Ask Dr. A! Of Projectors and 1080p

<A href="http://www.audioholics.com/FAQs/AskDrAprojectors1080p.php"><IMG style="WIDTH: 103px; HEIGHT: 100px" alt=[DrA1] hspace=10 src="http://www.audioholics.com/news/thumbs/DrA1_th.gif" align=left border=0></A>We get a lot of questions from our readers regarding building home theaters and setting up various pieces of equipment. Well, we like to answer as many of those reader questions as possible so we've hired on some help. "Dr. A" has graciously agreed to jump in and respond to various questions throughout the week - doling out his advice and making the whole process fo tweaking your home theater easier and more efficient. He loves music and movies and has tons of industry experience to share with as many readers as he can keep up with. Send your questions to Dr. A via questions@audioholics.com. Without further ado, here is this week's first question from "Chris" in Collegeville, PA...

[Hear Dr. A's Advice]
 
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BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
Good info! For people serious about wanting 1080p I would definitely hold out to see what CEDIA delivers this year. Rumors are running around to finally see 1080p LCD chips hit the streets. As well we will see the new 1080p DLP projectors hit the streets already with the Optoma (or Infocus?) announced street price of $6K. It isn't the steal that the Z4 or AE900 are, but that is full MSRP, not street pricing and odds are good that we will see models that are actually released for under $5K by Christmas of this year.

Now, whether that is in or out of budget, and if anyone wants to wait... that is such a personal decision. The reality is that if you buy a 720p projector, use it for a couple of years, then get a 1080p projector, you likely will end up spending $5K total, but have TWO projectors when you are done. That is, $1,800 now for a Z4/AE900 and $3K in a couple of years for a 1080p projector.

For people who already own projectors - I wouldn't upgrade to a new 720p model for sure. I would hold off for another year and see what 1080p offers, but if you are looking to buy right now? 720p is quite the deal!
 
STRONGBADF1

STRONGBADF1

Audioholic Spartan
Nice feature.:)

Hey "Chris" from Collegeville. When's movie night! (I live next door in Limerick):D Ya gotta love the real would advice AH and alot of its members give.:cool:

SBF1
 
N

ned

Full Audioholic
Panasonic's succesor to AE900 an 1080p LCD FP is rumored at 3.5K. Given the current condition of BR, I would go with Toshiba's HD DVD and yes you will see the difference on a 110 inch screen between HD and DVD, not small but big difference.
 
S

steinoch

Junior Audioholic
The Panasonic projector is due out by Oct with an increase in contrast and equiv lumen output then the 900. Or maybe an increase in lumen but equiv contrast. Either way 1080p with similar numbers to the ae900 sounds great! We shall see!
 
Shugs1037

Shugs1037

Audiophyte
STRONGBADF1 said:
Nice feature.:)

Hey "Chris" from Collegeville. When's movie night! (I live next door in Limerick):D Ya gotta love the real would advice AH and alot of its members give.:cool:

SBF1
I have learned a ton over the past year reading and discussing various topics on several different forums. It is really cool to know people can come and get honest real world advice and help.

Movie night will be after my wedding in October so I still have time to see what happens at Cedia. I'm the type of person who tends to get upgrade-Itis but when the wallet does all the talkin.....I may, at the end of the day, get that fine Sanyo projector and mate it with a Stewart Grayhawk RS and never look back....at least for a few years...LOL!
 
6kids&adog

6kids&adog

Enthusiast
I have been going through a similar thought process as Chris over the past couple of years, so I thought I would go through his questions and apply my (so called) reasoning process to them to see if my suggestions help him reach a decision.

Chris asked, "If I did purchase a Blu-ray disc player, would the images look any better on the Sanyo versus an upscaling player like the Denon 2910? I know the sound would improve but what about the image?"

