Building a System for music/movies

[Poshag]

Hey everyone, new to the forum here, and relatively new to the audio world as well. I'm a college student here at Notre Dame and am moving into my own place next year and am looking to set up a system for the living room which is about 12x24. At this point what I think I need is two main speakers (floorstanding or bookshelf), a sub, and a reciever. I'd say my budget is around 1500-2000 for the whole thing. What I'm looking for first and foremost is a system which will accommodate my taste in music which is mainly rap (so bass is really important for me). Any suggestions would be really helpful, thanks alot in advance guys

Poshag

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

A true musical rap fan. We don't see too many of you here, but can definitely help out. You want highly efficient towers, a clean sounding powerful receiver, and a killer sub - but it's not necessary. That budget will serve you well. Here's my suggestion for spl and bass:

Towers: CLSC-215

www.cerwinvega.com/products/homeaudiovideo/index.html

I think you can find them for under $300 each. Here's a link:
www.consumerdirectonline.com/clsc-215.htm

Sub: not necessary (you're going to have a hard time beating 4 15" woofers for bass) but a separate sub will help with surround sound (unless you have money to burn), then get something from them:

www.svsubwoofers.com/subs_pcplus.htm

Receiver:
http://www.jr.com/OMBasketDetail.process?RestartFlow=t&OMProductId=3991827&PEEK=BOO&AddToBasket.x=18&AddToBasket.y=6

In the case you find you must have a subwoofer, then I'd recommend this receiver, priced a little lower to allow for budget issues:
www.ubid.com/actn/opn/getpage.asp?AuctionId=800308898&refLoc=searchall

The Marantz receiver will be added as an auction item within a week or two and will actually sell for under $500, and is probably the best receiver you can buy for the money.

The Cerwin Vega's may be a little industrial looking for your room, depending on your decorating tastes. But for rap, you'll be hard pressed to find a better speaker for a better price.

 

[zumbo]

Integrated Amp

Cerwin Vega

Looks like Buckeyefan 1 beat me on the price for the Cerwins. I chose an integrated amp because it looks as though you are building a music system. An integrated amp has the qualities of seperate componets with the pre-amp built-in. It will not receive a radio signal. You will have to add a tuner for that. I don't listen to the radio at home much. Don't know about you. With this set-up, you have some money left for a dvd/cd player.

Oh, one more thing. An integrated amp doesn't have an LFE output for a sub. It is designed for 2-channel listening. If you want an AVR (surround receiver), go with one of Buckeyefan's recommendations.

 

[Poshag]

hey guys thanks for the great suggestions, another question, just to explore my options, I'm living with my girlfriend next year (don't worry I have full rein over all of the noise levels cause she shares my tastes) but she and I were wondering if there are any bookshelf/sub combo's that would work also, mainly to satisfy her aesthetic tastes. Thanks so much for the other suggestions and links im browsing them now

Poshag

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Absolutely, but you'll lose that beautiful bass from the Cerwin Vegas if you do. The SVS powered subwoofers are the best, but are a much more expensive way to go when looking for that bass needed for rap. Bookshelves are better than cubes for music. Stay clear of cubes. If you decide on bookshelves, make sure to look for ones that have an spl rating as high as possible to keep up with your SVS subwoofer (94db or higher). The CV's have excellent specs for the money:

Frequency Response: 24 Hz - 20 kHz
Peak Power: 500 watts*
Sensitivity (1w/1m): 97 dB
6.5" Midrange with Fiber Impregnated Cone
1" Soft Dome Tweeter with Ferro Fluid
Dual 15" Cast Frame High Excursion Woofer
Proprietary Mid and High Frequency Waveguide
Fuse Protection
Elegant Black-Ash or Rich Cherry (CLSC-215-CH) Enclosure
Dimensions (HxWxD): 51.5 " x 16.5" x 19"
Weight: 111 lbs.

Otherwise, you won't have enough power through your receiver to get the volume up where you need it. That's the beauty of the Cerwin Vega's. They are engineered to put out the right amount of bass, midrange, and highs with one amplified signal. When mixing bookshelves and subs, it's much harder because then you deal with bass management. The bookshelf/sub setup favors the home theater over music. There are endless bookshevles out there, but very few with spl's at 94db or higher. Here's a matched 5.1 system for under $1000 that has a high db rating, plays loud, and would sound very good with rap (except the fronts are thin towers, not bookshevles but they take up the same space as a bookshelf on a stand):

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=32861&item=5770730260&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

 

[zumbo]

Mordaunt Short MS912
Center channel
Surrounds

$1099.89 with shipping. These are speakers that are recommended in the 12k system by audioholics here. .

This doesn't leave much for the receiver, dvd/cd player, and sub. But, you would have the whole speaker set-up minus the sub. Or, just get mains, center, sub and receiver for now.

RLA is a member here and also has Mordaunt Short at rlahometheater. May be able to get a better deal.

 

[Poshag]

after looking at all this im really feeling the cerwins, those things just look like beasts. If in the future i want to incorporate rears and a center channel for some home theatre viewing, will the cerwins also be good for movies and whatnot?

 

[Poshag]

Oh and what reciever would work best for these but also leave the possiblity of home theatre open, thanks guys

 

[zumbo]

Center

Surrounds

Sub They also have a 12" model.

As far as the receiver, just go with an upper end model from Yamaha, Denon, Onkyo/Integra, H/K, Marantz, NAD, or Pioneer Elite with the features you need for the best price. Any of them will be great!

