4 speakers for upgrade debate?

[Hetfield]

As a crazy HT guy I am always thinking about upgrading speakers. Now I'm not about to do anything quite yet as I do love the speakers I currently have. But just for fun which direction would you go with what I have picked out for an upgrade? I currently have RSL CG23 for LCR and CG3 surrounds, pretty simple there. As I said these speakers do sounds great.
System 1, Stick with RSL but go to CG25 LCR and CG5 surrounds.
System 2, SVS Ultra bookshelf L/R and Ultra center, surrounds I'll figure out later but just use my CG3's for now.
System 3, PSA MT-110-M for LCR and again figure the surrounds out down the line.
System 4, Ascend Acoustics Sierra 1, non RAAL of course version and Sierra 1 center.
The last 2 are last for a reason, they are more than I'd like to spend. I have a PB-2000 Pro and PB-1000 for sub duties. Yes I know totally different subs but I had the PB-1000 before getting the PB-2000 Pro and why waste it and not use it.
FYI, I was just watching Indiana Jones and the last crusade and thoroughly enjoyed it with my current RSL's. Who knows if I upgrade, maybe, maybe not. What are your thoughts in general.

 

[shadyJ]

System 1: The CG5 series is definitely a worthwhile upgrade from the CG3s. My preference would be CG5s all around, even the center, unless you really wanted the extra dynamic range from the CG25s. The CG5s have much wider vertical coverage than the CG25s, and you can use that to your advantage. The CG5s don't have quite as much boosted mid-bass as the CG25s either, but you can always EQ that down.

System 2: SVS Ultra looks to be fine, and their 3-way center doesn't come with all the dispersion problems of these MTM centers.

System 3: Not a fan. I heard the older version of the MT110s and wasn't impressed. The people I was with thought the Behringer 215XLs were better and they were $150 each. No speaker at that price point should be using such janky waveguides. If you want high-sensitivity, the Klipsch RP-8000F has a better waveguide and actual low-frequency extension.

System 4: Ascend Sierra 1 is a known quantity and seems to be good. An advantage it would have over the RAAL tweeter version is that it wouldn't have such narrow vertical dispersion.

If you want to stay with passive speakers, in this class of speaker you should also be looking at Monoprice Monolith THX speakers. An Outlaw Audio LCRv2 setup would be nice too. If it were me, I would go active and go for something like Kali IN-8, Presonus Eris E8 XT, ADAM Audio T8V, JBL LSR308, and a few others in that class.

 

[Hetfield]

System 1: The CG5 series is definitely a worthwhile upgrade from the CG3s. My preference would be CG5s all around, even the center, unless you really wanted the extra dynamic range from the CG25s. The CG5s have much wider vertical coverage than the CG25s, and you can use that to your advantage. The CG5s don't have quite as much boosted mid-bass as the CG25s either, but you can always EQ that down.

System 2: SVS Ultra looks to be fine, and their 3-way center doesn't come with all the dispersion problems of these MTM centers.

System 3: Not a fan. I heard the older version of the MT110s and wasn't impressed. The people I was with thought the Behringer 215XLs were better and they were $150 each. No speaker at that price point should be using such janky waveguides. If you want high-sensitivity, the Klipsch RP-8000F has a better waveguide and actual low-frequency extension.

System 4: Ascend Sierra 1 is a known quantity and seems to be good. An advantage it would have over the RAAL tweeter version is that it wouldn't have such narrow vertical dispersion.

If you want to stay with passive speakers, in this class of speaker you should also be looking at Monoprice Monolith THX speakers. An Outlaw Audio LCRv2 setup would be nice too. If it were me, I would go active and go for something like Kali IN-8, Presonus Eris E8 XT, ADAM Audio T8V, JBL LSR308, and a few others in that class.

Oh wow excellent advice and I can tell you really like the CG5 line. I may just order 2 CG5s and see what happens. They are better than the 2 driver CG25s in your opinion because that's pretty impressive. I'd have to do a CG25 for center because I need it horizontal to fit my situation where my TV sits. I'm personally not a fan of laying a vertical speaker on it's side.
Yeah I want to stay passive, powered are just not my thing, at least right now they aren't.
Wow I'm beyond stunned you aren't a fan of the PSA speakers. They are supposed to be super duper dynamic and they have extremely high sensitivity. They are more than I want to spend anyway.

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[kini]

Wow I'm beyond stunned you aren't a fan of the PSA speakers. They are supposed to be super duper dynamic and they have extremely high sensitivity. They are more than I want to spend anyway.

