Audio calibration test tones

[ThA tRiXtA]

I have been wondering, do you guys think it's better to use your AVR's internal test tones for speaker level calibration, or using a third party software program such as Rives Audio test CD 2 or something like this.

Do you think the receiver's pink noise or the test tones from the software disc would be more accurate? I know the standard is to use the AVR pink noise, and you would think it would be more accurate due to those test noises being programmed right into the receiver... Anyways, just looking for any opinions on this. It would seem those discs are more handy than the pink noise in terms of being able to graph your frequency response from 20 hertz to 20 kHz.

Thanks for your time.

 

[Alex2507]

I would use the test tones on the DVE Calibration Disk. I have the Avia II and use those over the receivers tones. I have actually noticed a difference from a couple of receivers and the calibration disk. I trust the disk more. I have the Rives Disk as well but was unaware that it could be used to level match the channels.

Here's a similar thread if it's of any use to you:

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48608

 

[ThA tRiXtA]

Thanks Alex.

May I ask if you have any particular reasons as to why you trust the disk's tones over the internal tones of the receiver?

I own the precursor (Avia guide to home theater) to the Avia II disk, do you think it would be worth it to upgrade to the Avia II disk or is the one I have good enough? It was made in 1999, so I am curious if these kinds of things should be upgraded like all of our other components do.

cheers.

 

[tcarcio]

I fail to see why there would be a difference. If you calibrate pink noise to 75db it doesn't matter what the source is of the PN because 75db is 75db no matter how you do it. Am I missing something?????

 

[ThA tRiXtA]

Well, just on a very basic note, for example the Rives Audio CD test tones are corrected for use on the Radio Shack SPL meter.

Admittedly, the receiver's test tones can be as well, but they require you to do the math legwork to achieve the same results.

Hence why I asked the question, are there other reasons to not use the receiver's test tones?

 

[Alex2507]

I wouldn't upgrade the disc. I trust the output of the disc to be more closely regulated than the out put of the receiver. I know I'm not saying this well.

I believe that the test tones on a test disc will be more even as they are pumped out of 6 or 8 different channels. The reason I say this is that on a friend's H/K AVR 235 I noticed a big difference with the subwoofer test tones generated by his receiver and my calibration disc. My own H/K AVR 430 does not generate a sub test tone at all. For some reason H/K did not include it on mine and on the newer 35 series they added it but I don't trust the receivers to be good test tone generators. That's it for my experience with receivers and calibration discs.

Another friend of mine has an H/K AVR 635 and that thing has some sort of further enhanced set up crap that I trust even less as the settings it came up with are plain stupid. I don't know anybody with any other brand receivers so I can't speak on that.

If somebody here knows what I mean but can explain it better, feel free.

 

[Alex2507]

I fail to see why there would be a difference.

I think the difference is in the output levels of the test tones from the receiver to the more even output levels from the calibration discs. I hope that makes sense.

 

[Alex2507]

Well, just on a very basic note, for example the Rives Audio CD test tones are corrected for use on the Radio Shack SPL meter.

But that's for EQ'ing, not for level matching. We are talking about simple level matching, right?

 

[ThA tRiXtA]

Ya sorry, lost my train of thought when I was answering him. That Rives CD is used for a different purpose than level matching all your channels.

I guess you could technically use the Rives disc for level matching, but it would involve a hell of a lot of messing around in between each test, like unplugging one speaker and plugging in the next.

 

[Alex2507]

Okay, so you presently have the ability to calibrate the channel levels with an Avia disc and with your receivers test tones. My guess is that the regular channels will be within 1 or 2 decibels but the LFE channel will be off say 2 to 4 decibels. Can we have a pool?

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Alex seems drunk again.....

 

[highfigh]

I think the difference is in the output levels of the test tones from the receiver to the more even output levels from the calibration discs. I hope that makes sense.

You don't think the company making the receiver looked at the test tones, DSP, levels and mic as a system? Change the source and you change the accuracy of the results because a variable was introduced.

 

[Alex2507]

Alex seems drunk again.....

Does it seem like that? My mind has been in and out on me. I think it's the absence of nicotine myself but maybe it's age. Either way, get use to it.

