Amp or Receiver

[chalo37]

Just joined the forum and in keeping with the overall Audioholics site its great.
This is a basic question that has certainly been discussed at some point but I don't see it in my searches.
What are the pro and cons of amp / pre amp vs receiver? Is it a matter of personal preference or are there distinct listening advantages? Does using your system for HT and a two channel music influence the choice?

In my situation I wouldn't need a ton of watts. One of the benefits of Hurricane Ivan is that in rebuilding our home Her Majesty has allocated a 15x12 room for me to set up up for HT & music. So amp or receiver? I would spend about about US$1000 on amplification.
Chalo

 

[Nestor]

Is that 1000.00 for just amplification, or does that include signal processing/preamp components as well? And how much power are you shooting for?

 

[Seth=L]

What percent of music and movies do you intend to use the system for?

In your budget, unless you already have a preamp/processor (I imagine you don't), I would recommend a receiver from Yamaha, Denon, Onkyo, or Pioneer Elite.

Also what TV and Sources will you be using? Do you need HDMI switching?

 

[chalo37]

A Grand processing amp or receiver

Is that 1000.00 for just amplification, or does that include signal processing/preamp components as well? And how much power are you shooting for?

$1000 for everything feeding the speakers, processing/ amp or receiver. I'm thinking that in my 15x12 room which is enclosed , no widows and with two doors that i can close, 200 watts is plenty to give me good overhead. Woudn't you think so?

 

[j_garcia]

Why exactly do you need a ton of watts? At $1K, you aren't going to find any separates really, unless you are looking used, and certainly nothing that is producing 200w. In a 15x12 room you shouldn't need a ton of power either, depending on the speakers. If that is what you're after, pick up a mid level receiver and a decent amp (used will get you that kind of power in your budget).

 

[Nick250]

This is a basic question that has certainly been discussed at some point but I don't see it in my searches, what are the pro and cons of amp / pre amp vs receiver? Is it a matter of personal preference or are there distinct listening advantages? Does using your system for HT and a two channel music influence the choice?

In my situation I wouldn't need a ton of watts. One of the benefits of Hurricane Ivan is that in rebuilding our home Her Majesty has allocated a 15x12 room for me to set up up for HT & music. So amp or receiver? I would spend about about US$1000 on amplification.
Chalo

Let me help you with your search since there are a bazillion posts on this topic. There are 382 threads with "amp" in the header.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/search.php?searchid=910751

Here are two very relevant threads on the first page of the search.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26666&highlight=amp

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27799&highlight=amp

Nick

 

[chalo37]

What percent of music and movies do you intend to use the system for?

Also what TV and Sources will you be using? Do you need HDMI switching?

50/50 movies and music Seth, I have a Sony 50" LCD rear projection TV right now but would like to get something like a Sanyo Z4 projector. Evenually will build setup with DVD/ CD ; Mac computer; turntable; keep the TV for regular viewing and have a screen for movies; speakers: ( maybe something like Paradigm Studio 20s or 40s up front and smaller Paradigms surround and back. I mention Paradigms because they and Infinity , JBL, Polk and few others are what are available in Cayman but that's another post.

What is HDMI again?
Do you think 200 watts is plenty to give give good headroom in my 15x12 enclosed room?
Thanks

 

[zumbo]

Do you think 200 watts is plenty to give give good headroom in my 15x12 enclosed room?
Thanks

Where is this 200W H/T 1k receiver? Do you have one in mind? Don't mean to be rude, but I don't know of one.

http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/audioprinciples/interconnects/DVIHDMI.php

 

[Seth=L]

The closest he could get is if he got the Outlaw processor combined with a few behringer A500 amplifiers rated at 250 x 2 watts @ 8ohms. The amps cost around $180 a piece and the Outlaw 970 is $699 plus shipping.

In all honesty, 200 watts isn't all it is cracked up to be. In a room that size you would never need 200 watts per channel. Want to know the difference between 100 watts and 200 watts? It is only 3 decibels, hardly noticable for most people.

Emotiva is another possibility for your processor and amplifier. They have packaged combo with the LMC-1 and LPA-1. The amplifier claims to have 125 watts x 6 all channels driven( the surround back can be configured to run as two seperate channels that run at 50 watts x 2, more than enough for surround back channels. The LMC-1 processor is $499 plus shipping by itself, if you buy the amp with it you can the system for $899 plus shipping.

http://emotiva.com/

 

[chalo37]

Why exactly do you need a ton of watts?

Mr. Garcia I said "I wouldn't need a ton of watts." Her Majesty has given me a small room.