If I understand your question correctly, you are asking if a 1080p source (HDDVD or BD) scaled down to 720P will look better than a 480p source (DVD) scaled up to 720p? I have never seen a direct comparison, but for a nice explanation on why the higher quality source will give a better picture than just upscaling the 480p source, read this article from projectorcentral.com (http://www.projectorcentral.com/hd-dvd.htm). The short answer is that the 1080p source scaled down will look better than the 480p source scaled up.

That being said, in your particular case, I don't recommend you buy either a new high def video player (HDDVD or BD) or a new upscaling DVD player (the Denon). Why? Because you (like me) don't seem to be a "bleeding edge" consumer and cost really is an object to you. You have been content for the past few years to watch your non-progressive scan, non-HD TV. It doesn't seem to me to be the right time to buy a high-def player - they are still working out the bugs and fighting a format war that you don't want to get involved in. Now is also the wrong time to spend $700 on a new DVD player (assuming you currently own a decent progressive scan player - your note doesn't mention it). Why spend money on a DVD player when you feel strongly that you will eventually want a high-def player? The high def players will be able to up-scale your standard DVDs just like the Denon 2910, and in addition will be able to play high-def sources. And depending on the player you choose, they may cost less than the Denon 2910. You may be worrying that you won't get the "ultimate" in AV. Believe me, the difference you will notice between what you are doing now and what you will see on a 110" progressive scan presentation through a good 720p projector will be huge! From a stewardship of money point of view, you are always wiser to buy one step behind the "bleeding edge". Look at the cost of really excellent 720p projectors. Just a bit over a year ago, the Optoma H79 was $10K, and considered one of the best 720p projectors. Now, in a head to head against the Sanyo Z4, it comes out to about a tie. The difference is the Z4 can be had for $1500 and you can get a free screen and replacement lamp with it! Comparable quality for 1/10th the cost makes staying behind the bleeding edge seem a reasonable option for those of us without unlimited cash.

Now to formally address your questions.
1. As mentioned above, the HD source will give a better image quality than the upscaled 480p source. But I don't recommend you spend money on either right now.
2. Screen recommendations for the Z4 or the Panasonic AE900U (it won the Audioholics 2005 product of the year award and you can sit closer to it for the "real cinema feel" because the AE900 has less visible pixelation than the Z4). I recommend the Da-Lite Model B or C in high-contrast matte white (can usually be found for $250-400). The reviews I have read have not recommended going above 100 to 110" diagonal for screen size due to the lumen output of the projectors. Remember, if you want the image to look bigger, just sit closer.
3. I think now is a great time to buy a 720p projector. Why? Because you can get what you are looking for - great looking DVDs and HDTV images on a huge screen - and you can get it for a little less than half of your suggested budget! I know you said you don't want to upgrade in a short time, but I still recommend that you buy the less expensive, better established technology now. This puts you in a great position to let the high-def format war work itself out and at the same time let the cost of 1080p projectors come down. The great part is that while you wait, you still get a home theater experience that visually outperforms most local theaters. Who knows, 3-5 years down the road you may have saved your pennies and be able to upgrade to a "pure 1080p" system for about the same amount you are spending today.
 
Shugs1037

Shugs1037

Audiophyte
6kids&adog said:
I have been going through a similar thought process as Chris over the past couple of years, so I thought I would go through his questions and apply my (so called) reasoning process to them to see if my suggestions help him reach a decision.

Chris asked, "If I did purchase a Blu-ray disc player, would the images look any better on the Sanyo versus an upscaling player like the Denon 2910? I know the sound would improve but what about the image?"

If I understand your question correctly, you are asking if a 1080p source (HDDVD or BD) scaled down to 720P will look better than a 480p source (DVD) scaled up to 720p? I have never seen a direct comparison, but for a nice explanation on why the higher quality source will give a better picture than just upscaling the 480p source, read this article from projectorcentral.com (http://www.projectorcentral.com/hd-dvd.htm). The short answer is that the 1080p source scaled down will look better than the 480p source scaled up.

