Another Which Sub Thread

[snmhanson]

I am currently runnign a system of Def Tech Mytho 6/7 front and center speakers with no sub as my old one is broken and probably not worth fixing. I was planning up upgrading my speakers and not worrying about a new sub right away. However, after watching Terminator Salvation last night I feel that I am missing out by not having a sub. My speakers are ok so I think I can delay new speakers for a couple of months or so and get a new sub now. Assuming this logic makes sense, I am looking for a sub for a fully encolsed ~4500 cf room. I don't need out of control base, but enough to accurately reproduce the effects of the movies. What is probably equally as important as the sound is aesthetics. My wife would probably make me hide it in a closet if it doesn't look nice. Real wood veneer is a nessesity as is a reasonable footprint - it would be nice to be able to place it under a side table if necessary. Our placement options in the room are also somewhat limited and I will unfortunately likely have to place it around the middle of a side wall but I'll see what I can do to get it closer to a corner. Finally, price is a factor and I would like to stay below $1000 and closer to $600-700 if possible.

With that said, I have a few subs that I am eyeing and wanted to see how you all think they would work out for me. First is the HSU VTF-2 MK3. I like the price on this unit and it seems to fit my specs reasonably well. Second, I have looked at the SVS PB12-Plus. I have always liked the front ported, business upfront design in subs for whatever reason. This would probably be the perfect sub for me but the price is a bit over what I am hoping to spend. I would probably have to wait a while to get the SVS. I also looked briefly at the SB-12Plus. Looks nice and capable but it is tough to believe that a sub that small would be able to fill my room. Finally, the Elemental Designs A5-350 looks to be a compelling option. It would come in right at $1000 with the optional cherry finish. It seems to offer everything I am looking for but I just don't know how it compares to HSU and SVS. It also has a slightly boxier design than some of the other brands and I am not certain that it is a real wood finish (which is a requirement).

So, anyone care to offer their input on these subs? If there are any other subs that meet my needs feel free to include them as well.

Thanks,

Matt

 

[rnatalli]

As you suspected yourself, a smaller sealed sub may have trouble filling the room. My first thought was a Rythmik F15, but I think you'll need a ported design. HSU, SVS, and eD all make great subs. If SQ is a priority, I would look to HSU as their subs tend to be a bit more musical than SVS and eD (ported vs. ported). The HSU VTF-3 MK3 is at $799 and will have more output than the MK2.

 

[snmhanson]

Thanks for the reply rnatalli. I looked at the Rythmic and it looked nice but is not available in a real wood finish. Maybe I'm not seeing the forest through the trees but the real wood thing is an important factor. I like the looks of the HSU subs so I will check out the MK3. Sound quality is important to me but price is as well. However, if the SQ of the MK3 is going to be as good or better than the rest it seems like a win-win since it is would still be less expensive than the other options. So, I think I am leaning towards the HSU but still open to suggestions.

One thing about the MK3. The driver is on the side of the unit. That is fine with me but will it matter if that side of the unit is facing a wall? One of the possible positions in my room would have the speaker in a corner of an alcove and that side would be about six inches away from a wall. That is one of the reasons I was considering the VTF-2 as it has a downward facing driver. Also, when you factor in shipping the VTF-2 comes in at almost $200 less than the VTF-3. Not a big enough amount if there would be a big difference but big enough to not spend it if there won't be that big of a difference.

Matt

 

[njedpx3]

I am currently runnign a system of Def Tech Mytho 6/7 front and center speakers with no sub as my old one is broken and probably not worth fixing. I was planning up upgrading my speakers and not worrying about a new sub right away. However, after watching Terminator Salvation last night I feel that I am missing out by not having a sub. My speakers are ok so I think I can delay new speakers for a couple of months or so and get a new sub now. Assuming this logic makes sense, I am looking for a sub for a fully encolsed ~4500 cf room. I don't need out of control base, but enough to accurately reproduce the effects of the movies. What is probably equally as important as the sound is aesthetics. My wife would probably make me hide it in a closet if it doesn't look nice. Real wood veneer is a nessesity as is a reasonable footprint - it would be nice to be able to place it under a side table if necessary. Our placement options in the room are also somewhat limited and I will unfortunately likely have to place it around the middle of a side wall but I'll see what I can do to get it closer to a corner. Finally, price is a factor and I would like to stay below $1000 and closer to $600-700 if possible.

With that said, I have a few subs that I am eyeing and wanted to see how you all think they would work out for me. First is the HSU VTF-2 MK3. I like the price on this unit and it seems to fit my specs reasonably well. Second, I have looked at the SVS PB12-Plus. I have always liked the front ported, business upfront design in subs for whatever reason. This would probably be the perfect sub for me but the price is a bit over what I am hoping to spend. I would probably have to wait a while to get the SVS. I also looked briefly at the SB-12Plus. Looks nice and capable but it is tough to believe that a sub that small would be able to fill my room. Finally, the Elemental Designs A5-350 looks to be a compelling option. It would come in right at $1000 with the optional cherry finish. It seems to offer everything I am looking for but I just don't know how it compares to HSU and SVS. It also has a slightly boxier design than some of the other brands and I am not certain that it is a real wood finish (which is a requirement).

