Audyssey subs -12?

[Hetfield]

I finally was able to run Aydyssey in the new house but this issue is not new to me. Talk to me like I'm a 5 year old to help me understand this. Audyssey always sets my subs at -12 which is as low as you can which to me tells me something ain't right? Wrong or not wrong so far? Now I use the Audyssel XT32 app for this so that little bubble thing comes up, looks like a level quite frankly, red on both sides, green in the middle where Audyssey wants it before it will begin to calibrate? Correct? What am I getting wrong that its setting the subs at -12? I higher it to -10 just because I want a bit more and it is hitting damn hard. Just some clarity here would be great? Thanks!

 

[Matt34]

You need to lower the gain/volume on the sub itself. Aim for -6 on Audyssey to give you room to adjust up or down without the potential of clipping the signal.

Edit: It fine if it's to the right of green a little during calibration.

 

[Hetfield]

You need to lower the gain/volume on the sub itself. Aim for -6 on Audyssey to give you room to adjust up or down without the potential of clipping the signal.

Edit: It fine if it's to the right of green a little during calibration.

Oh crap there you go. So Audyssey will go into Calibration even if its not in the perfect middle green area? So i should keep in lower than that green area a tad? Thank you and that is the first time I heard that or was told that. Thank you again.

 

[-Jim-]

If after running Audyssey, and getting the Subs off -12 a ways, you will probably find that you want a bit more out of those Subs. (Lots of folks do) Then you can adjust the level in the options on your receiver to taste. Some have different levels available kept in memory for each source. What Receiver do you have?

 

[Hetfield]

If after running Audyssey, and getting the Subs off -12 a ways, you will probably find that you want a bit more out of those Subs. (Lots of folks do) Then you can adjust the level in the options on your receiver to taste. Some have different levels available kept in memory for each source. What Receiver do you have?

I have a few years old now Denon X3400H.

 

[Matt34]

Oh crap there you go. So Audyssey will go into Calibration even if its not in the perfect middle green area? So i should keep in lower than that green area a tad? Thank you and that is the first time I heard that or was told that. Thank you again.

Yup, you can still continue the calibration out of spec "green". A little over volume (to the right) is fine. But don't go out of the zone to the left.

 

[Hetfield]

Yup, you can still continue the calibration out of spec "green". A little over volume (to the right) is fine. But don't go out of the zone to the left.

Ok thank you. Ok just so I'm not confused, you want to be to the right of the green box, not the left? Oh right because you want it to set it something lower than -12 so higher is better on that scale.
Sorry, it's just a touch confusing. I'm a little slow.

 

[PENG]

Ok thank you. Ok just so I'm not confused, you want to be to the right of the green box, not the left? Oh right because you want it to set it something lower than -12 so higher is better on that scale.
Sorry, it's just a touch confusing. I'm a little slow.

Something is not right!! If you already have the sub set to -12 post Audyssey calibration, that means your sub was probably already in the green area. If you turn the sub's gain up into the red range, you would then be going the wrong way. You actually need to turn the sub gain down in order to have Audyssey calibrate it to higher than -12, say -6 would be good.

Which sub do you have, so I can take a look of the specs, before suggesting troubleshooting step?

 

[Hetfield]

Something is not right!! If you already have the sub set to -12 post Audyssey calibration, that means your sub was probably already in the green area. If you turn the sub's gain up into the red range, you would then be going the wrong way. You actually need to turn the sub gain down in order to have Audyssey calibrate it to higher than -12, say -6 would be good.

Which sub do you have, so I can take a look of the specs, before suggesting troubleshooting step?

Man I'm just done with the whole thing. I don't know why this is confusing for me. I ran XT32 again through the app of course and did put it to the right of the green mark and it's again -12 and sounded like crap by the way. I went back into the Audyssey app and went back to the first one I did because it sounded better.
I guess I'll try to the left of the green mark at some point but I'm just tired of fooling around with it. In general I hate running Audyssey and twice in one night it's too many.

 

[PENG]

Man I'm just done with the whole thing. I don't know why this is confusing for me. I ran XT32 again through the app of course and did put it to the right of the green mark and it's again -12 and sounded like crap by the way. I went back into the Audyssey app and went back to the first one I did because it sounded better.
I guess I'll try to the left of the green mark at some point but I'm just tired of fooling around with it. In general I hate running Audyssey and twice in one night it's too many.

I understand the frustration, so if everything else works fine then you can just manually crank it up and just go by ears. It is rare that even in the green zone you ended up sub trim level set to -12. The problem is, there are many possible reasons so unless we have full details of what you have there, including speakers, subwoofer specs, room dimensions etc., it could take time to get it sorted.

The AVR-X3400H is a great little AVR, I had one for a couple weeks, it sounded as good as my separates that cost multiple times more.

 

[Hetfield]

I understand the frustration, so if everything else works fine then you can just manually crank it up and just go by ears. It is rare that even in the green zone you ended up sub trim level set to -12. The problem is, there are many possible reasons so unless we have full details of what you have there, including speakers, subwoofer specs, room dimensions etc., it could take time to get it sorted.

The AVR-X3400H is a great little AVR, I had one for a couple weeks, it sounded as good as my separates that cost multiple times more.

