Bipole/Dipole or Direct

[gcmarshall]

For a 5.1 home theater set up, should I use a bipole/dipole speaker or a standard direct firing speaker? These will be used for surround (back) sound and placed on bookshelves.

What are the key criteria one should consider when choosing between these two types of rear speakers.

I will be watching movies, watching DVD-based concerts, watching satellite TV, etc.

 

[jaxvon]

The general idea is that bi-pole or multi-polar surrounds are better for movie effects while multi-channel audio is more geared toward direct-radiating speakers. If you can, listen to both with some material you know well (concerts and movies) and see what you think. I personally use direct radiating, but that was more of a decision based on cost. When I go speaker shopping again, I'll be sure to weigh the surround option.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Bi-poles are generally placed on the side walls, and rear surrounds behind you. Some dual facing surrounds feature a switch to use as either a dipole or bipole (like the Polk FXi5 or FXi3).

http://www.polkaudio.com/education/tech_article.php?id=27

 

[lubmar]

If the distance from You to surround speakers is "small" the "ADP Paradigm" like speakers is better option, if the distance is "big" the standart/direct shuold be OK.

 

[j_garcia]

I prefer monopole surrounds in general unless you have a room that will allow the correct placement of the bi/dipoles relative to your seating position. I use monopoles in my setup.

Even if the surrounds are close to you, you can position and calibrate them so they are not annoying.

 

[Sheep]

You know some dipole speaker can be switched to direct, or bi/dipolar. I suggest a pair of these, then you can have both!

Sheep

 

[j_garcia]

You know some dipole speaker can be switched to direct, or bi/dipolar. I suggest a pair of these, then you can have both!

M&K has TRIpole surrounds, and I think they are one of few places that do. When properly placed, these are the best sounding surrounds I think I've heard.

 

[Sheep]

M&K has TRIpole surrounds, and I think they are one of few places that do. When properly placed, these are the best sounding surrounds I think I've heard.

Crazy M&K, what will they do next. I REALLY want to hear one of their setups, mainly a THX one....

Sheep

 

[supervij]

I'm thinking of upgrading my setup. I want to get rid of my rear centre speaker move my monopole surround speakers to the rear of the room and use them as rear surrounds, and I wanna get some mono/bi/dipole speakers for surrounds. The reason I want surround speakers to be selectable between mono and bi/di is that I listen to both movies and surround music, so I want both.

So there are two problems. One -- I want the speakers to be selectable. Like, I dunno, having a switch that will make the speaker monopole, or make it bi/dipole. Two -- since the position of the surround speakers are very different for movies and music, I want to easily move it from the stand that's behind the couch to a hook or shelf on the side walls and back again.

My search came up with the M&Ks as described here, but the tripoles aren't switchable (I don't think) from mono to bi/di/tri as I hoped. Are there any speakers that are switchable and would be easy to move as described above?

cheers,
supervij

 

[jcPanny]

Axiom Audio QS8

Reviews by Audioholics and others have found the Axiom QS8s to be a great surround or surround back speaker for multichannel audio and HT listening.

If you have way too much money, you could always buy two different pairs of surround speakers (1 direct, 1 bipole/dipole) and use a speaker A/B switch to select which pair of speakers to use depending on the source material.

 

[supervij]

Sadly, I don't have way too much money. When I do, I'll have separate rooms -- one for movies and one for music. In the meantime, I have to make do with using one pair or surrounds to do double duty of bi/dipole side surrounds and also monopole for SACDs and DVD-As.

I looked at Axiom's page for the QS8, and there doesn't seem to be any mention of being able to switch from monopole to bi/dipole (or in this case, quadpole). Or did I miss something? http://www.axiomaudio.com/qs8_info.html#

So are there any speakers that are switchable between monopole and bi/di/quadpole?

cheers,
supervij

 

[Jack Hammer]

My search came up with the M&Ks as described here, but the tripoles aren't switchable (I don't think) from mono to bi/di/tri as I hoped. Are there any speakers that are switchable and would be easy to move as described above?

cheers,
supervij

I have M&K K4 tripoles, K4, and love the way they sound. They are not adjustable and are rather small, but they put out alot of sound.

Sometime next year I plan on upgrading to the SS150THX surrounds SS150THX as they are a better match for my fronts. These are adjustable between tripole and direct radiating via a jumper, or you can by an aftermarket remote control to switch them. Poke around their website, they have some other models, might be the pro line, that have up to six selectable configurations.

HTH

Jeff

 

[Sheep]

Sadly, I don't have way too much money. When I do, I'll have separate rooms -- one for movies and one for music. In the meantime, I have to make do with using one pair or surrounds to do double duty of bi/dipole side surrounds and also monopole for SACDs and DVD-As.

I looked at Axiom's page for the QS8, and there doesn't seem to be any mention of being able to switch from monopole to bi/dipole (or in this case, quadpole). Or did I miss something? http://www.axiomaudio.com/qs8_info.html#

So are there any speakers that are switchable between monopole and bi/di/quadpole?

cheers,
supervij

I don't know about everyone else, but I wasn't tlaking about Axiom. They are just quadropole's.

Energy has switchable speakers.

Linky: http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/products/product-page.php?id=27

thats the cheapest model they make with that feature.

SheepStar

 

[GregBe]

Sadly, I don't have way too much money. When I do, I'll have separate rooms -- one for movies and one for music. In the meantime, I have to make do with using one pair or surrounds to do double duty of bi/dipole side surrounds and also monopole for SACDs and DVD-As.