So, anyone care to offer their input on these subs? If there are any other subs that meet my needs feel free to include them as well.

Thanks,

Matt

Both you sub choices are great, but the SVS PB12-Plus is awesome ( I have one). If the price is too steep, you might try contacting SVS and see if the can alert you when a B-Stock shows up. B-Stock has a slight cosmetic flaw, not usually noticable, but is perfect from an audio standpoint.

Good Luck!

Forest Man

 

[Ares]

Here is my to 2 cents both subs are great and you can't go wrong with either, but get the one you are most drawn to this way you will have no regrets later on.

 

[shadyJ]

Thanks for the reply rnatalli. I looked at the Rythmic and it looked nice but is not available in a real wood finish. Maybe I'm not seeing the forest through the trees but the real wood thing is an important factor. I like the looks of the HSU subs so I will check out the MK3. Sound quality is important to me but price is as well. However, if the SQ of the MK3 is going to be as good or better than the rest it seems like a win-win since it is would still be less expensive than the other options. So, I think I am leaning towards the HSU but still open to suggestions.

One thing about the MK3. The driver is on the side of the unit. That is fine with me but will it matter if that side of the unit is facing a wall? One of the possible positions in my room would have the speaker in a corner of an alcove and that side would be about six inches away from a wall. That is one of the reasons I was considering the VTF-2 as it has a downward facing driver. Also, when you factor in shipping the VTF-2 comes in at almost $200 less than the VTF-3. Not a big enough amount if there would be a big difference but big enough to not spend it if there won't be that big of a difference.

Matt

The direction the driver is facing doesn't matter too much, as long as there is a little bit of room for the driver to move air in. Six inches ought to do fine. Make sure the ports have some space between the wall also.

The PB12 Plus will almost certainly be capable of more output, and probably extends a little bit deeper than the Hsu subs. The Hsu subwoofers are very powerful though, more than enough for most people. In the wood veneers, they are attractive enough to double as an endtable, or something furniture-esque.

Either sub will rock, but I wouldn't place the sub in a closet if I could help it. Placement is very important to get the most out of your sub, and a poorly placed sub can really hurt the sound.

From what I have read, the VTF3 has much better deep bass performance than the VTF2, which might or might not make a difference, depending on what you listen to. What will primarily take advantage of that is modern action and science fiction movies, especially blu-rays. If you are using this to supplement TV shows and music, you might not gain a whole lot with the VTF3, except for a bit of overhead when you want to rock it, but if you have a home theater and you want to feel those deep rumbling sounds as well as hear them, go for the VTF3. It has a nearly flat frequency response to 16 hertz in max extension mode, whereas the VTF2 doesn't quite go so low as easily.

 

[Warpdrv]

SVS's B-Stock isn't always flawed, some are just returns or display models they are letting go... I got 3 of my 4 subs from SVS's B-Stock, and none of them had blemishes and still carried full warranty...

My personal suggestion would lean towards SVS's extremely well designed and heavy duty drivers, they really go the extra mile in terms of development... one of the engineers from TC-Sounds was brought in to SVS after TC-Sounds collapsed resulting in the design of the Ultra 13 driver and the now very competent new 12.4 plus driver.

TC-Sounds still has the reputation for making the best drivers in the world to date for low distortion and linearity - resulting in the cleanest bass.

Not to say that HSU subs aren't all that, heard on the other day, they are still darn good subs for the money.. good luck on your hunt.

 

[snmhanson]

Thanks for all the additional responses. I am new to higher end subs (and audio in general) so this is all pretty eye opening. I am still torn between the Hsu and SVS, however, looking at some other threads it seems that building a sub could be an option as well. I had previously considered it for a brief moment but I wasn't sure how difficult it would be to make sure I am using the right size box, making sure the box is designed correctly, getting the right components and then putting it all together and ending up with a nice final product. Also, while I am pretty capable at building cabinets and furniture, I don't really have the time to build a nice box right now.

With that said, it seems to me that I can buy pre-constructed wood veneer boxes from parts-express and then get the driver and amp as a kit from a company such as Rythmic. Then, all it would take from me is cutting the appropriate sized holes, mounting the amp and driver and connecting everything together. Is it really that easy? Or am I underestimating what it takes? If that's all there is to it and I will end up with a sub that is equal in quality (both form and function) to a SVS or Hsu for a lower price then I think I may just take that approach. Any insight on that route? In particular, are the Dayton Audio wood veneer boxes nice quality and any recommendations on driver/amp kits?

Thanks,

Matt

 

[shadyJ]

If you aren't afraid to DIY, but are looking for an easy kit, this is what I would suggest. All of the MDF is cut for you. Yeah, it costs as much as the assembled PB12 Plus, but the output is insane- it will dwarf the Hsu and SVS subs. Here is a frequency response chart for a finished one. It is basically a unassembled version of this subwoofer. You could put whatever veneer or finish on it that you like. You would want to ask around on the ED forums or ED's customer support on the best ways to get it looking how you want. If you went this route, you would essentially be getting a 2K sub for 1K.

 

[monsterman]

Just a comment on your budget. You have the advantage because you are willing to wait. You can easily come across deals, http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/doc/ele/1512964448.html (easily talk him down to $500), and either save yourself big bucks or get a ton more for your money.