Add A Power Amp?

[stephena]

Hi,
I have a Denon AVR 3805 & a DVD 2800 and Dynaudio speakers. I have been told that to enhance CD playback to add (in order of preferrence) a power amp or a DAC or a CD player. I would appreciate you views on the best option or another option.

Thanks.

 

[jaxvon]

Have you thought at all about room acoustics? Aside from your speakers, it's the biggest factor in your sound. I suggest you start there and then move on to different components.

That said, is your room bright, dead, carpet, wood, big, small, etc.?

If your speakers are 4 Ohm (not sure which Dynaudios you have), then you could probably benefit from the addition of a separate amp, but probably not as much as fixing acoustical issues (unless you've already done that).

 

[mtrycrafts]

Hi,
I have a Denon AVR 3805 & a DVD 2800 and Dynaudio speakers. I have been told that to enhance CD playback to add (in order of preferrence) a power amp or a DAC or a CD player. I would appreciate you views on the best option or another option.

Thanks.

Since jax answered on the amp, the answer to DAC and CD player is no, don't waste you $$$. More audio myth, bs and voodoo.

 

[jaxvon]

Not COMPLETELY voodoo on the CD player and DAC. Granted, if you're using the digital output on your Denon player, it will sound the same as any other CD player, regardless of price. However, the DAC sections do vary from player to player and many esoteric CD players have DAC sections designed to have a signature sound (read:coloration). If you have money to burn and have exhasuted other areas of improving your sound (like acoustics, speakers, and proper amplification), then you might want to think about a different CD player. Not for an improvement, but rather for a different sound that perhaps you like better.

Also, when I say "proper amplification", this is referring to using an amplifier that has the guts to handle your speakers. You can't run electrostatics off a cheap $200 receiver. They need a dedicated amp, or at least a flagship receiver like the Denon 5805. But any decent receiver, such as your Denon, will be able to drive 8 ohm speakers with ease, even to very loud levels.

I hope this helps clarify things. By the way, there is a huge section on acoustics on the Audioholics main site that you should check out. If you haven't done so already, you can make some DIY sound treatments that will very audibly improve your listening experience for around $300.

 

[WmAx]

N However, the DAC sections do vary from player to player and many esoteric CD players have DAC sections designed to have a signature sound (read:coloration).

While some may have a coloration, I would not go so far as to state that many have a coloration. Referencing a 3rd party databank of valid extensive measurements[Stereophile] does not demonstrate such behaviour as being typical.

Also, when I say "proper amplification", this is referring to using an amplifier that has the guts to handle your speakers. You can't run electrostatics off a cheap $200 receiver.

Behringer[ ] has recently made available a powerful new amplifier[model A500] geared towards studio and home use that is priced under $200 USD. It is stabile into low impedances, and has no fan[so that it is silent]. It also offers both dedicated unbalanced and balanced inputs so that is easily adapted into any professional or consumer application. This would be an ideal choice for low impedance speakers that a typical $200 reciever might have trouble driving.

-Chris

 

[jaxvon]

While some may have a coloration, I would not go so far as to state that many have a coloration. Referencing a 3rd party databank of valid extensive measurements[Stereophile] does not demonstrate such behaviour as being typical.

I find this surprsing. While I have not poured over Stereophile measurements recently, I remember on the CD players that I did look up did tend to have nonlinear response. But I guess "many" was incorrect. However, I would think that the group of CD players that use tubes in the output stage would most definitely introduce a fair amount of distortion, as well as a "warm" sound (due to a purposeful increase in the midrange and midbass and perhaps a slight rolloff in the highs).

Behringer[ ] has recently made available a powerful new amplifier[model A500] geared towards studio and home use that is priced under $200 USD. It is stabile into low impedances, and has no fan[so that it is silent]. It also offers both dedicated unbalanced and balanced inputs so that is easily adapted into any professional or consumer application. This would be an ideal choice for low impedance speakers that a typical $200 reciever might have trouble driving.

-Chris

Well, we know that Berhinger is known for delivering high-value products. In fact, I recently picked up a Berhinger Keyboard amp at Guitar Center (cheapest I could find because I'm poor) and after some use, I find it to be superior to many other, much more expensive units I've used, including those by Roland. We both know that no $200 receiver is 4-ohm stable, while a quality amp like the one you mentioned is accessible for the same price and can provide linear, low distortion, and high current amplification for your speakers.

You know, after all the posting you do here, I'm surprised you don't work for Audioholics. But I seem to remember you living a bit far away from Florida...

 

[stephena]

Thank you for you advice, the debate is facinating and informative.

Mt viewing/listening room is a carpetted 7m x 5m containing two 3 sofas and an armchair. The walls are painted brick (no gyprock) with two 3m curtained windows and a slow combustion wood heater, yes it can get cold in Western Australia occasionally.

My main speakers are Dynaudience 80's I think they are 4 ohm, might be 6, (i'm at work at the moment) with a Miller & Kriesel sub. If I clap my hands, an echo is audiable.

I will check out the Audioholics main site for acoustics, but your thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[WmAx]

I find this surprsing. While I have not poured over Stereophile measurements recently, I remember on the CD players that I did look up did tend to have nonlinear response.

Define non-linear. Minus 2dB at 20Hz or minus 2 db at 20kHz is not going to be readily audible, but it could be defined as non-linear.

However, I would think that the group of CD players that use tubes in the output stage would most definitely introduce a fair amount of distortion, as well as a "warm" sound (due to a purposeful increase in the midrange and midbass and perhaps a slight rolloff in the highs).

While a tube preamp stage can be easily designed to introduce such colaration(s), there is no reason that the stage can not be linear and with inaudible levels of distortion. However, I do not have any statistical data on tube based cd player linearity, so I can not comment on whether many would apply to this group.

-Chris

 

[jaxvon]

After doing some looking around Stereophile's website, even the tubed CD players I could find had no more than -1dB of nonlinearity (and this was a gradual rolloff from 10kHz-20kHz). I therefore retract my earlier statement about the nonlinearities. I do know of one piece (not a CD player), that being an Intergrated amp from Onix that Gene tested and described as being "warm". Measurements indicated a small bump in the midbass and midrange frequencies.

 

[mulester7]

Behringer[ ] has recently made available a powerful new amplifier[model A500] geared towards studio and home use that is priced under $200 USD. It is stabile into low impedances, and has no fan[so that it is silent]. It also offers both dedicated unbalanced and balanced inputs so that is easily adapted into any professional or consumer application. This would be an ideal choice for low impedance speakers that a typical $200 reciever might have trouble driving.

-Chris

.....WmAx, very good find....very good specs....very good price.....here is their most powerful amp for a lowly 300 bucks....download the PDF MANUAL for detailed specs, page 11.....

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/480697/

 

[WmAx]

.....WmAx, very good find....very good specs....very good price.....here is their most powerful amp for a lowly 300 bucks....download the PDF MANUAL for detailed specs, page 11.....

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/480697/

Yes, but please remember that the EP2500[ that you linked ] has fans, that may be a noise issue. The A500 uses large heatsinks to cool. Also, the EP2500 is a PWM based amplifier, where as the A500 is a conventional AB class amplifier. I am not implying an audible relevance, but just pointing out the differences. The A500 also has a choice of TRS, XLR and RCA inputs. The EP2500 requires an adapter to mate a standard unbalanced consumer connection. I do not remember if the EP2500 has adjustable input trims, but the A500 does.

-Chris