2 Bookshelves with a $300 budget!

[MisterK]

I'm trying to piece together a 5.1 setup and starting with the 2 fronts.
I listen to mostly classical, hip hop/r&b, and music with good vocals (Adele etc.) I like my music to feel lively. I will add a sub-woofer in soon after.

My room is about 14x11 and speakers will be powered by Onkyo TX-NR509 (Only paid $180 new!!)

I've narrowed it down to:
Cambridge Audio S30: $219
PSB Image B4: $300
Energy RC-10: $300 --Only available in black which looks quite ugly in pictures.

Any recommendations based on experience with these? I don't have any stores that carry these around so I can't demo them.

Strongly leaning towards the Cambridge S30 just because it is cheaper and the center that goes with it is only $200. So I would like to keep future costs as a factor too. If I go the other routes, the centers would be about $300 and thus boosting my costs even more.

Since my room is small, would I really need that expensive of a center anyway? I will be sitting only about 5 feet away from the speakers.

 

[bikemig]

Do you need you even need a center particularly since you have a small room and will be sitting close to the speakers? I have a 2.1 set up and I'm really happy with the dialogue without a center. Why not go for the best speakers in your budget which are the PSB Image B-4 and focus on setting them up right. You will not be disappointed by them.

 

[MisterK]

Do you need you even need a center particularly since you have a small room and will be sitting close to the speakers? I have a 2.1 set up and I'm really happy with the dialogue without a center. Why not go for the best speakers in your budget which are the PSB Image B-4 and focus on setting them up right. You will not be disappointed by them.

Good point. Would you skip the center and buy the surrounds before the center then? Can you describe briefly how the B4 sound?

Anyway, I just listened to the B&W 686 and the bass was so clean and tight. Too bad they were almost $500!

 

[bikemig]

This was my first HT set-up. I listened to all the floorstanding speakers that were sold locally that ran around $1k and liked the PSB Image T-6 the best. They are more expensive than the B-4 bookshelf speakers but it is the same line. They are dead neutral and sound great with every type of music I throw at them. The dialogue is always crystal clear. I don't use my sub for music but I do with movies. If you google around, I'm pretty sure you'll find that they get better reviews than the other speakers you mentioned. I like my 2.1 set-up a log and have no plans to go with surround. The point is that on a limited budget, I'd get the best pair of L and R speakers I could afford and add other speakers later. You may find that a 2.1 set-up works great for you and you won't even want the center or the surrounds.

 

[alphaiii]

I own both the RC-10 and Image B4.... and demo'd the S30 for roughly a month... I think the RC-10 give you the most performance for your money at $300... but the S30 are a really good value at $219.

I like the B4's... and I use them for desktop speakers... but I don't think they give as much for the dollar as the other two. On the other hand... you don't have a large room, and you'd be sitting pretty close, so the B4 could work great in your situation.

As far as the center... it's a matter of preference. Since you'll be sitting pretty close, and I assume center, you can probably get a very nice phantom center image from any of the three. Personally, I've never been happy with phantom center.... but I've also never been so close to the speakers (excluding my desktop speakers.)

 

[zieglj01]

I've narrowed it down to:
Cambridge Audio S30: $219
PSB Image B4: $300
Energy RC-10: $300 --Only available in black which looks quite ugly in pictures.
Any recommendations based on experience with these? I don't have any stores that carry these around so I can't demo them.[/B]

Since my room is small, would I really need that expensive of a center anyway?[/B] I will be sitting only about 5 feet away from the speakers.

You have a vote for PSB and Energy.

So now one for Cambridge S30 - I have owned PSB Image speakers
with the 5" and 6" woofers, I prefer the S30 over both - It is one of
the most cohesive and musical sounding speakers, that I have owned.
They also get loud in a 12X20 room, and do a good job with voices.
From $500 down, they are my favorite. They are also good with movies.

I can not speak for the Energy speaker - I did own the C-1 speaker,
and was not a big fan. I hope that the RC-10 is better than the C-1

All I can say is, your choice and good luck!

 

[LAB3]

You may find that a 2.1 set-up works great for you and you won't even want the center or the surrounds.

