Bi amping my speakers with 2 Emotiva amps

[tungstenmw]

I am thinking of getting 1- 7 channel amp from emotiva to drive my 7.2 system and then an extra 2 channel amp from emotiva to bi amp my fronts. I'm wondering what the best way to wire my system is for bi amping my fronts. I have Boston Acoustics VR-2s and a Yamaha RX-V4600. After thinking about how this would work I came to the conclusion that I would have to run analog cables from my pre outs on the RX-V4600 fronts and then split them with a y-connector, thus splitting the signal. Then, connect the split signal analog cables to the amps. Then, connect the speaker wire from the amp to the high and low driver speaker connectors. Is that the best way to do this or am I missing something? The Yamaha would be handling the crossover, correct?

 

[Josuah]

A better question would be whether or not what you're doing (passive bi-amping) is actually worth it. Just about anyone who's into the technical stuff will tell you it's a waste of money.

 

[Leprkon]

I came to the conclusion that I would have to run analog cables from my pre outs on the RX-V4600 fronts and then split them with a y-connector, thus splitting the signal. Then, connect the split signal analog cables to the amps. Then, connect the speaker wire from the amp to the high and low driver speaker connectors. The Yamaha would be handling the crossover, correct?

If you use a Y splitter, you would be downstream from the Yamaha, so it could no longer influence the signal crossover... I'm not familiar enough with the 4600... does it have 7.1 channel output at low-voltage level ? You might have to use the prescence or "Zone 2" channel (if they will also go out at line level) if you want the Yamaha to do the crossover.

You actually have to have a "high freq" channel output and a "low-freq" channel output from the receiver to the amps. You can't do the the split off just one channel... I don't think...

 

[j_garcia]

I would drive the "high" portion of the speaker off the 7ch amp and use the 2ch amp to drive the "low" portion of the speaker. There is no doubt you will get a lot more headroom doing this, but the question is actually, do you NEED that much power/headroom? Unless you have a huge room, the emotiva amp is aready going to give you plenty of power, but I would say why not just add a 2ch amp for the mains and see what that gives you. Then they have plenty of power and the receiver has less to do with the surrounds.

 

[Josuah]

You need an external crossover that will perform the high-pass and low-pass filtering to match the crossover that's inside the speaker, and then bypass the speaker's internal crossover. That's active bi-amping.

 

[mtrycrafts]

I am thinking of getting 1- 7 channel amp from emotiva to drive my 7.2 system and then an extra 2 channel amp from emotiva to bi amp my fronts. I'm wondering what the best way to wire my system is for bi amping my fronts. I have Boston Acoustics VR-2s and a Yamaha RX-V4600. After thinking about how this would work I came to the conclusion that I would have to run analog cables from my pre outs on the RX-V4600 fronts and then split them with a y-connector, thus splitting the signal. Then, connect the split signal analog cables to the amps. Then, connect the speaker wire from the amp to the high and low driver speaker connectors. Is that the best way to do this or am I missing something? The Yamaha would be handling the crossover, correct?

I am putting my suggestion behind Joshua's. Why do you think you are lacking something now? What are the speaker specs, impedance and sensitivity.

 

[tungstenmw]

responses

Here's answers to all the questions. I'm starting to lean towards just getting the 7 ch amp and using that w/o bi-amping the fronts.

1) What's the problem with passive bi amping?

2) no I probably don't NEED this right now, but I would like to drive all my channels with more than approx 60 wpc (Yamaha says it's 130 wpc but we all know the all channel driven fallacy) The emotiva amp looks like a sweet deal.

3) where do i purchase an external crossover if i do decide to bi-amp?

4) I do feel like I'm lacking something. I just want the cleanest sound possible. I feel like an external amplifier will help with that. The speaker specs can be found in the link in my profile. Boston Acoustics VR2s for fronts and the rest are listed. Impedance - 8 ohms. Sensitivity - 91 - 93 db between all speakers.

 

[Josuah]

1) It's complicated. I suggest looking at http://hometheaterhifi.com/'s forum for a detailed explanation by some intelligent people.

3) Finding an external crossover won't be too hard. Making it the exact same as the crossover inside the speaker will be, unless you can get Boston Acoustics to give you the info. If you implement a bad crossover, your speakers will sound bad. And remember, you need to open up the speaker cabinet and bypass (i.e. disconnect) the crossover inside.

4) Can you borrow a decent amplifier from a friend or something to try out? You may be lacking good sound for other reasons, like the room or speaker placement.