I looked at Axiom's page for the QS8, and there doesn't seem to be any mention of being able to switch from monopole to bi/dipole (or in this case, quadpole). Or did I miss something? http://www.axiomaudio.com/qs8_info.html#

So are there any speakers that are switchable between monopole and bi/di/quadpole?

cheers,
supervij

I wouldn't worry too much about finding a switchable surround. I currently have the tripoles, but I used to own Cambridge Soundworks S300 surrounds. Although I initially bought them thinking the switching would be the coolest thing in the world, I soon found out that I found one setting and just left it there (and I am a constant tweaker ). I would suggest demoing both styles and going with what you like better.

The thing is when you take all of the theories out of it, they are more similar than different. Dipoles are more diffuse, but certainly have a lot of directionality when needed. Direct radiators are more directional, but when set up right will also provide adaquate envelopment.

Here is my take on the M&K Tripoles, although I am obviously biased. The Tripole is basically a direct radiating speaker that also has dipole drivers firing front and back. For me it has all of the advantages of a dipole and a direct speaker with none of the drawbacks of either. I would say it does a great job with directionality like a direct speaker, and a great job of envelopment like a good dipole/bipole and it does an average job of diffuseness (you have the tweeter firing at the listening position, so a true dipole would perform better with this quality). Since I have it set up to my sides and high up on the walls, this isn't much of an issue either. It great for me on both movies and multichannel music.

Greg

 

[supervij]

Jack, thanks for that link. I checked it out, and it looked promising, but it says that it operates in two modes -- dipole and tripole. The dipole is for movies, but the tripole is for music? I thought that for multichannel SACDs and DVD-As, it's best to have direct radiating. Tripole would seem to add much more sound that is not intended. I don't think these can operate as solely a direct radiating speaker. I wonder how speakers like those would sound used for discrete m/c music.

SheepStar, I appreciate the link to Energy. They've got two that look like what I want: The RC-R and the V2.0Ri. Timbre matching question: are they anywhere near my Athenas? I mean, would this be a bad match for me sonically?

Are there any other similar speakers (that can be direct radiating and bi/dipole at the flip of a switch) I should be looking at?

cheers,
supervij

 

[Sheep]

Jack, thanks for that link. I checked it out, and it looked promising, but it says that it operates in two modes -- dipole and tripole. The dipole is for movies, but the tripole is for music? I thought that for multichannel SACDs and DVD-As, it's best to have direct radiating. Tripole would seem to add much more sound that is not intended. I don't think these can operate as solely a direct radiating speaker. I wonder how speakers like those would sound used for discrete m/c music.

SheepStar, I appreciate the link to Energy. They've got two that look like what I want: The RC-R and the V2.0Ri. Timbre matching question: are they anywhere near my Athenas? I mean, would this be a bad match for me sonically?

Are there any other similar speakers (that can be direct radiating and bi/dipole at the flip of a switch) I should be looking at?

cheers,
supervij

I think the one I linked to will be the closets match to your Athena's. Also, It will be the cheapest. The RC-R is over a grand I think, and the V2.0Ri is even more, possibly double.

What are you using for surrounds right now?

SheepStar

 

[supervij]

Actually, SheepStar, I just checked with a local store, and the RC-R is $699 CND/pair, which (to me) is still crazily expensive. (The V2.0Ri is more than double that at $1699 CND/pair!) I forgot to check out the one you recommended, but I hadn't considered it before, being as it is bipole and dipole, not direct.

I'm currently using the Athena Audition AS-B2s as my surround speakers.

Greg, I appreciate you giving me your opinions on your tripoles. Are they really direct enough that they sound good for discrete, m/c music? And positioning -- would they be easily movable from the side wall (for movies) to a stand a bit behind me and to the side (for music)? I have a few DVD-As that give speaker placement tips, and they all suggest the surrounds to be behind, slightly to the side, and at ear level of the listener. Which is not where surrounds should be for movies, at least not for bi/di/tripoles.

. . . och . . . I'm starting to get a headache from trying to figure all this out . . . I'm outta here -- gotta take a break!

cheers,
supervij

 

[supervij]

Is there anyone who uses a non-direct radiating speaker for surrounds with SACDs and DVD-As? If so, I have two questions:

1. With a bi/di/tri/quadpole surround speaker up high and to the side, how does this sound and how does it compare with a direct radiating surround speaker at ear level, behind and slightly to the side?

2. With a bi/di/tri/quadpole surround speaker at ear level, behind and slightly to the side, how does this sound compare with a direct-radiating surround speaker at the same spot?

I guess since I always wanted to accomodate m/c music in my setup, I opted for direct radiating surrounds. Now, after realizing that I think I'd prefer more diffuse surrounds for movies, I'm wondering how this will affect my enjoyment of SACDs and DVD-As, both of which I adore listening to.

Whew! Hopefully I simplified my questions to the point of being understandable!

cheers,
supervij

 

[jcPanny]

I looked at Axiom's page for the QS8, and there doesn't seem to be any mention of being able to switch from monopole to bi/dipole (or in this case, quadpole). Or did I miss something? http://www.axiomaudio.com/qs8_info.html#

So are there any speakers that are switchable between monopole and bi/di/quadpole?

cheers,
supervij

I didn't say the Axom QS8s had a switch. I said that they performed well for both Movies and Multichannel audio as reviewed by Audioholics. I think that the switch is kind of a gimmick because the switch cannot cause a single tweeter and woofer to point directly at the seating position like a direct radiating speaker would.

 

[GregBe]

The Tripoles are a true direct radiating speaker that also has drivers that point forward and backward, so yes it is direct enough for MC music. Before I mounted them in their current position, I had them behind me. It also worked very well.

I had one additonal thought about the switchable surrounds. When I had them, the levels were different when I switched from direct to dipole to bipole. If you are picky about your calibration levels, you need to adjust the surround levels when you switch the dispersion patterns.