I said the same thing.... until I watched one of my Bluray movies on a

friends 5.2 system. Trust me some of the HD Bluray movies movies have Great surround sound. You really are misssing some of the Special Effects by Not having a center and rears. That being said if you know this and still Happy you saved some money.

 

[jonnythan]

I said the same thing.... until I watched one of my Bluray movies on a

friends 5.2 system. Trust me some of the HD Bluray movies movies have Great surround sound. You really are misssing some of the Special Effects by Not having a center and rears. That being said if you know this and still Happy you saved some money.

I agree, but modern receivers are also very good at creating a phantom center and remixing that center channel info into the front mains.

 

[MisterK]

You have a vote for PSB and Energy.

So now one for Cambridge S30 - I have owned PSB Image speakers
with the 5" and 6" woofers, I prefer the S30 over both - It is one of
the most cohesive and musical sounding speakers, that I have owned.
They also get loud in a 12X20 room, and do a good job with voices.
From $500 down, they are my favorite. They are also good with movies.

I can not speak for the Energy speaker - I did own the C-1 speaker,
and was not a big fan. I hope that the RC-10 is better than the C-1

All I can say is, your choice and good luck!

Boy you guys sure make it hard. I wish I could listen to all the speakers side by side. I have noticed

Can you characterize the bass for me with the S30? Reason is, I believe my ears really appreciate clean and tight bass. But, if I use a sub and properly crossover (I'm assuming 80hz), would bass from a speaker in a room this small matter?

A sales rep at Best Buy told me that since my room is small, I just need to worry about detail and clarity from a bookshelf (assuming the speakers I choose go below 80hz). If I have that covered, then the subwoofer can take care of the rest. Truth or mumbo jumbo?

 

[MisterK]

I said the same thing.... until I watched one of my Bluray movies on a

friends 5.2 system. Trust me some of the HD Bluray movies movies have Great surround sound. You really are misssing some of the Special Effects by Not having a center and rears. That being said if you know this and still Happy you saved some money.

I thought the same thing. I can probably survive for awhile with no center since my room is small, but eventually I want to acquire 5.1 because I plan on keeping these speakers for awhile. Besides, I plan on using it for both music and movies equally.

 

[3db]

Boy you guys sure make it hard. I wish I could listen to all the speakers side by side. I have noticed

Can you characterize the bass for me with the S30? Reason is, I believe my ears really appreciate clean and tight bass. But, if I use a sub and properly crossover (I'm assuming 80hz), would bass from a speaker in a room this small matter?

A sales rep at Best Buy told me that since my room is small, I just need to worry about detail and clarity from a bookshelf (assuming the speakers I choose go below 80hz). If I have that covered, then the subwoofer can take care of the rest. Truth or mumbo jumbo?

PSB Image series can really image very well. The center channel is the last speaker I would purchase. I would get the surrounds and the sub and then teh center channel.

I'm a PSB fan boy and I'm not ashamed to admit. The Image series image extremely well, are very dynamic and tonaly accurate. I really enjoy this line and I have a HT suite built around them.

That being said, hearing is subjective...no two people hear exactly the same thing. What one person likes may not be liked by another.

What I would do is to take a pad of paper with you, write down the make and
model of each speaker you audition and what you liked and disliked about the
speakers you were auditioning. Was the bass tight and deep or was it boomy
and loose sounding? Were the mids life like or were they hollow or just too
pronounced? Was the treble irritating and harsh or were they dark and not
revealing or were they smooththat made you want to listen for more? How was
the imaging?

Bring music with you that you are very familiar with and know quite well. To
make it easier to audition HT speaker systems, listen to the main speakers in 2
channel mode with music. Music is much harder to reproduce accurately then a
movie soundtrack so if the speakers do well with music, then they will do well
with HT. Speakers that do HT well may not do well with music. When auditioning
the center channel of the same brand and series as the main speakers, pick a
difficult source like an announcer that mumbles alot. If you can understand what
the mumbling announcer is saying, then you have a good center channel.