That being said, in your particular case, I don't recommend you buy either a new high def video player (HDDVD or BD) or a new upscaling DVD player (the Denon). Why? Because you (like me) don't seem to be a "bleeding edge" consumer and cost really is an object to you. You have been content for the past few years to watch your non-progressive scan, non-HD TV. It doesn't seem to me to be the right time to buy a high-def player - they are still working out the bugs and fighting a format war that you don't want to get involved in. Now is also the wrong time to spend $700 on a new DVD player (assuming you currently own a decent progressive scan player - your note doesn't mention it). Why spend money on a DVD player when you feel strongly that you will eventually want a high-def player? The high def players will be able to up-scale your standard DVDs just like the Denon 2910, and in addition will be able to play high-def sources. And depending on the player you choose, they may cost less than the Denon 2910. You may be worrying that you won't get the "ultimate" in AV. Believe me, the difference you will notice between what you are doing now and what you will see on a 110" progressive scan presentation through a good 720p projector will be huge! From a stewardship of money point of view, you are always wiser to buy one step behind the "bleeding edge". Look at the cost of really excellent 720p projectors. Just a bit over a year ago, the Optoma H79 was $10K, and considered one of the best 720p projectors. Now, in a head to head against the Sanyo Z4, it comes out to about a tie. The difference is the Z4 can be had for $1500 and you can get a free screen and replacement lamp with it! Comparable quality for 1/10th the cost makes staying behind the bleeding edge seem a reasonable option for those of us without unlimited cash.

Now to formally address your questions.
1. As mentioned above, the HD source will give a better image quality than the upscaled 480p source. But I don't recommend you spend money on either right now.
2. Screen recommendations for the Z4 or the Panasonic AE900U (it won the Audioholics 2005 product of the year award and you can sit closer to it for the "real cinema feel" because the AE900 has less visible pixelation than the Z4). I recommend the Da-Lite Model B or C in high-contrast matte white (can usually be found for $250-400). The reviews I have read have not recommended going above 100 to 110" diagonal for screen size due to the lumen output of the projectors. Remember, if you want the image to look bigger, just sit closer.
3. I think now is a great time to buy a 720p projector. Why? Because you can get what you are looking for - great looking DVDs and HDTV images on a huge screen - and you can get it for a little less than half of your suggested budget! I know you said you don't want to upgrade in a short time, but I still recommend that you buy the less expensive, better established technology now. This puts you in a great position to let the high-def format war work itself out and at the same time let the cost of 1080p projectors come down. The great part is that while you wait, you still get a home theater experience that visually outperforms most local theaters. Who knows, 3-5 years down the road you may have saved your pennies and be able to upgrade to a "pure 1080p" system for about the same amount you are spending today.
Wow! Awesome feedback 6kidsandadog (you must be a really busy guy to handle all that...kids and dog I mean)

Your suggestions are music to my ears......my fiancee was annoyed when I told her I wanted to replace my Sony DVD player with a Denon...she was upset because her parents bought it for me two years back as a Christmas gift....I didn't really think of it until you said it but you are right, about the bleeding edge thing...I don't need to have the latest and greatest. I just want something that is reliable and will do a great job of entertaining. I am definitely going to get the Sanyo projector. I need to discuss with the lady in my life the scenerios and options we have. My thought is to have a pull down or electric screen to come in front of my existing TV. This way I can still have a functional living room and watch regular SD stuff on the old beast. I may spend a bit more for the screen since it should last for years (I take really good care of my stuff) and it seems to make a difference in image quality.
I could use the extra money I saved to get some nice leather furniture or something along those lines!!! Yeah baby!!

One question I have - How do I get digital cable to my Sony TV and HD cable to my projector? Would I need to get another cable box or is there a receiver or prep pro that has two monitor outs??? Any help with this would be awesome!!