You don't think the company making the receiver looked at the test tones, DSP, levels and mic as a system?

The company in this case is Harman Kardon. In the case of my AVR 430, the mic built into the remote tells you that you are within +/- 3dB and calls it good.

In the case of my friends AVR 635 they let a full signal go to the mains and crossed the center at 140Hz. When I brought my RS SPL meter over and had him play through the test tones the needle looked like his dog's tail and I had a pork chop in my pocket. Get it, pork chop?

I usually don't have snappy answers to these types of questions but in this case I have had a go around with the case in point. Anyway, my original answer to just go with the calibration disc's test tones stands. I don't know about other rec'rs but maybe The Trixta will give us the scoop.

 

[mtrycrafts]

I fail to see why there would be a difference. If you calibrate pink noise to 75db it doesn't matter what the source is of the PN because 75db is 75db no matter how you do it. Am I missing something?????

The internal signal doesn't go through the same chain as the signal from a disc, be it CD or DVD.

 

[colin.p]

A quick question...

I don't have any test disk, other than some test tones I downloaded a couple of years back, but what about the THX set up that is included on DVDs, such as Pirates of the Caribbean?
I have run the PN on my receiver and level matched all channels fairly well, but when I ran the THX setup, my sub was "set" around 10db lower. "Upping" the level made it too overpowering, so it seems that the sub test noise was somewhat better from the receiver sub test. All the other 5 channels were bang on, though.
However, even though I have an HDTV, I have no HD content, just SD, but I set up the TV with the video test on the THX disk and the colours on the TV are alot better than the "auto" setting that was on originally.
I just wonder how far off the THX disk is, compared to Avira etc, if any. I would hate to buy a disk and find that the THX setup, that virtually everyone has, is just as good, for a quick setup.

Colin

 

[Alex2507]

I don't have any test disk.

Resisting 'the disk' for 5 years could not have been easy.

All the other 5 channels were bang on, though.

Sounds good to me.

I would hate to buy a disk.

I am your polar opposite. I loved buying 'the disk'.
I bought two different ones.
I wish I had DVE as well.

To be honest I don't really think it's for everybody. My g/f watched the Oscars with the TV speakers on. I was appalled. She is constantly watching TV programming in the wrong aspect ratio and/or zoom setting. I cringe but since I don't really watch TV and since it doesn't bother her, I figure 'who am I' or 'why bother'.

I think most things are okay. Some things are better. A few things are awesome. I'm shooting for better but I got my eye on awesome.

 

[supervij]

I had a bit of a problem with DVE. The LFE was huge. I mean freakin' huge! I thought it was gonna shatter my SPL meter and knock a couple walls outta my apartment! And all the other channels were outputting 75 dB, so I think the LFE on DVE is outta wack.

I mentioned it to someone else, either here or on another forum I frequent, and whoever I spoke to confirmed that the LFE on DVE is nuts. Other than that, I got the same levels with every other channel using DVE or my receiver's test tones.

cheers,
supervij

 

[ThA tRiXtA]

On the topic of audio / video calibration discs, I read yesterday that the grayscale test patterns on the 1999 version of Avia guide to home theater are potentially incorrect, can anyone comment on that?

I find it hard to believe that reference / calibrations disks can slip through the cracks with errors... rather unfortunate for how much money they cost.

 

[Alex2507]

On the topic of audio / video calibration discs, I read yesterday that the grayscale test patterns on the 1999 version of Avia guide to home theater are potentially incorrect, can anyone comment on that?

I find it hard to believe that reference / calibrations disks can slip through the cracks with errors... rather unfortunate for how much money they cost.

I heard that Avia actually owned up to it but when I asked to see where Avia actually did own up to it, I got nothing. I've had 2 HDTV's so far and have never had the chance to do anything with the greyscale on either of them so I'm as of yet unaffected by the yet to be verified greyscale fiasco. Last I saw the Avia II was going for ~$25. I paid ~$50 for mine. No regrets.

 

[ThA tRiXtA]

I was under the impression that Avia II was the corrected version, it was Avia I that people had the problem with... so you might be alright, unless I misread the complaint.

Like yourself, I also read that Avia owned up to it, but I have not seen any official statement saying as such.