I would go to speciality stores first and start auditioning speakers first
instead of going to the internet first. Once your likes are determined, you can
mention them here and fellow members can make internet brand recommendations
based on your likes/dislikes. The specality stores are better setup acousticaly
then the big box stores which will make auditioning a little easier. It will
give you an idea of what you like in a speaker.

Keep track of what amp or receiver is powering the speakers you're auditioning.
Try to get a receiver/amp that closest resembles what you have or want to get.
It just reduces another variable when audtioning speakers.


One thing to keep note off. When auditioning speakers, make sure the volume
levels are matched between the diiferent speaker pairs because the louder
speaker pair will always sound better. Listen to levels that you think you
would listen to most of the time because thats how you are going to be using
them most of the time.

 

[zieglj01]

Can you characterize the bass for me with the S30? Reason is, I believe my ears really appreciate clean and tight bass. But, if I use a sub and properly crossover (I'm assuming 80hz), would bass from a speaker in a room this small matter?

A sales rep at Best Buy told me that since my room is small, I just need to worry about detail and clarity from a bookshelf (assuming the speakers I choose go below 80hz). If I have that covered, then the subwoofer can take care of the rest. Truth or mumbo jumbo?

There is no artificial bass boom with the Cambridge, and it does not
have a one note sound, it is tight and clean. You can cross it over at
80 hz - However, it sounds better at least 8 inches from the back wall.
Cambridge reccomends at least 3 inches. They do throw a nice sound
stage, and the imaging is good. They also, give you a nice central image.
They also, do real good with all types of movies.

 

[MisterK]

PSB Image series can really image very well. The center channel is the last speaker I would purchase. I would get the surrounds and the sub and then teh center channel.

I'm a PSB fan boy and I'm not ashamed to admit. The Image series image extremely well, are very dynamic and tonaly accurate. I really enjoy this line and I have a HT suite built around them.

That being said, hearing is subjective...no two people hear exactly the same thing. What one person likes may not be liked by another.

What I would do is to take a pad of paper with you, write down the make and
model of each speaker you audition and what you liked and disliked about the
speakers you were auditioning. Was the bass tight and deep or was it boomy
and loose sounding? Were the mids life like or were they hollow or just too
pronounced? Was the treble irritating and harsh or were they dark and not
revealing or were they smooththat made you want to listen for more? How was
the imaging?

Bring music with you that you are very familiar with and know quite well. To
make it easier to audition HT speaker systems, listen to the main speakers in 2
channel mode with music. Music is much harder to reproduce accurately then a
movie soundtrack so if the speakers do well with music, then they will do well
with HT. Speakers that do HT well may not do well with music. When auditioning
the center channel of the same brand and series as the main speakers, pick a
difficult source like an announcer that mumbles alot. If you can understand what
the mumbling announcer is saying, then you have a good center channel.

I would go to speciality stores first and start auditioning speakers first
instead of going to the internet first. Once your likes are determined, you can
mention them here and fellow members can make internet brand recommendations
based on your likes/dislikes. The specality stores are better setup acousticaly
then the big box stores which will make auditioning a little easier. It will
give you an idea of what you like in a speaker.

Keep track of what amp or receiver is powering the speakers you're auditioning.
Try to get a receiver/amp that closest resembles what you have or want to get.
It just reduces another variable when audtioning speakers.


One thing to keep note off. When auditioning speakers, make sure the volume
levels are matched between the diiferent speaker pairs because the louder
speaker pair will always sound better. Listen to levels that you think you
would listen to most of the time because thats how you are going to be using
them most of the time.

I really wish I could audition them!! There are no stores around Houston that has these speakers. The 1 store that has PSB are about a 2 hour drive for me.

I picked the above speakers based on review and popularity from my searches. I guess I'll just have to roll the dice and pick one from the list. I've already narrowed it down this far, so this is good enough.

Any input on how these different speakers sound is appreciated!!

 

[alphaiii]

Since you can't audition the speakers locally... and if you are willing to lose a little in return shipping... then I'd recommend narrowing your choice down to two, ordering both pairs, and comparing them both in your home.