Thanks a ton for taking the time to write back with your suggestions!!!
You are the man Dad!!!
 
S

s_kris88

Audiophyte
The "best" home theatre

Yes. The answer by 6kids&adog is spot On! There is no perfect home theatre. If you can get by with an analogue 26 inch TV why jump to a 100 inch projector with hi-def signals? Also the resolution of the image needs to match the size of the image. On a 14 inch even 320 x 240 looks good. In Australia we have SDTV (standard definition digital) free-to-air TV which is DVD resolution (yes, DVD is not hi-def, just 480i). HDTV is also available, but so many people watch it on 42 inch plasma's it is a waste. I run a DLP projector with a 100 inch screen and SDTV and DVD are perfect. When Blu Ray becomes 'common' I will invest in that as well as HDTV, not before. Till then, save your money and go for something you can enjoy NOW. One good gauge is that the screen width needs to not exceed 120 degrees of our field of vision. If a picture is bigger than that, you're sitting too close and it will be un-natural.

The best home theatre is one you can afford without breaking the bank, that fits the room, and that you sit around with your family and enjoy. Nothing beats that!
 
N

ned

Full Audioholic
6kids,

Let me start by saying I respect your opinion. I beleive that information empowers the consumer to be a wise buyer and there were some inaccurate statements in your post. I also look at it differently. We all agree that HD will make a significant image improvement and that it's the cost that's turning as off. However the cost of upgrading later would be similar if not more. I've learned this the hard way. Please take this into consideration.

I agree with buying one step behind tech with the FP as 1080p is more expensive. This was true last year. This year after CEDIA there will be a lot of 1080p FP for the price of last year 720p. My advice is if you're in the market, it would be wise to wait till later this year to see what's out there. It will be a huge mistake and a waste of money now to get a 720P projector, IMHO.

I would take a different stand on hi-def source. I value hi-def source because to me the images are world apart. I've my HD DVD player for several months now and no bugs or issues as have been the experience of many. I got mine from a store that has generous return policy thinking that if there were any problem I could return it and get my money back. Guess what? It's been over 90 days and I'm happy with it. There has been a lot of misinformation out there in the media and I don't blame you for making such comment.

Regarding format wars, it looks like both will co-exist. Even if the current format fails I would be happy with the collection that I have to watch over again in their full 1080p glory.

The cost of HD DVD player is hardly bleeding edge price. Consider the Denon 2200 that I payed $600 a few years that only plays 480p. If you shop around you can get the Toshiba for $360 and is one of the best SD DVD upconverter as well. I bought mine from Walmart hardly a bleeding edge dealer.

Overall, you may save a few bucks now but ending up costing the same or more because you've to upgrade later on.

BTW some more correction: Optoma H79 is miles away from Z4. IMHO they are not even in the same league. HD DVD is "pure 1080P".
 
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BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
Shugs1037 said:
One question I have - How do I get digital cable to my Sony TV and HD cable to my projector? Would I need to get another cable box or is there a receiver or prep pro that has two monitor outs??? Any help with this would be awesome!!
I personally run the plasma/projector route right now. With a electric screen that drops in front of the display. Keep an eye on eBay very closely as Draper liquidates electric screens there and you can pick up a tab-tensioned electric screen sometimes for under $1K. I picked up a $4,000 (MSRP) Draper screen for $700 shipped to my door. Pretty crazy!

For video, you basically need what is called a distribution amplifier. It has one set of video inputs, and two sets of vide outputs. I put mine just after the A/V receiver. This allows me to run everything component video out of the receiver and to both the plasma and projector at the same time. You can pick those up on eBay from Extron or other companies typically for less than $100.00. HDMI distribution amplifiers may be a bit more expensive if you want to go the HDMI route. I would probably go with HDMI from my cable box and a DVD player (if I had one that did so) to the projector through a HDMI switcher and then run component video to my main display if I wanted to keep price down a bit.
 
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