 

[zumbo]

You know, just thinking about it, I couldn't even imagine a Cerwin system with four 15's in the mains set to LARGE on the receiver with the LFE signal set to BOTH on a 15" powered sub.

The setting of LARGE sends the full range to the mains. And, the setting of BOTH on the LFE signal, sends the LFE signal to the mains and sub. These settings are in the receiver.

 

[zumbo]

I am a little confused. I noticed that you said you have Klipsch, and voted for them on another thread?
But, you are asking the same question that you replied to with "Klipsch" on the other thread.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

You know, just thinking about it, I couldn't even imagine a Cerwin system with four 15's in the mains set to LARGE on the receiver with the LFE signal set to BOTH on a 15" powered sub.

The setting of LARGE sends the full range to the mains. And, the setting of BOTH on the LFE signal, sends the LFE signal to the mains and sub. These settings are in the receiver.

I just hope they screwed his drywall to the studs as opposed to nailing. For the money, I'm almost sorry I didn't go with CV. Man, that system would rock out. Beauty is, with the spl's where they are, he could power those speakers with a Yamaha 1500, lower end Pioneer Elite, or Marantz SR8400 and save a ton of cash. I think he'd embarass just about any subwoofer with 4-15's. Might not even be necessary. Can you imagine his home theater playing the dvd U571 or Saving Private Ryan in DTS? OMG! I'd love to see the look on the neighbors faces after those flicks.

 

[mulester7]

.....anyone, please enlighten me....is there more than one pre-out to a sub from a surround receiver?....and if there are two, is one governed by the small-to-large adjustment and one is not?....what is this LFE option?.....and lastly, are only the mains up front and the sub affected by the small-to-large adjustment?......

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

.....anyone, please enlighten me....is there more than one pre-out to a sub from a surround receiver?....and if there are two, is one governed by the small-to-large adjustment and one is not?....what is this LFE option?.....and lastly, are only the mains up front and the sub affected by the small-to-large adjustment?......

My Denon only has one pre out to the sub. I use a Y adaptor since the sub has two rca ins. Now that I have two subs, I use two Y's. If you have two, I'm not sure. Check the manual. My old Sony had two, but were both governed by the small/large adjustment. The LFE is the crossover in the receiver that cuts out the bass below a certain Hz. My Denon has a 40,60,80 and 100 Hz option. I can select any of my speakers as small or large, so I can opt out the low frequencies for all of them, or just a few. The LFE+Main option allows all the low frequencies to go to the sub and the mains. That's useful if you have mains with larger woofers.

 

[Poshag]

haha hey i just have klipsch computer speakers, only reason that i voted for them sorry to confuse

 

[Poshag]

hey buckeye and zumbo, you guys really know your stuff, thanks so much for the help, those cerwins seem like the best option for me right now, what reciever should I look into, you mentioned the yahama 1500, will that provide enough power (and would it also leave open adding maybe a center and rears in a few years when i have the cash?

 

[mulester7]

"I use a Y adaptor since the sub has two rca ins"

.....Buck, thanks for the response, and I have one more question.....are there options at sub level with the two rca in's?......

 

[zumbo]

Yes, the 1500 is an AVR with outputs for the center, surrounds, and surround back or presence speakers. It's a 7.1 receiver.
1- Front right
2- Front left
3- Center
4- Right surround
5- Left surround
6- Right surround back, or presence right front
7- Left surround back, or presence left front
.1- LFE out for powered sub.

The 1500 will be enough, but you may be able to find a good deal on a 2500. If so, I would go that route.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

"I use a Y adaptor since the sub has two rca ins"

.....Buck, thanks for the response, and I have one more question.....are there options at sub level with the two rca in's?......

No, since the sub accepts a mono signal, it won't matter if you use one or both. The two inputs at the sub are for left and right. My old Sony surround receiver had two, so I hooked both outs up to both ins. Most material sends the low frequencies through both the left and right channels, unless you are listening to some old AC/DC music like the beginning to "You shook me all night long." I've read more times than not by sub mfg's to use a Y adaptor when hooking them up from the receiver. I'm just being on the safe side.

 

[mulester7]

.....Buck, from your very good details I surmise this....the two input options at sub level are making it possible, one last time, for pure left and right to be inputted into the sub where it will be mixed mono by the pre-amp section of the sub....now, your mixing of left and right already happens at pre-amp level of your receiver to output the signal to the sub....KILL the Y to the sub....that's just more splitting by rca's to bring possible noise/interference/distortion....AND, this is assuming that the woofer element of the sub is NOT a dual voice-coiled woofer....anyhow, if your system were mine, Buck, I would turn the sub off and listen to the other 7 speakers....I would choose ALL the speakers less the sub to be controlled by the small-to-large adjustment....I would bring the adjustment as LARGE as possible NOT hearing bass bottom-out by distortion or confusion to the ears....guys, if you're not after CLEAN with your system, you're NOT an audiophile waiting for the right equipment to show up that you want to be pushed, ""FLAT""....after adjusting the small-to-large adjustment on the regiment of mains/center/surrounds/rears to CLEAN, bass-wise, I would then turn the sub on, and bring the volume of it to supporting the cause in the upper room, CLEANLY....I would NOT want the sub controlled by the small-to large adjustment to allow the "option" of the frequency cut "ceiling" of the sub's signal to enter into the upper room a tad, and the word emphasized here from start to finish, is CLEAN......