Any of the 3 can be bought from an authorized dealer with free shipping and a return policy... You'll be out return shipping on one pair.

Are far as sound differences... I'd say the S30 is a little forward in the upper mids and highs, whereas the RC-10 is a little rich in the upper bass and lower mids... The sound is different, but no one can tell you which you'll like better. To me, the S30 is a little tighter in the bass, but I think the RC-10's upper mids and highs are smoother.

The B4 is closer in tonal balance to the RC-10 (minus the bass) than the S30. I'd say it's a hair laid back in the mids... but fairly close to neutral. I also don't think it's quite as smooth or detailed in the highs as the RC-10. Obviously, you'll get the least bass of the 3 from the B4, and it's not quite as tight/articulate as the S30. I'd say the B4 would be more comfortable at a 100Hz xover too, where the S30 and RC-10 are good at 80Hz. The main thing you gain with the B4 is the small footprint.

They're all nice speakers. I prefer the RC-10 over the S30 and B4... zieglj01 really likes the S30. No way to know what your preference would be unless you listen to them.

Since zieglj01 alluded to placement considerations with the S30... I'll ask... Where do you plan to place the speakers?

 

[MisterK]

Since zieglj01 alluded to placement considerations with the S30... I'll ask... Where do you plan to place the speakers?

I'm placing these speakers on a dresser, with the top being of the dresser made out of glass. My bed is just 4-5 feet away and that's the spot where I watch movies and listen to music. So my positioning in bed would be exactly center with the speakers. With music though, sometimes I sit directly off to the side, so I'll be way off from the sweet spot.

Thanks for the advice and insight. I've narrowed it down to the RC-10 and Cambridge S30. I like my music lively so it pumps me up, but I like to relax too and appreciate classical music. From what you describe and what I've read, I think I might like the S30 more! We'll see, I'm ordering RC-10 and S30 tomorrow.

 

[njedpx3]

A vote for the Cambridge S-30

I mounted a pair at my cabin on sanus Stands and the sound is excellent. They are extremely well built and with the porting get suprisingly good bass. The setup is pure stereo being driven by a vintage Marantz 1060 amp

Here is a picture:



Notice how the wires are almost hidden running along the front base of the fireplace mantle on the tile floor.

Peace and Good Sound!

Forest Man

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

All those speakers mentioned are excellent.

I just wanted to mention another speaker I bought recently.

A couple of weeks ago, I bought an Infinity P163 bookshelf for only $80 on Amazon (using as a center speaker w/ P362).

They were $85 each on Amazon, Crutchfied, Harmon Direct, etc. until last week. Now they are around $140 everywhere.

http://www.soundstagenetwork.com/measurements/speakers/infinity_primus_p162/

You might consider waiting to see if they will go back on sale for $85 each. Getting 5 of them would be $425.

 

[MisterK]

All those speakers mentioned are excellent.

I just wanted to mention another speaker I bought recently.

A couple of weeks ago, I bought an Infinity P163 bookshelf for only $80 on Amazon (using as a center speaker w/ P362).

I considered those too as they have been highly recommended. If it goes on sale again I'll take a look, but I'm going to make a decision today because I'm tired of looking at speakers (its taken up too much time in the past 3 days). I must buy and get away from this addiction before I become fully hooked!

 

[MisterK]

Peace and Good Sound!

Forest Man

Looks like awesome. I wish I had room for speaker stands. I have more than enough room for them to breathe in the back and I can sit them on the edge of the dresser. I can't wait to try these out.

 

[MisterK]

I was thinking, if I end up keeping the Energy RC-10, that LCR is going to cost an arm and a leg! And it looks huge (probably normal sized for speakers at this level, but I'm used to the centers in HTIB)

The cost could add up quick:
Energy RC-10: $300
Energy LCR: $300
Energy RC Mini Surrounds: $150
Emotiva 10": $400 (out of stock, I keep seeing it for $300 on this forum. Price hike?)

Total: $1150

Not bad, but I was thinking I could find a RC mini CC in place of the LCR. Since I will be sitting just a few feet away (maybe about 4-8 max) I thought I could get away with this. Opinions?