And I'm also asking a question for the sake of discussion is there really significant improvement in sound if one uses even a $5000 amp and pre amp as opposed to a $5000 receiver. By significant I mean will I hear the difference or will I have to go to one of those Canadian sound labs and hook it up to a scope to tell the difference.

Thanks for the interest, and I hear what you're saying.

 

[Seth=L]

HDMI-

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28289&highlight=HDMI

Read that article for a complete understanding of HDMI and what it does.

 

[zumbo]

And I'm also asking a question for the sake of discussion is there really significant improvement in sound if one uses even a $5000 amp and pre amp as opposed to a $5000 receiver. By significant I mean will I hear the difference or will I have to go to one of those Canadian sound labs and hook it up to a scope to tell the difference.

Thanks for the interest, and I hear what you're saying.

Features/connections are also an important factor. The best way to get help is to determine what's best for you.

What features/connections are needed?
What speakers will be used?
What is the REAL budget?

 

[zumbo]

In most cases, seperates will yield better SQ.

In most cases, a quality H/T receiver will have a better list of connections/features for the money.

A cost effictive way to get both(if more power is needed), is to add an external amp to a H/T receiver.

 

[mlhm5]

Separate Tuner

Most receiver's tuner section is not anywhere as good as a separate tuner. There are many good vintage tuners out there that can be had for $150 or less.

Plus, you can roll your tuners.

 

[j_garcia]

The difference between 100 and 200 quality watts will be VERY noticable, however in a room that size, you probably don't need it with average sensitivity speakers. 13x15 is a medium size room, so a good $750-$1K receiver would be plenty for it with any decent speakers. I'd start with that and then IF you need more, you can always add an amp to that.

I'd focus on speakers FIRST, since they make the biggest difference in sound.

 

[cfrizz]

Hi Chalo37.

I am a firm believer in having separate amplification of at least 200wpc. Now if you already have a receiver that has preamp outputs all you need to do is buy a separate 200wpc amp. Outlaw gives you good bang for the buck. If you don't mind going used you can buy lots of power. Just check out Audiogon.

If you don't, then get a lower cost receiver with preouts & also get a separate amp.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[Warpdrv]

Hi Chalo37.

I am a firm believer in having separate amplification of at least 200wpc. Now if you already have a receiver that has preamp outputs all you need to do is buy a separate 200wpc amp. Outlaw gives you good bang for the buck. If you don't mind going used you can buy lots of power. Just check out Audiogon.

If you don't, then get a lower cost receiver with preouts & also get a separate amp.

Good luck with your decision.

+1 on that thought process... I just bought a used Rotel 1095 amp 200 x 5 that will be coupled with a receiver with pre outs.. until I can find a good Pre/Pro.. most cost effective way to deal with my own situation.

 

[PENG]

What are the pro and cons of amp / pre amp vs receiver? Is it a matter of personal preference or are there distinct listening advantages? Does using your system for HT and a two channel music influence the choice?
Chalo

Pros: In general, separates should give you more flexibility (mix & match, upgrade possibilites, placement etc.), better SQ, more power.

Cons: In general, less cost effective than mass market receivers. It is cheaper to build everything in one box, and sell in huge volume. Manufacturers sell so many receivers these days they get good at building them and can afford to take a lower profit margin. They cannot do the same with separate components as they sell much less of them.

So amp or receiver? I would spend about about US$1000 on amplification.
Chalo

Assuming you want to buy new, if you can live without HDMI switching and some of the latest features, you can get something like a RX-V1600, HKAVR235, 240, or Denon AVR2105 (or 2805 if you can find one cheap) plus a 2X125 to 2X150W amp. It may exceed you budget slightly. Any of the lower price amps such as the Parasound HCA-2125, NAD C272, Rotel RB-1070 all cost about US$600 to 800. I think any serious separate prepro will be more expensive than a mid level receiver, so unless you want to stretch your budget or buy used, mid level receiver is the way to go. Don't forget if you go prepro, you would have to get a 5 or 7 channel power amp as well whether you need those power for the surround channels or not.

You could also go with 2 Outlaw monoblock (US$325 each) for now and add another one later. That will get you 200W per channel. The mid level receiver such as the RX-V1600, HKAVR235, or Denon AVR2105 (or 2805) should be able to power your center and surround channels in that 12X15 room until you are ready to expand the system.

 

[mtrycrafts]

And I'm also asking a question for the sake of discussion is there really significant improvement in sound .

No, there won't be. Why would there be? I would expect a $5000 amp/receiver to be well designed, hence transparent withing their design limits.
And, to really respond to your question, what speakers are you driving?

Speakers are the ones that determines what power it needs and the level that you play them at. Do you play it very loud, 105 dB max reference levels on a routine base?