the same or better online for less.

 

[shokhead]

But there's many,many people out there that belive its your duty to shop at local retailers even if they are charging more{even a lot more} just to keep them in business. I have the same discussions on the bike forums. If i can get a sub for $800 at BB and get the same sub online for $600,no tax and free shipping,where do you suppose i'll go?

 

[20to20K]

Example...

What kind of support?

At the same time I bought my Polks I also bought a floor model Denon 3803 reciever for dirt cheap...$628. After a couple weeks I got my surround speakers and realized the Denon had a fault...it would cut off when it was trying to drive 5 speakers at once. It was a power supply problem. I brought the unit back to Tweeter and the salesman (not mine) at the desk was going though the motions of sending it in for repair and looking for a replacement demo 3803 at another Tweeter since 3803's were no longer stocked anymore. My salesman comes in at that moment...saw I was distressed about having to wait for them to find me another demo 3803 somewhere and immediately waltzed in the back and brought me a brand spankin' new 3805 in a box.

The fact that I spent a ton a money there already on my speakers, Universal player, wires, cables, etc was his justification for doing so...he was not obligated to do so nor did I ask. At the time they were selling those units for $1199.

 

[bpape]

I think 20 hit part of it right on the head when he said REPUTABLE dealers. Yes, there are some scams out there both brick and mortar AND on the web.

Also, I was under the impression that this thread was about high end speakers - not internet only brands. Yes. SVS gives GREAT service and makes a nice product for a good price. Yes. Outlaw gives you good service and a decent product at a good price. I would hardly consider those to be high end companies though. There is a difference.

Try to buy something really high end off the web. If you even CAN, I'd bet a LARGE amount of money that the person you're buying from is not an authorized dealer. If they are, they wouldn't be allowed to sell for that price. What does that mean to you? It means that the manufacturer is under absolutely zero obligation to you the buyer to honor the warranty since it was not purchased through authorized channels.

Please understand I'm not saying you should never buy from the web or remotely. I have a customer who wants some nice Paradigm Studios. The only dealer if 50 miles is a jerk and he wont' buy from him. What are his options? Go find another AUTHORIZED dealer on the web and purchase from him.

What are the other bennies to suporting your local store?

- I can go in and take MY equipment in and set it up with theirs after hours and arrange things similar to my setup to get a much better idea of how it will work together.

- I can talk to someone who has actually listened to what I'm looking at and get their opinion. Most of the internet retailers selling the 'name brands' have never even heard most of it, much less probably even know how to hook it up or answer specific questions about compatiblity, features, etc.

- In a reputable store with sales people who are also into the audio world, I can usually get a straight answer. I've had more than one tell me "I wound't buy that - we've had service issues with that model" on things that people are just raving about. Are you going to get that kind of service from a dealer who knows you're just in to use his store and then turn around and buy from someone on the web? Probably not.

- I'll GET a better price than the average person walking in because they KNOW that I may very well buy something from them and have in the past. I'm a good customer and they take care of me. They make exceptions for good repeat customers.

 

[cornelius]

Also, I was under the impression that this thread was about high end speakers - not internet only brands. Yes. SVS gives GREAT service and makes a nice product for a good price. Yes. Outlaw gives you good service and a decent product at a good price. I would hardly consider those to be high end companies though. There is a difference.

Try to buy something really high end off the web. If you even CAN, I'd bet a LARGE amount of money that the person you're buying from is not an authorized dealer. If they are, they wouldn't be allowed to sell for that price. What does that mean to you? It means that the manufacturer is under absolutely zero obligation to you the buyer to honor the warranty since it was not purchased through authorized channels.

That's what I was thinking. There are very few hi-end interenet direct companies. Ohm, Green Mountain Audio... being exceptions.

 

[j_garcia]

I have a customer who wants some nice Paradigm Studios. The only dealer if 50 miles is a jerk and he wont' buy from him. What are his options? Go find another AUTHORIZED dealer on the web and purchase from him.

There are no authorized online Paradigm dealers. Paradigm will not authorize any dealer to sell their products new online (in the US anyway, not sure about elsewhere).

Also, I was under the impression that this thread was about high end speakers - not internet only brands.

Depends on what price range we are talking about, and the definition of "high end". Average Joe would think BOSE is high end, and that spending $2K for one pair of speakers is ridiculous. So I guess we need to get a more clear picture of what the original poster means by high end. I consider high end to be about $25K/pr and up. There ARE internet direct brands that are certainly not in the Average Joe price range.

Now, if we're talking about buying something specific like $25K speakers, you better believe I want to hear them first

 

[AverageJoe]

Average Joe would think BOSE is high end, and that spending $2K for one pair of speakers is ridiculous. So I guess we need to get a more clear picture of what the original poster means by high end. I consider high end to be about $25K/pr and up. There ARE internet direct brands that are certainly not in the Average Joe price range.

Hey! Them's fightin' words!
This AverageJoe may be frugal, but I do have my standards.

 

[j_garcia]

LOL. I kind of thought that might come up... Next time I'll use J6P...

 

[shokhead]

Gee, 2K is high end for the whole fricken HT.

 

[bpape]

Yes J. That was my whole point. His choice is to find another dealer on the web that is a brick and mortar dealer, call him, order them, and have them shipped.

Paradigm is not alone in not allowing any internet sales.

Also, my comments were not meant to be snobby. I just wanted to make sure WHAT we were talking about. I wouldn't consider the Paradigm Studios high end either. They're very nice - don't get me wrong.

It just seemed that people were leaning toward the internet ONLY brands - which mostly are decidedly not high end.

 

[westcott]

I think it would be interesting to see a market survey from BB that defines their average customer.

Most of the customers I see in these warehouse stores would not notice the PQ difference between an Apex TV to a Sony Wega.

If you want a piece of junk, they will sell it to you. If you know better, you may walk away with a good price on a decent piece of equipment. But, I would never suggest that you rely on the expertise of the sales staff to make an informed decision.

So, who are they catering to and for what reasons?

I see a business model that closely resembles the fund raising techniques of Jim and Tammy Baker. A sucker around every corner.