Anthem MRX 740 vs MRX 1140 AV Receiver Bench Test Comparison!

gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
The similarity in model numbers has tripped me up a few times....preferred the old more easily distinguished model naming routines :)
agreed the new Yamaha model nomenclature gets me cross eyed like when you stare too long and their oversized volume knob. :)
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
But Reviews don’t usually discuss much about the things that get all the complaints.
True, but it is very difficult to review/discuss on complaints about the newer products.

Reviews talk about inaudible measurements and some functions and some subjective listening.
Both are practically useless, unfortunately, though inaudible measurements are at least useful in some ways (my opinion) such as:

- As tie breaker
- To contrast the objective vs subjective, example: 0.1% vs 0.005% THD+N, all other measurements very close, and deemed inaudible, yet reviewer said the 0.1% one sounds better. Then we can at least suggest the reviewer can hear the effects of the higher THD, and happened to prefer that..

Now, let’s talk about the REAL WORLD PERFORMANCE that would significantly affect people in the real world like bugs, lack of features, reliability and compatibility, customer support, repair procedures, warranty, etc.
Absolutely, that should always be included in detailed reviews, it would be difficult to do because the reviewer will have to do a lot of research, detective work and very difficult to gather enough info on newer products.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
For example, apparently NOBODY has ever tested the Class D amp performance of the Anthem receivers until I did on the 740/1140.
Yes, you are also the only one who tested so many channels of the preamp/dac outputs. Best review I have every seen, anywhere. Many thanks for that.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
- As tie breaker
- To contrast the objective vs subjective, example: 0.1% vs 0.005% THD+N, all other measurements very close, and deemed inaudible, yet reviewer said the 0.1% one sounds better. Then we can at least suggest the reviewer can hear the effects of the higher THD, and happened to prefer that..
Good point. This might be the only practical reason.:D

I doubt anyone can hear 0.1% THD+N in the real world. But at least anyone can see that 0.1% THD+N isn't better than 0.005%.
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Overlord
Thanks for the write up Gene. I'm happy to see that you add your "comments" in about the different type of measurements and include certain ones because of demand but appear to be of any relative use. Its a great way to encourage learning. Keep up the good work!!
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I am considering the MRX 540 with an external amp. Is it likely the 540 has the same quality in its preamp output? And its amplifier output?
No one can say for sure, but based on published specs I would say chance is good that the 540, 740, 1140 has the same preamp/dac section. So yes, I would bet 2:1 the 540's pre out quality will be just as good. Amp output will be different, much lower for the 540, the 740/1140 will likely be near identical except the 1140 has more amps and a larger power supply.
 
G

GalZohar

Enthusiast
No one can say for sure, but based on published specs I would say chance is good that the 540, 740, 1140 has the same preamp/dac section. So yes, I would bet 2:1 the 540's pre out quality will be just as good. Amp output will be different, much lower for the 540, the 740/1140 will likely be near identical except the 1140 has more amps and a larger power supply.
Seems like on ASR measurements the 520 were significantly worse than the 1120 and really most measured AVRs. So without confirmation that they fixed something in the 540, I would not assume it.
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Spartan
Seems like on ASR measurements the 520 were significantly worse than the 1120 and really most measured AVRs. So without confirmation that they fixed something in the 540, I would not assume it.
Usually Amir gives the data for the preouts and dac so it shouldn't be too hard to check and see
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Seems like on ASR measurements the 520 were significantly worse than the 1120 and really most measured AVRs. So without confirmation that they fixed something in the 540, I would not assume it.
Please note that I specifically say "I would bet 2:1 the 540's pre out quality will be just as good. ", and that the power amp output will be different.

Below are the 1120 vs 520 pre out performance on SINAD and IMD, you can see the differences are within margin or error.

THD+N - MRX1120 vs MRX520:

1648125556543.png
1648125596019.png


IMD:

The MRX520 was actually a touch better, but still within the margin of error:

1648125720920.png
1648125753501.png
 
Last edited:
G

GalZohar

Enthusiast
Yeah I remembered the review wasn't good but didn't remember that the pre-out was actually OK.
 
tn001d

tn001d

Senior Audioholic
Gene

Would there be much of benefit with the anthem over Denon 4700 when only used as pre-amp processor ?
 
G

GalZohar

Enthusiast
Can you explain why you want the speakers with 12db/oct? And whether a 12db/oct filter is simply applied below the crossover or if the speaker is EQed to match the curve that is set to roll off at 12db/oct? Do you have any measurements that test the effects of these bass management settings - Meaning both separately measuring speaker and subwoofer with crossover active, as well as measuring the combined response?
 
gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
Can you explain why you want the speakers with 12db/oct? And whether a 12db/oct filter is simply applied below the crossover or if the speaker is EQed to match the curve that is set to roll off at 12db/oct? Do you have any measurements that test the effects of these bass management settings - Meaning both separately measuring speaker and subwoofer with crossover active, as well as measuring the combined response?
Ideally you want 12dB/oct HPF on the satellite speakers and 24dB/oct on the sub channel. If you're satellites already have 12db/oct slope acoustically, then they integrate properly with the sub at XOVER. In practice, these slopes work really well in most cases.
 
