3 Channel Amplifier...

[Chopin_Guy]

So, already looking to the next upgrade and I was considering an external amp (otherwise I might start looking at new speakers) for the front three channels as those are the most important and especially for my music listening experience as well in 2 channel...

My question is what are some good options in the three channel arena that are not horrifically expensive...Of course I know about the Emo Xpa-3 but am a little reluctant do to what I have heard about reliability. I have seen B&K Reference 200.3 amplifiers on Audiogon for around $850.00 which seems to be good as well....

So if anyone has some ideas it would be most appreciated, and of course I would not object to getting a 5 channel amp but I figure three is all anyone will benefit from as any quality AVR can drive what little the surround channels do....Thanks guys!!!

 

[jostenmeat]

JMO, Chopin Guy, but I would look towards room treatments or speaker upgrade first. Your amp is not exactly a wimp, you don't seem to have extremely difficult speakers or great seated distance from speakers. (or maybe you do?).

Acoustic companies sell stands to put the treatments on, if you don't want to "permanently" mount them.

Again, JMO. If treatments are impossibility, I'd look towards speakers.

If you are having nothing to do with the above, look towards superceded Rotel deals. Also, Outlaw, NAD, and Sunfire from the classifieds.

Or if a 3ch amp, I know Anthem at least used to make them, and there are also monoblocks from Outlaw that are usually had $225 per from classifieds. Even multiple times here in classified subforum very recently.

 

[Swerd]

My question is what are some good options in the three channel arena that are not horrifically expensive...Of course I know about the Emo Xpa-3 but am a little reluctant do to what I have heard about reliability. I have seen B&K Reference 200.3 amplifiers on Audiogon for around $850.00 which seems to be good as well....

So if anyone has some ideas it would be most appreciated, and of course I would not object to getting a 5 channel amp but I figure three is all anyone will benefit from as any quality AVR can drive what little the surround channels do....Thanks guys!!!

I believe B&K no longer sells three channel amps, although they occasionally appear on Audiogon.

If you are considering new construction, amps made by Audio by Van Alstine are very good. AVA is an internet direct company in Minneapolis, MN. The owner, Frank Van Alstine is a minor legend among amp builders, and is a good person to do business with.

The AVA Insight 240/3 is a 3-channel model. I've heard their 2-channel version and I think it is excellent. They are very conservatively rated at 125 wpc at 8 ohms and are stable down to (and probably below) 4 ohms.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

See if you can find a used Rotel on Audiogon.

 

[Chopin_Guy]

Thank you gentlemen. I know that the Rotel RMB-1075 and 1095 can be had for good prices on Audiogon now...And what you said Josten is kind of what I was thinking as I was submitting the post, but being in my space does not allow me for acoustic treatments not to mention my walls already have too much on them...

So I don't know what route I might choose to go but new speakers would mean going back to 2.1 until I could build up again...which wouldn't be the end of the world...but don't have the money to purchase all 5 channels at one time...I just thought the amp would be a good future proof purchase in terms of performance for my system...

 

[MatthewB.]

I agree with Jostenmeat, you will get far better sound quality investing in Room acoustics rather than miniscule improvement with a new amp. If you are not noticing any distortion with your current amp, then what you have is fine and wasting money on another amp for a 3db increase in sound is foolish.

Room acoustics are far cheaper and have more of an impact on sound quality when placed properly and will make your current speakers sound way better because it is defeating the sound reflections of the room.

 

[ggunnell]

I think power amping the front three speakers and letting the receiver drive the surrounds is a very cost effective upgrade.
The previous posters have covered the ground:
1. The Emotiva XPS-3
2. The Anthem MCA-30 (you'd have to find a used one to compete on price)
3. Three of the Outlaw 2200 monoblocks
4. The Van Alstine 240/3
To this list I can add:
5. The Odyssey HT3, which, at close to $1600, is meant to match with very good associated equipment.

To keep amp prices in perspective, you can get an Onkyo 876 receiver with around 140W@ch for $1100 street.

 

[Chopin_Guy]

I understand the value and advantages of having acoustic treatments, but that is simply not an option in my case....I just thought the amp would be a good system investment to have for the future, but now I have speakers on the brain....or am I totally crazy?? Which is entirely possible...

I wish I could treat my room but one end is all glass and the rest is open (living in a loft)....so now I might need to talk speakers....

 

[PENG]

So I don't know what route I might choose to go but new speakers would mean going back to 2.1 until I could build up again...which wouldn't be the end of the world...but don't have the money to purchase all 5 channels at one time...I just thought the amp would be a good future proof purchase in terms of performance for my system...

I think you are right. If you replace your front 3 speakers with products from KEF, Energy Veritas (or RC series), Paradigm Studios, Polk LSI, PSB, Dynaudio in the $2,500 to $3,000 range (L/R/C), you will gain much more in SQ than if you spend the same amount on amps, but you can spend half that amount on a decent 3 channel amp that is future proof.

On the other hand you can pick up the LSI9 L/R/C and a used 3 channel amp (a must for LSi speakers) for under $2K and sell the RTis to offset part of the cost.

 

[cfrizz]

Getting an amp IS a very good future investment. You will have that amp no matter what else you decide to upgrade. You should just get a 5 channel amp & be done with that particular upgrade once & for all.

