Are Bells & Whistles: Are they really worth the extra cash?

[3db]

I've read the reviews on the Yamaha4600 and although the review comes across as the receiver being a solid good sounding receiver, it also left me with the impression that YPAO is not all that accurate and that the results of running the YPAO were inconsistent. For some reason, that scares the speaker connections right off my receiver. Why would I pay (or any one else for that matter), the extra cash for the bells and whistles when it doesn't work consistently? I don't know if the Denon reviews had similar problems. I won't be buying a Denon because in Canada, the mark-up on Denon products is downright scandolous.
Wouldn't the money be better spent going into the amp/pre-amp sections as well as the basic decoding logic rather than spending it on features that may not provide consistent results?

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

If you're building a home theater, sometimes its extremely hard to dial in a 5 or 7 channel system. As inconsistent as the results may be, they are more efficient than the human ear with a tape measure. I rely on my ear and tape, but I swear it took me three weeks to get my system to where I'm satisfied. For most people, they don't have the time or patience to dial in a surround system. Hey, it's less expensive than hiring an audio engineer to come to your home and dial it in, right?

One thing these auto setup systems can't do is place your speakers. You need to get that right on your own. That means center channel height, tower canter, surround height and placement, and rear surround placement and height. Those, IMHO, are as-if not more important than auto setup. If you can get the placement right the first time, then auto calibration should be a snap.

 

[newfmp3]

take that part of the review with a grain of salt. Nothing against the reviewer at all, but everyone's results with any automatic setup program is going to be different due to their room/equipment. You'll hear people complain of any other manufactures automatic room setup as well. Heck, I'm probably one of them. I just do not see what is so difficult about getting a tape measure and setting up your speakers. What is more important is the EQ option that the 4600 has, and that should/can make a difference but again, will differ for different equipment/rooms and different ears. There are other features that may or may not be useful to you that the 4600 has. YPAO is no different then any other automatic room setup thingie nonsense that most AV's are now coming with so concentrate on the other aspects. HDMI, ILINK, upgraded amps, GUI, and so on.

In the end, I'd rather have the stuff for when I do need it rather then replace the receiver only because I can't plug something in or get the sound I want out of it down the road.

 

[claudermilk]

In direct answer to your question, IMHO, no it isn't worth it. When shopping receivers, Yamaha was on my short list, but I ended up going with Marantz. Fewer bells & whistles but a more solid amp. I certainly don't miss the YPAO, or the 5,000,000 different ways to process sound that would never get used anyway. Using the tape measure & an hour or so with the remote wasn't an ordeal.

 

[jcPanny]

Need Less features?

If you don't need all of the features of the Yamaha 4600 including HDMI switching, than go for the RX-V2500. It has nearly as much power, a good amount of features, for significantly less money. It would also make a great Pre/Pro.

 

[Mort Corey]

The setup function on my Denon AVR worked well enough....though I wasn't thrilled about having to pay for the stupid mic. I just used it as a starting point then kept playing with adjustments over a period of time until I was happy. Speaker distance measurements were spot on (except for the sub but the manual suggested that might be the case) and the channel levels were pretty darn close. After I'd re-adjusted those I found that the auto EQ gave better results (to my ears) than without it or my adjustments.

Is is necessary? Probably not, but I think it's a more useful "bell/whistle" than a lot of the DSP offerings.

Mort

 

[j_garcia]

IMO, I'll take sound quality over features every time. Tons of features doesn't mean it will sound good.

 

[Spiffyfast]

IMO, I'll take sound quality over features every time. Tons of features doesn't mean it will sound good.

He makes a good point, the principle of KISS (Keep it simle stupid) has been around for along time and normaly holds true.

 

[j_garcia]

Well, just look at Sony. IMO, many of their receivers have ridiculous amounts of features and flexibility, yet I never considered them to sound great. All those features can be a detriment too. It's nice to have a lot of flexibility, especially if you NEED it, but it took me a LONG time to go through all those adjustments and set everything just right on my friend's DA3ES last year.

 

[newfmp3]

I wish I could find some proof or comparison that proves that the 4600 does indeed have a better amp/ps over the 2500 other then the "it's just better" that I keep being told. I find it funny that even yamaha's specs for the two are identical.

 

[jcPanny]

Don't take our word for it . . .

Read the audioholics review of the 4600 and 2500 yourself:
http://www.audioholics.com/productreviews/avhardware/YamahaRX-V4600HTp1.php
They make several notes on the size of the transformer, capacitors, etc.

Also, check out the detailed measurement and analysis section at the at the end of the review:
http://www.audioholics.com/productreviews/avhardware/YamahaRX-V4600HTp6.php
When driving 2 channels at 4 ohms, the 4600 delivers 184 watts per channel while the 2500 drops off to 119 watts per channel.
Both receivers have a good amp section and most people driving 4 ohm mains for extended periods would probably want a dedicated amp anyway.

 

[zumbo]

I believe the room acoustics is where the inconsistency lies. My YPAO on my 1400 gives the same settings every time. The trick for me is to do it when there is no outside(cars, wind, rain, birds, etc) or inside( a/c, fridge, fans, people, etc) noise at all.

 

[patnshan]

In direct answer to your question, IMHO, no it isn't worth it. When shopping receivers, Yamaha was on my short list, but I ended up going with Marantz. Fewer bells & whistles but a more solid amp. I certainly don't miss the YPAO, or the 5,000,000 different ways to process sound that would never get used anyway. Using the tape measure & an hour or so with the remote wasn't an ordeal.

I agree with this totally. I had a prologic Yamaha receiver with a zillion music processing options and never used any of them. I went with the Marantz this time and am very happy with my decision. It has all the major sound decoding formats and a multi-speaker stereo modes. It has component switching which I like, but do not need. It has the cleanest power I have ever heard. It has two zone controls which I plan to use for my patio.

I say that the bells and whistles add cost which could be added to things like increasing power or lowering distortion. With that said, one should take a look at what you need or really want in a unit and then find the highest quality receiver in your price range that will do those things. You should rank them in order or importance, in case you have to forgoe something because of cost.

Pat

 

[mtrycrafts]

I've read the reviews on the Yamaha4600 and although the review comes across as the receiver being a solid good sounding receiver, it also left me with the impression that YPAO is not all that accurate and that the results of running the YPAO were inconsistent. For some reason, that scares the speaker connections right off my receiver. Why would I pay (or any one else for that matter), the extra cash for the bells and whistles when it doesn't work consistently? I don't know if the Denon reviews had similar problems. I won't be buying a Denon because in Canada, the mark-up on Denon products is downright scandolous.
Wouldn't the money be better spent going into the amp/pre-amp sections as well as the basic decoding logic rather than spending it on features that may not provide consistent results?

The extra bells and whistles are only useful if you need them now or think you may need them down the road. Unfortunately when you give up on some of these, you may also have to give up on something you didn't want to in the first place.