 

[tungstenmw]

reply

Getting and installing an external crossover sounds complicated. I am electronically savvy but I don't wanna mess with what are already good speakers. I'm leaning towards just getting the 7 ch amp.

I don't have any friends that have amps. If i get one and it doesn't really improve the sound that'll be ok. I'll use it for a zone 2 and zone 3 output. Either way I win.

 

[Reorx]

I would just get the 7channel amp, and see how that sounds. Your speakers are pretty sensitive at 91-93dB, you'll hear a noticeble improvement.
Use your receivers pre-outs. But I'm sure you already know that.

Enjoy.

Reorx

 

[mtrycrafts]

1) What's the problem with passive bi amping?

Not much is gained. You still have that passive crossover, not very good.

2) no I probably don't NEED this right now, but I would like to drive all my channels with more than approx 60 wpc (Yamaha says it's 130 wpc but we all know the all channel driven fallacy) The emotiva amp looks like a sweet deal.

There is no fallacy, just misconceptions. That Yam puts out 130watts 2 channels driven.
What software do you have that demands full power from all channels at the same instant??? That is different than having loud signals in different speakers what appears to be at the same time. Can you count to 30 or less milliseconds? Too fats for me.

3) where do i purchase an external crossover if i do decide to bi-amp?

Then you need to bypass the internal crossover and then you are getting into difficult territory.

4) I do feel like I'm lacking something. I just want the cleanest sound possible. I feel like an external amplifier will help with that. The speaker specs can be found in the link in my profile. Boston Acoustics VR2s for fronts and the rest are listed. Impedance - 8 ohms. Sensitivity - 91 - 93 db between all speakers.

That Yam should not have any problems with those speakers. Most likely that sensitivity is in an anechoic rating and an in room is 4 dB more.
It will be an expensive sugar pill to cure those feelings

 

[tungstenmw]

in other words you're telling me that it would be a $2,000 placebo effect that will make me feel good, but really won't make a difference in the way everything sounds

 

[Reorx]

in other words you're telling me that it would be a $2,000 placebo effect that will make me feel good, but really won't make a difference in the way everything sounds

This is now starting to go back to a way way old arguement.
weither or not there are audible differences between powering 100watt RMS speakers with 130wpc or 300+wpc. Some believe so, some believe not.
Mule, myself, and others have tested it. We noticed a difference.
I even tested it using my little yamaha 75wpc@8ohm amp. my htr-5760 is 110wpc@8ohms. Audibly it sounded like someone cleaned out all the wax from my ears.

BUT, dont just take my word for it. Find a local shop, that has a 7channel amp. I'm sure they'll let you audition the amp at home for a few days. Test it out and listen for yourself. Report back to us what you hear.

I wouldnt bother trying to bi-amp those speakers. It'd be more trouble then what it's worth.

Reorx

 

[j_garcia]

What exactly doesn't sound "good"? Is it not loud enough or not clear enough? Have you tried adjusting the speaker positions? If it isn't loud enough, an amp probably will help some, but it will take more power than you are looking at to get a considerable increase. The front three need the most power, so do what you can to improve the amount of power going to them first - the surrounds don't need nearly as much power because they aren't seeing as much action in general.

 

[Josuah]

Not much is gained. You still have that passive crossover, not very good.

That's not to say the passive crossover in your speakers is bad. Many passive crossovers are very good.

That Yam should not have any problems with those speakers. Most likely that sensitivity is in an anechoic rating and an in room is 4 dB more.

Someone should correct me if I'm wrong about this, but in-room gain is more for lower frequencies (say, no gain once you've reached a few thousand Hz?) than higher ones. I'm not entirely sure.

 

[mtrycrafts]

in other words you're telling me that it would be a $2,000 placebo effect that will make me feel good, but really won't make a difference in the way everything sounds

The probability is against you and for that placebo, yes. Why would audio be exempt from having placebo effects? Humans are the testing subjects, prone to bias and placebo reactions. Many decades ago, science introduced bias controls, double blind testing. Contrary to many who believe it doesn't apply to audio, it does, in fact apply.
But, if there are other reasons beyond sonic benefits to spend that $2k, by all means.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Mule, myself, and others have tested it. We noticed a difference.

I am sure this is correct. However, perception is not immune from being biased and being unreliable. Some need better evidence than for such claims to be convincing. None has been presented so far.

People report talking to the dead, being abducted by space aliens, Airborne works, and on it goes.