My favorite amps are Parasound, Outlaw, Rotel & Sunfire.

...I just thought the amp would be a good system investment to have for the future, but now I have speakers on the brain....or am I totally crazy?? Which is entirely possible...

I wish I could treat my room but one end is all glass and the rest is open (living in a loft)....so now I might need to talk speakers....

 

[davidtwotrees]

220w x 3ch Parasound

I own a Parasound HCA2003 three channel amp. It is an excellent piece of gear with outstanding build quality and substantial heft (57#). Used, I paid $733 shipped for it last summer.
Attached is a picture of it sitting on my custom Japanese amp stand.......
It doesn't bother me, but some here would not like the lack of a 12 volt trigger.......hth.

 

[Warpdrv]

SAVE YOUR MONEY......

Get some Yamaha Pro Audio Amps, they will provide you with more bang for your buck and are measured to be excellent performers for anything you could possibly throw at them, you will attain far more clean amplification with proamps then you will ever get from botique amps.... I have learned over the years, that your just wasting your money on looks with the botiques. Search the boards, and you will find the answer...

 

[Chopin_Guy]

So many points of view and ideas to consider...all of which I know have their founding and experience behind them....

I suppose I will have to sit on it for a while and decide what to do...the route of speakers is just such a big expense...yet I know I can get better sound than what my RTi12's provide....Lots of research to come...thats for sure...

 

[mike c]

while i own and agree that the yamaha amps are the most bang for the buck without the fan noise ...

their ONE con is that they're not 12v triggerable.

looks wise, i think they look very cool!

 

[Davemcc]

If your current amplifier is doing it's job without distortion and room treatments are impossible, perhaps you could consider using the Behringer DSP to custom tailor the sound to your preference.

 

[Chopin_Guy]

The more I listen I think I am looking for more open, detailed, and dynamic sound from my speakers if that makes a shred of sense...but hate the thought of starting to build up again....Not to mention going to audition the possibilities...

I was actually considering going some monitors (Polk LSi, Paradigm) and getting two SVS SB12-plus subwoofers for a nice full range front 2 channel system for a little while and then going from there to build up a full 5 channel system again...Anyone have some thoughts on this idea?? I would run speaker level through the subs crossed-over at 80 hz or so then to the monitors to give the full range on the front channels...

 

[ggunnell]

I have two PB13-Ultras and two SB12's -- I'm using the Ultras

From what I've read, I'd recommend the SVS MTS line of speakers -- not cheap, but they'll do what you describe you want. If you can't get clarity out of an AirCirc tweeter, it's not in the recording.

I concur with others that you HAVE to do some treatments. Even detailed EQ isn't going to stop nearfield reflections from blurring your soundfield.

Easy stuff:
If your floor is not carpet, get carpet or large rugs.
Put up a traverse rod over that glass and hang thick drapes.

Hard stuff:
My guess is that your biggest problem is your loft ceiling. Ceiling treatments are expensive and for the most part permanent (a problem if you are renting). One less expensive temporary solution is to use heavy insulated drapery material supported by 1x3's screwed through the drapery material into studs in the ceiling. The drapery material hangs down in U s between the 1x3s. At a minimum, you'll need to treat the ceiling immediately over your listening position, as well as the first reflection point from your speakers (a strip about halfway to your speakers).

Since you have an SMS-1, try this: Put your Ultra in 10Hz mode (for lowest group delay not extention). Now use your SMS-1 to make a 'curve' that is as flat as you can get it above 40 Hz, and gradual straight line rolloff below 40 Hz. It's really two straight lines intersecting at 40Hz. I came up with this by ear listening to classical instruments, but I've subsequntly read that this kind of EQ curve often works well in mid-sized rooms.

 

[Chopin_Guy]

Ggennell,

Thank you for the suggestions....I'm not quite sure what you were getting at with the subs but I would keep my ultra on the LFE channel and use the SB12's via their speaker level inputs so I could create full range front channels with monitors on stands...

As for treatments I could do rugs except my cats like to tear them to shreds so it is a waste of money...and as for the thick drapes the cost would be astronomical as they would have to be custom made panels as the whole side of the loft is glass essentially...around 21 feet long and at least 12 feet high of glass...

So you see my problem, this space where the theater is also is open to the kitchen and dinning as it is all one big space only split up by the furniture...This is why I might look at speakers as I know I can do better than the mainstream RTi---if I am wrong and then please advise but it might be the time for speakers....

 

[jostenmeat]

Welp, it looks like upgraditis has really taken hold!

Are you happy with your speakers? Yes?

Maybe put take that money burning a hole in your pocket, save some more, get a Projector!!!!

manual pull down screen to fall over the flat panel. Say $300. I got mine custom ordered in black, and it was very little more (can't remember exactly, $50?). Maybe they could do yours to match your front wall in red.

Of course with 21 ft of windows on the side, it would be only for movies at night.

Just an idea.

 

[davidtwotrees]

I don't think they make a three channel pro amp. Five channel? Seven channel? Thought so. I also find them ugly.....but that's just me..........
Anyway, I can attest to amps not making a shred of difference in my rig, or not a cost effective one..........the tube guys aren't far off in saying it's the first watt that counts.....You are on the right track. When I went from $800 front speakers to $2500 front speakers the difference was night and day.
I've done some room treatments, but it was nothing compared to a big speaker upgrade.