G

GalZohar

Enthusiast
But what about bookshelves that start to roll off lower than 80Hz?
Also, wouldn't it be different if the speaker is EQed to a curve that rolls off, vs just having a 12db/oct filter applied on top of the eq? From the way ARC displays it, it seems that the rolloff is in the target curve itself so the speaker supposedly would roll off at 12db/oct after EQ, although we would need measurements to confirm that's how it actually works. In that case I wouldn't expect the acoustic rolloff to add 12db/oct on top of that? I've also seen posts saying that the crossover itself adds another 12db/oct filter on both subwoofer and speakers, so the default 12db/oct slopes from the target curve combine with it to provide a symmetric 24db/oct slopes without changing any settings, which would make your 24db/oct slope become a 36db/oct slope with crossover active.

It would be nice to confirm how things actually work, which would require either Anthem better documenting what Arc does or just someone measuring what it does.

I also couldn't find anything about the subwoofer phase adjustment and the newly added automatic phase adjustments. What they actually change, how to use them, and how the automated system works and how optimal is it compared to other solutions (such as manual adjustments based on REW measurements), and whether the new automatic adjustments does anything that couldn't be done before manually.
 
gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
But what about bookshelves that start to roll off lower than 80Hz?
Also, wouldn't it be different if the speaker is EQed to a curve that rolls off, vs just having a 12db/oct filter applied on top of the eq? From the way ARC displays it, it seems that the rolloff is in the target curve itself so the speaker supposedly would roll off at 12db/oct after EQ, although we would need measurements to confirm that's how it actually works. In that case I wouldn't expect the acoustic rolloff to add 12db/oct on top of that? I've also seen posts saying that the crossover itself adds another 12db/oct filter on both subwoofer and speakers, so the default 12db/oct slopes from the target curve combine with it to provide a symmetric 24db/oct slopes without changing any settings, which would make your 24db/oct slope become a 36db/oct slope with crossover active.

It would be nice to confirm how things actually work, which would require either Anthem better documenting what Arc does or just someone measuring what it does.

I also couldn't find anything about the subwoofer phase adjustment and the newly added automatic phase adjustments. What they actually change, how to use them, and how the automated system works and how optimal is it compared to other solutions (such as manual adjustments based on REW measurements), and whether the new automatic adjustments does anything that couldn't be done before manually.
You're overthrowing this. I don't think ARC changes filter slopes. It just manipulates amplitude response and adjusts crossover points.
 
G

GalZohar

Enthusiast
Then what kind/extent of EQ does it apply below the crossover (or above for the sub)? It's not clear from the documentation and the graphs. I would expect either no EQ and just a filter for the crossover, EQ to match the slope of the designated slope, or both.

According to posts on ASR it seems like the filters are applied to match the 12db/oct rolloff, and then the crossover in the AVR applies an additional 12db/oct filter. If that's true, then the newly added 24db/oct slope shouldn't be used?

OK so I did some more digging, and it turns out this was explored pretty extensively by Dr David Rich in 2013 on Secrets of HT and Hi-fi.

If I understand it correctly, he found that ARC does indeed set the xo slope at 12dB, but then uses EQ filters to achieve 24dB acoustic slopes in the final result. Should have known it was all by design....
 
gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
Then what kind/extent of EQ does it apply below the crossover (or above for the sub)? It's not clear from the documentation and the graphs. I would expect either no EQ and just a filter for the crossover, EQ to match the slope of the designated slope, or both.

According to posts on ASR it seems like the filters are applied to match the 12db/oct rolloff, and then the crossover in the AVR applies an additional 12db/oct filter. If that's true, then the newly added 24db/oct slope shouldn't be used?

It's most likely with the 4th order LPF slope fix I asked them to do is the max rolloff with or without ARC engaged. I will test this when I run the speaker calibration.
 
jyavenard

jyavenard

Audiophyte
How would the MRX1140 go about driving as front speakers Dynaudio Contour (4 ohms speakers) using the built-in amplifier?

You mentioned that the anthem was great for 8 or ohms speakers, but what about 4 ohms?

Thanks.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
How would the MRX1140 go about driving as front speakers Dynaudio Contour (4 ohms speakers) using the built-in amplifier?

You mentioned that the anthem was great for 8 or ohms speakers, but what about 4 ohms?

Thanks.
It is better to look at the full specs of your speakers, not just nominal impedance.

Crown Audio - Professional Power Amplifiers

For example, if you have two speakers that have the same specs (hypothetical obviously) except nominal impedance and sensitivity such as:

Speaker A: 8 ohms, 87 dB/W/m vs
Speaker B: 4 ohms, 90 dB/W/m

All else being equal, the Anthem will be able to drive both equally well.

If something else is different, for example if speaker A has some nasty phase angles, then Speaker B will actually be easier to drive, despite being 4 ohms.
 

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