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I tried the newest version late last year. I wasn't impressed. They were less efficient than the Klipsch RF62IIs I had at the time and had no useful output below about 90hz in my room. They sounded identical to the Klipsch. Just not as bright at high volumes.

The Kef Q750/650C I ended up with are better speakers in every way.

 

[ryanosaur]

Wow I'm beyond stunned you aren't a fan of the PSA speakers

Without good third party measurements, it's hard to get behind a company like that. I get there are a lot of fans out there, and Tom seems to be pretty well respected. But still, there is no real evidence of the efficacy of his designs. In fact, for the Subs, he's been promising measurements for almost a year now.
His/their designs leave a lot of questions hanging.

 

[Hetfield]

Wow great info guys, I'm learning a lot. I'd also wouldn't mind trying DIY Sound group Volt 6 speakers but the entire site for the most part has been "out of stock" for months now. I'm still learning, watching reviews, and reading about different speakers. I do like RSL so maybe the CG5s are in my future.
Gotta take a look at Monolith THX speakers too. Why not give them a look.
I was also told to look at Infinity 152/162. The JBL Studio 530's are on sale at Amazon for I think 375. They are ugly as can be though, quite large bookshelf speakers too. Any thoughts on those?

 

[Pogre]

Oh wow excellent advice and I can tell you really like the CG5 line. I may just order 2 CG5s and see what happens. They are better than the 2 driver CG25s in your opinion because that's pretty impressive. I'd have to do a CG25 for center because I need it horizontal to fit my situation where my TV sits. I'm personally not a fan of laying a vertical speaker on it's side.
Yeah I want to stay passive, powered are just not my thing, at least right now they aren't.
Wow I'm beyond stunned you aren't a fan of the PSA speakers. They are supposed to be super duper dynamic and they have extremely high sensitivity. They are more than I want to spend anyway.

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You already know my thoughts on the Ultras. I loved those speakers and in fact agree with Marshall's review when he said the books were the stars of the show. The towers are awesome but more finicky and the books retain most of the good qualities of the towers minus deep bass and some dynamic range.

For you I'm thinking, along with shady's recommendation, sticking with RSL might just be the way to go. The CG5 looks like a great speaker, right up there with the Ultras, and you already have a start with RSL. You can repurpose what you have for surround duties and save a few bucks. Maybe put it toward another PB2000 Pro...

Oh yeah. I went there!

 

[ryanosaur]

. I'd also wouldn't mind trying DIY Sound group Volt 6 speakers but the entire site for the most part has been "out of stock" for months now

Erin did some reviews of their Speakers... not great overall. Not horrific, but not great.
They are out of stock because they are relocating. It also seems like this is a side business for them, as the last update posted was from April. They certainly are taking their sweet time getting back together.

 

[Hetfield]

Erin did some reviews of their Speakers... not great overall. Not horrific, but not great.
They are out of stock because they are relocating. It also seems like this is a side business for them, as the last update posted was from April. They certainly are taking their sweet time getting back together.

And they seem a bit salty about people asking why they are out of stock.
Yeah I'm not sure where to go. The blemish sale of the CG5 is tempting, 250 each right now.

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[lovinthehd]

Building/finishing your own boxes can be an option....but not for everyone. If shadyJ likes the upgrade for RSL model I'd probably roll with that. OTOH if really wanting another experience perbaps saving up some more before buying something could be a thought....

 

[Hetfield]

I have been looking at the JBL Studio speakers since yesterday. The Studio 530 and 570 in particular. I'd wait for a really good sale of course. They are pretty inefficient which bothers me a tad but reviews say they are pretty awesome. I heard the 570's go on sale for 200 each sometimes, that I'd have to give a listen to. They are ugly as all hell too. Any thoughts?

 

[shadyJ]

I have been looking at the JBL Studio speakers since yesterday. The Studio 530 and 570 in particular. I'd wait for a really good sale of course. They are pretty inefficient which bothers me a tad but reviews say they are pretty awesome. I heard the 570's go on sale for 200 each sometimes, that I'd have to give a listen to. They are ugly as all hell too. Any thoughts?

The JBLs are not that inefficient, certainly no more so than typical speakers that have a dome on a flat baffle.

 

[Hetfield]

The JBLs are not that inefficient, certainly no more so than typical speakers that have a dome on a flat baffle.

The 530s are 86 but 570s are 88. That's not too bad I guess. I mean I have a nice Parasound amp up drive them.
I almost ordered the blemish RSL CG5s this morning. I mean why not. It would really help if they accepted Amazon payments. I have a ton of credit there. And it's just super convenient.

