Are there any consumer grade speakers that can match the dynamic range of Klipsch?

[yepimonfire]

I'm mainly referring to the ability to reach reference levels (105dB) into a medium to large room (seated 9-15' away) without audible harmonic or intermodulation distortion, or dynamic range compression. The klipsch seem to just keep going free from distortion unless you exceed xmax on the woofer. A good deal of other speakers tend to start distorting rapidly at that volume.

Obviously there are high end speakers such as those from PSA or JTR that are designed to, but are there any mid range priced speakers around the same costs as the klipsch capable of the same kind of dynamics?

I'm mainly asking on the chance I might want to try other speakers in the future.



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[killdozzer]

I'm mainly referring to the ability to reach reference levels (105dB) into a medium to large room (seated 9-15' away) without audible harmonic or intermodulation distortion, or dynamic range compression. The klipsch seem to just keep going free from distortion unless you exceed xmax on the woofer. A good deal of other speakers tend to start distorting rapidly at that volume.

Obviously there are high end speakers such as those from PSA or JTR that are designed to, but are there any mid range priced speakers around the same costs as the klipsch capable of the same kind of dynamics?

I'm mainly asking on the chance I might want to try other speakers in the future.



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Man, you're really holding in there with the Klipsch. You've earned my respect for that fact alone, although I would never own Klipsch. It's good to see when someone finds his perfect match.

 

[shadyJ]

I'm mainly referring to the ability to reach reference levels (105dB) into a medium to large room (seated 9-15' away) without audible harmonic or intermodulation distortion, or dynamic range compression. The klipsch seem to just keep going free from distortion unless you exceed xmax on the woofer. A good deal of other speakers tend to start distorting rapidly at that volume.

Obviously there are high end speakers such as those from PSA or JTR that are designed to, but are there any mid range priced speakers around the same costs as the klipsch capable of the same kind of dynamics?

I'm mainly asking on the chance I might want to try other speakers in the future.



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Are you so sure that Klipsch is that much better than typical speakers regarding dynamic range? I have no doubt that their heritage speakers are, but their newer speakers do not even use compression drivers. Its something that I would want to see demonstrated before accepting those claims. A decently built conventional tower or bookshelf speaker with a good 1" dome tweeter can stay clean at levels louder than most people would be comfortable with, at least in normal living spaces.

 

[yepimonfire]

Even without a compression driver, horn loading a dome still vastly improves its efficiency, and allows a low xover point. When cranked to reference levels during something like an action movie, the loudest dynamic swings just sound effortless, the same way they do in the cinema. I've owned a couple of other speakers and demoed a couple of others at that volume, and they just don't handle those loud peaks the same way. They sound strained in comparison. The JBL 500 series seems to do just as well as the klipsch, in fact maybe better even though less efficient, unfortunately they've been discontinued outside of their ultra expensive Synthesis line.

Are you so sure that Klipsch is that much better than typical speakers regarding dynamic range? I have no doubt that their heritage speakers are, but their newer speakers do not even use compression drivers. Its something that I would want to see demonstrated before accepting those claims. A decently built conventional tower or bookshelf speaker with a good 1" dome tweeter can stay clean at levels louder than most people would be comfortable with, at least in normal living spaces.

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[shadyJ]

I have cranked a lot of speakers, and many did pretty good with dynamic range. You might check out speakers with heavy-duty AMT drivers if you want something that can handle loud. One speaker that surprised me was the RBH SV-61r. It had pretty low sensitivity, but that AMT tweeter could handle gobs of power, it got loud and still sounded great. Check out the Hsu HC-1 mk2 in vertical configuration for something with great dynamics as well, also the CCB-8s. The infinity Primus p36x towers are oldies but goodies that could get loud with no problems. I could go on.

The thing about "reference level" listening is is usually refers to a THX specification for loudness, but of course that spec actually means more than just loud, it has an associated distortion level and compression behavior that no one outside of THX (or the manufacturers of THX products) knows. So for anyone who doesn't have access to the specs, the phrase 'reference level' is actually kind of ambiguous, so I use that phrase with some reservations.

 

[yepimonfire]

When I say reference level and great dynamics I basically mean a speaker that can reproduce 105dB just as effortlessly as 80dB, the kind of big dynamics you get at an IMAX or Dolby Cinema. I don't mean to say that Klipsch is the only brand that can play that loud, plenty of speakers can achieve 105dB, but Klipsch have a sort of effortless, open feel to the dynamics at that level, where a good majority of other speakers sound forced.

The thing about "reference level" listening is is usually refers to a THX specification for loudness, but of course that spec actually means more than just loud, it has an associated distortion level and compression behavior that no one outside of THX (or the manufacturers of THX products) knows. So for anyone who doesn't have access to the specs, the phrase 'reference level' is actually kind of ambiguous, so I use that phrase with some reservations.

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[everettT]

Here is John's write up on loading dome tweeters.
http://www.zaphaudio.com/hornconversion.html

 

[yepimonfire]

Yes, I've read that. Basically horn loading a tweeter gives it a significant advantage in the lower frequencies, which are the hardest to reproduce, especially at high spl due to excursion. The tweeters in the klipsch reference and premiere series are crossed over at 1500hz. Without a horn, a majority of 1" tweeters would exhibit massive amounts of distortion and be destroyed at even moderate levels.

Here is John's write up on loading dome tweeters.
http://www.zaphaudio.com/hornconversion.html

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[AcuDefTechGuy]

Any of the Towers of Power would qualify.

https://forums.audioholics.com/forums/threads/towers-of-power-a-look-at-the-best-super-speakers.97720/

The old RBH SX-T1 would also qualify.

 

[everettT]

Yes, I've read that. Basically horn loading a tweeter gives it a significant advantage in the lower frequencies, which are the hardest to reproduce, especially at high spl due to excursion. The tweeters in the klipsch reference and premiere series are crossed over at 1500hz. Without a horn, a majority of 1" tweeters would exhibit massive amounts of distortion and be destroyed at even moderate levels.

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Maybe reread it. He points out the pros and CONS, which the former can be somewhat troublesome.

 

[everettT]

Any of the Towers of Power would qualify.

https://forums.audioholics.com/forums/threads/towers-of-power-a-look-at-the-best-super-speakers.97720/

The old RBH SX-T1 would also qualify.

The JTRs are ridiculously dynamic

 

[yepimonfire]

Maybe reread it. He points out the pros and CONS, which the former can be somewhat troublesome.

I would imagine klipsch would have designed the tweeter and phase plug to compensate for that. Looking at the response graph @Dennis Murphy showed me, the he remarked Premeire tweeter has one of the smoothest and flattest responses he has seen from 1.5-10khz.

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