I have JBL speakers but I have 2 RSL subs
12S and a 10E which I just got to go dual. I really didn't want another giant 12S box on this room so I went 10E and they sound fantastic together. RSL said mixing the different sizes would be fine and I think they are correct.
The speakers are JBL 570 make, 530 surrounds and JBL C center II. It's an older 3 way center.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Het, my guess is one of the subs is producing a peak that’s causing trouble. I use three subs in my main system. I use my spl meter to set each one individually to about 68db(if memory serves). Then when combined I get fairly close to 75db which is what audyssey wants. It makes it easier to calibrate imo even if you have XT32ht, which shouldn’t struggle with dual subs, but ya just never know.
Basically what audyssey wants is to set every speaker, including subs to 75db. Simply put, if the subs are too hot, audyssey can’t trim them low enough, by going quieter than -12.(max). Conversely if the subs are too low, audyssey will try to hit 75 by boosting. If that’s the case, you might find the sub channel in the positive. Like say +5db. This is too high, as you can introduce distortion into the signal, and also you have no room to bump up a few db ost calibration, or run a house curve.
Another possibility is simply that due to the different port, driver, and cabinet tunings of the different subs, the peaks and valleys could be more erratic than if they were matched subs. I know RSL said they would work together, but imo, the unpredictably of totally different tunings can cause many more issues than multiple subs have the potential to fix. I know you intend to keep them both so I would recommend trying as many locations as you can afford. Also, whether or not you find satisfaction with audyssey, a umik and rew is always highly recommended. That way you can see where you’re flying!
ETA: The sub test to the right of the green means the sub/s are too loud. Manually lower the trim/s directly on the subs and retry until you get to maybe -8 or -9.

 

[Hetfield]

Het, my guess is one of the subs is producing a peak that’s causing trouble. I use three subs in my main system. I use my spl meter to set each one individually to about 68db(if memory serves). Then when combined I get fairly close to 75db which is what audyssey wants. It makes it easier to calibrate imo even if you have XT32ht, which shouldn’t struggle with dual subs, but ya just never know.
Basically what audyssey wants is to set every speaker, including subs to 75db. Simply put, if the subs are too hot, audyssey can’t trim them low enough, by going quieter than -12.(max). Conversely if the subs are too low, audyssey will try to hit 75 by boosting. If that’s the case, you might find the sub channel in the positive. Like say +5db. This is too high, as you can introduce distortion into the signal, and also you have no room to bump up a few db ost calibration, or run a house curve.
Another possibility is simply that due to the different port, driver, and cabinet tunings of the different subs, the peaks and valleys could be more erratic than if they were matched subs. I know RSL said they would work together, but imo, the unpredictably of totally different tunings can cause many more issues than multiple subs have the potential to fix. I know you intend to keep them both so I would recommend trying as many locations as you can afford. Also, whether or not you find satisfaction with audyssey, a umik and rew is always highly recommended. That way you can see where you’re flying!
ETA: The sub test to the right of the green means the sub/s are too loud. Manually lower the trim/s directly on the subs and retry until you get to maybe -8 or -9.

Thanks, this -12 thing happened when I only had the 12S. The 10E just arrived a a few days ago. That's why I said this issue is not new. I am determined at some point to get a different damn number than -12. It's sorta pissing me off at this point.
Quite frankly I'm annoyed with Audyssey the most. I follow the directions, get the sub right where it says it wants it in the green, the damn system they created should take care of the rest.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Thanks, this -12 thing happened when I only had the 12S. The 10E just arrived a a few days ago. That's why I said this issue is not new. I am determined at some point to get a different damn number than -12. It's sorta pissing me off at this point.
Quite frankly I'm annoyed with Audyssey the most. I follow the directions, get the sub right where it says it wants it in the green, the damn system they created should take care of the rest.

It should. But really all you should need here is to lower the subs gain until you get the right number. That might mean being to the left of the green bar, as even with white noise, you can still have peaks.

 

[Trell]

Thanks, this -12 thing happened when I only had the 12S. The 10E just arrived a a few days ago. That's why I said this issue is not new. I am determined at some point to get a different damn number than -12. It's sorta pissing me off at this point.
Quite frankly I'm annoyed with Audyssey the most. I follow the directions, get the sub right where it says it wants it in the green, the damn system they created should take care of the rest.

You just have to turn down the level on each subs so that the Audyssey trim is not -12.

The fastest way to do this is just to make the minimum number of measurements Audyssey requires (is three for me) without moving the mic. Then check the trim level for each subwoofer to see that it's higher than -12, if not change the gain on the subwoofer down. Rinse and repeat.

 

[PENG]

Thanks, this -12 thing happened when I only had the 12S. The 10E just arrived a a few days ago. That's why I said this issue is not new. I am determined at some point to get a different damn number than -12. It's sorta pissing me off at this point.
Quite frankly I'm annoyed with Audyssey the most. I follow the directions, get the sub right where it says it wants it in the green, the damn system they created should take care of the rest.

Okay then there are nothing unusual there, those speakers won't be a challenge for you AVR and X32 SubEQ HT.
I suggested you try using 3 positions and lower the sub volume to say 1/2 or the green bar and try another run, but I deleted it, sensing that you might be too frustrated at this point and should probably leave you alone to just focus on enjoying the music and movies for a while before you are up to it again.

When are ready to try again, re-read the last few posts, #12,14,15 first. I am sure you will able to get it down to -6 to -9 without no much effort.

Just to be sure, I would do a factory reset on the AVR first.