Bi-Wired

[gumdigger]

Hi
I currently have the klipsch F2 as my fronts, C2 as my center and Yamaha RX-V657 AMP. Bi-wired gave me impressive powerful sound through my fronts. however iam worried they might get damaged as my amp is 95 watts per channel and F2 are 100 watts( i do not know whether each driver is 100 or total is 100). they way i have bi-wired is by hooking up a speaker to set A to one of the terminals of the speakers and B to the other terminal.

i thougght i should ask the experts..

 

[mazersteven]

Welcome to the forum

Bi-Wiring does absolutely nothing. There is no sonic difference, and no performance difference.

Your receiver should be fine with those speakers.

 

[D.R. Payne]

Unless you are also bi-amping, bi-wiring does nothing.
Here's a good page by an engineer @ Klipsch explaining bi-amping:
http://forums.klipsch.com/blogs/andyw/archive/2007/09/07/bi-amplifying-or-bi-amping.aspx

{Edit}
Here's his bi-wiring article, which I enjoy
http://forums.klipsch.com/blogs/andyw/archive/2007/08/31/bi-wiring.aspx

 

[gumdigger]

well the klipsch explain it really well. but their speakers documentation is shocking. anyway back to my question. is each driver 100 watts? or is it 50/50?

 

[OttoMatic]

The 100 W rating on the speakers is a general ballpark number for the speaker as a whole. But whether you bi-wire or not, the receiver will be fine and the speakers will be fine. Your problems will begin when you're playing it very loud. If things start to sound distorted or otherwise taxed, turn down.

 

[PENG]

Unless you are also bi-amping, bi-wiring does nothing.
Here's a good page by an engineer @ Klipsch explaining bi-amping:
http://forums.klipsch.com/blogs/andyw/archive/2007/09/07/bi-amplifying-or-bi-amping.aspx

{Edit}
Here's his bi-wiring article, which I enjoy
http://forums.klipsch.com/blogs/andyw/archive/2007/08/31/bi-wiring.aspx

I gave up reacting to bi-wire posts long ago but this gentleman (engineer you said) was talking about "electrical engineering standpoint". In that case, let me point out that there is in fact a difference. In his article he seemed to focus only on resistance, inductance and capacitance of cables. If he had read some of the articles related to this topic from a few other speaker manufacturer sites including B&W, Axiom and Vandersteem, he might have a different perspective. It isn't so much about the impedance characteristics of cables. It is mainly about the other factors, e.g. electromagnetic interference, back e.m.f. etc., that cause some "experts" on the othe camp to believe bi-wiring can make a difference.

I don't believe bi-wiring could result in audible improvements either, but I have to say this person (engineer?) was not addressing the very factors cited by at least a few reputable speaker manufacturers who also based their claim on electrical theory.

 

[fmw]

Theories aside, no one has ever been to hear a difference between biwired and non-biwired speakers in an objective listening test. It's been tried hundreds of times. There might be an electrical difference. There is no audible difference.

 

[PENG]

Theories aside, no one has ever been to hear a difference between biwired and non-biwired speakers in an objective listening test. It's been tried hundreds of times. There might be an electrical difference. There is no audible difference.

Agree, try telling that to Vandersteen.........

http://www.vandersteen.com/pages/Answr7.htm

I sometimes wonder, why aren't there people setting up some sort of ABX cafe where people can bet on whether they can tell between amps, receivers, cables, speakers, CD players etc. Even that Klipsch engineer said he would bet $100, in fact he was just going to give it to people who could tell the difference.

 

[B3Nut]

Speaker power ratings are for the most part meaningless, they're at best a guideline and at worst babble from the marketing weasels. In short, don't worry about it. Whatever the speaker, give it good clean power and don't play the system so loud that distortion results whether it be from driver strain or an underpowered amplifier being pushed to the point of clipping. Your Klipsch speakers are a fine match for your Yamaha...the Klipsch F2's are highly efficient (95.5dB @ 2.83V/1M) and the Yamaha has a nice clean strong amplifier stage. 10 watts into the F2 will get you to 105.5dB and 100 should hit 115.5dB, which is likely approaching the mechanical limits of the drivers, to say nothing of one's eardrums! Remember, a doubling in loudness (10dB) requires a 10X increase in amplifier power. This, of course, means that to get twice the volume as you get at 100 watts, requires 1000 watts. Fun, eh?

You're quite well matched up. Load up the tunes, pour your favorite libation, and enjoy.

Todd in Cheesecurdistan

 

[fmw]

Agree, try telling that to Vandersteen.........

http://www.vandersteen.com/pages/Answr7.htm

I sometimes wonder, why aren't there people setting up some sort of ABX cafe where people can bet on whether they can tell between amps, receivers, cables, speakers, CD players etc. Even that Klipsch engineer said he would bet $100, in fact he was just going to give it to people who could tell the difference.

You have to understand where Vandersteen has positioned themselves in the marketplace. Their audience wants audible differences and they have to play to their audience. Their article doesn't say a thing about objective listening tests. I would be pleased to include them in double blind listening test on their own speakers with a $1000 bet on the outcome. I could always use a spare grand, that's for sure.

 

[PENG]

Hi
I currently have the klipsch F2 as my fronts, C2 as my center and Yamaha RX-V657 AMP. Bi-wired gave me impressive powerful sound through my fronts. however iam worried they might get damaged as my amp is 95 watts per channel and F2 are 100 watts( i do not know whether each driver is 100 or total is 100). they way i have bi-wired is by hooking up a speaker to set A to one of the terminals of the speakers and B to the other terminal.

i thougght i should ask the experts..

Typically the bass and the mid range drivers take much more power than the tweeter. If you want to find out how much each driver on its own is rated for you would have to ask the manufacturer. Did you remove the links between the speaker terminals?

 

[fmw]

I'm not going to suggest that speaker power ratings are meaningless but I do agree that they aren't anything for you to worry about in your case. They are normally more than adequate for the purpose. Most music listening at normal levels in normal rooms with speakers of average sensitivity require about 1 watt of average amplifier power with perhaps 8 to 10 watts for the peaks. By normal I mean the same loudness that acoustic instruments or singing would have in a live environment. 5 watts per channel in my listening room would be uncomfortably loud to me. Each addition of 3 db to the output requires a doubling of the power but things will get very loud indeed way, way before you get to 100 watts or even 20 watts.

It's a good thing to have adequate power overhead in an amplifier but audiophiles have taken that to extremes as they do almost everything else in audio. It is part of the hobby, I guess. Perhaps it stems from rock bands putting out enough decibels to damage hearing. I don't know. I've read posts that recommend a minimum of 200 watts per channel of amplification. It gives me a chuckle. 200 watts would destroy most speakers but, luckily, they aren't used at full power or anywhere near it for long enough to hurt anything.

 

[PENG]

200 watts would destroy most speakers but, luckily, they aren't used at full power or anywhere near it for long enough to hurt anything.

I do feel good about having 200 or more watts for peaks and headrooms etc., but if someone would offer me one of those 25W Lexicon class A amp for my 200W Adcom I will pay him $1000 on top.