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[Pogre]

Oh man, I'm feeling you so much in this thread. I have a half dozen or so just like this. That upgrade itch man, the struggle is real. I'm usually good for about 6 months or so, then that itch always comes back!

Like Dennis introducing the BMR Towers not long after I purchased my Sierra towers... damnit.

 

[Hetfield]

Oh man, I'm feeling you so much in this thread. I have a half dozen or so just like this. That upgrade itch man, the struggle is real. I'm usually good for about 6 months or so, then that itch always comes back!

Like Dennis introducing the BMR Towers not long after I purchased my Sierra towers... damnit.

It's truly a disease but at least we all have it here. We can cry in our beers together over something trivial like speaker upgrades.
I also don't want anyone to think what I have now is not good, these RSL speakers are fantastic especially at the price.

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[lovinthehd]

I have been looking at the JBL Studio speakers since yesterday. The Studio 530 and 570 in particular. I'd wait for a really good sale of course. They are pretty inefficient which bothers me a tad but reviews say they are pretty awesome. I heard the 570's go on sale for 200 each sometimes, that I'd have to give a listen to. They are ugly as all hell too. Any thoughts?

I own 590s, 580s and 530s (L/R, surrounds and rear surrounds respectively, all obtained on deep discount sale prices). When they go on the killer sales they're a thought, altho no experience with the 570. The 590s are a bit more sensitive, too. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder Then I think most coffin boxes are hard to pretty up overall....

 

[Hetfield]

Anyone have any experience with Emotiva speakers? Just curious about the T zero at that insane price and then the T-1 plus. How is the ribbon tweeter and overall the speakers themselves?

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[ryanosaur]

Anyone have any experience with Emotiva speakers? Just curious about the T zero at that insane price and then the T-1 plus. How is the ribbon tweeter and overall the speakers themselves?

I shopped their gear pretty hard for a while. Haven’t regretted not buying from them. There is a strong following, for them, but I think it’s more about the budget friendly cost.
@lp85253 has a pair of the bookshelves that he sent to Dennis to mod: he seems to like the end result.
Are they a hard pass? That’s a tough one. The AMT tweeter seems flawed as I recall from a few years ago, and I don’t really trust the company. So for me, yes.

 

[Hetfield]

I shopped their gear pretty hard for a while. Haven’t regretted not buying from them. There is a strong following, for them, but I think it’s more about the budget friendly cost.
@lp85253 has a pair of the bookshelves that he sent to Dennis to mod: he seems to like the end result.
Are they a hard pass? That’s a tough one. The AMT tweeter seems flawed as I recall from a few years ago, and I don’t really trust the company. So for me, yes.

I have heard things about them lately I don't like. Just some quality control issues but that's mostly with electronics. Haven't heard much about the speakers being an issue.

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[ryanosaur]

I have heard things about them lately I don't like. Just some quality control issues but that's mostly with electronics. Haven't heard much about the speakers being an issue.

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I think they finally had a review of their gear after I bought mine rig from Dennis. Stereophile did a review of one of the Towers with measurements by JA, and Amir did the B1 earlier this year iirc.
Just refreshing my memory on the tower, from a FR standpoint, there is elevated Bass and Treble while the entirety of the Mids is depressed. I didn't dig deep enough to see if they mention the Tweeter XO point, but the measured response is pretty jagged. *shrugs
That said, JA even wrote that while acknowledging the flaws, it's pretty easy to overlook them for the cost, cabinet resonance and all.
Amir left the head on the Panther, so for him and the B1 that's pretty high praise.

No, when it comes to the Speakers, I haven't seen anything strikingly off about their overall quality, but when you have a company like Emo that has a certain level of ADHD woven into the fabric of their culture, you really never know what you are going to get. For me, I see that manifesting in an abrupt redesign of their Airmotivs, or a hard cancellation of a product within that line, and then no way to get support. A blown Driver, if updated to a different model, will result in the same message others have gotten: "we no longer support that product and cannot repair or service it." (Not a direct quote, mind, but the gist of their responses to customers with gear they no longer support.)

Anyway, my biggest complaint about them was when I was shopping their gear, the deeper I dug into potentially spending thousands of dollars with them, the less their CS and Tech guys knew about their product. The inability to answer simple questions about Amplifier performance and other such questions is what ran me off. Then watching the slow-motion trainwreck of the RMC-1 which is still not fulfilling promised features only reinforced that I made the right decision.