1080i/1080p? plasma/LCD?

[1tribeca]

Been looking at a new TV (the 'ol Electrohome 29" CRT is a little long in the tooth!)

Can you give me the skinny on whether to...

1) choose plasma or LCD
2) to bother getting a set that is 1080p (1920 x 1080)

I understand that for plasma the best choice could be Pioneer, and for LCD Sony (both make their own panels I think?)

I'm not a gamer...at all! I enjoy movies the most. I'm looking at around 50" (maybe LCD ain't possible?)

Thanks mates!!

 

[MDS]

Each of the competing HD technologies has advantages and disadvantages. I believe LCD (flat panel) will be the overall winner in the long-term.

Re: plasma vs lcd:
- Plasma is much cheaper than LCD in sizes greater than 42"
- Plasma has the potential for burn-in whereas LCD is immune to burn-in.
- Plasma may have slightly better black levels than LCD.

Plasma is less susceptible to burn-in than it used to be and LCD black levels get better with each generation - things are constantly changing.

1080p:
- 1080p is useful if you buy a large size TV and will sit really close to it; otherwise you won't notice the difference between 1080p and 720p or 1080i.
-1080p is useful if you think you will ever use a high-def dvd player that outputs 1080i or 1080p.

When evaluating a TV, you need to distinguish between '1080p capbable' and '1080p native resolution'. A set that is capable of 1080p simply means that it can accept a signal with a 1080p resolution - it does not mean that the resolution of the set itself is 1080p (1920 x 1080).

 

[jonnythan]

1080p isn't worth worrying about right now IMO. It's nice if you sit really close to a 1080p source (HD DVD or Blu-Ray are it) or are projecting a 1080p source onto a very large screen. Otherwise, all your content is going to be 720p for many many years anyway. It's not bad, but if two TVs are identical, don't pay extra for 1080p.

There are some very good plasma and LCD TVs in the 50" range right now. You can get a good one for less than $2000, especially with Super Bowl sales coming up. My advice is just to go to stores and look at the TVs in your price range and see what you like. It's not really rocket science. Look for black levels, false contouring, "clay face," and noise. Don't be afraid to adjust the color and brightness/contrast of the sets in the store, as they are often set way too bright and oversaturated.

I personally like the look of a plasma TV more. They look closer to CRTs than LCDs do. LCDs have the advantage of using less power and having less reflective screens, though.

 

[1tribeca]

How 'bout that!

So glad I joined this community!! Excellent points. My viewing distance will be approx. 10-12 feet. Not sure what "clay face" is?

With all the controversy over HD DVD, Blu-ray, 1080i, 1080p, HDTV etc. I'm scared to but anything just yet in fear it'll be half the price in a year!!! Especially LCD/plasmas? Is that a valid fear?

Thanks again for the tips, and volunteering your time!

John

 

[jonnythan]

Clay face is a problem some LCDs have where colors do not blend naturally and you get skin tones that look more like clay than skin.

Broadcasts are 1080i and 720p. They will not be broadcasting in 1080p anytime in the near future. You will only get 1080p from HD DVD/Blu-Ray and some game consoles. Besides, at 10-12' from a 50" screen, you will *not* see a difference between 1080 and 720p. Don't sweat it.

In 5 years you'll be getting a new TV anyway. Get 1080p then.

BTW, as for price, prices always go down. I bought my 50" plasma a year ago for $2400 and right now comparable sets are dipping to about $1800. They're not going to get that much below that for a quality set. If you keep waiting you'll have to keep going without a big TV! Prices this time of year (right before the Super Bowl) are about as good as they're ever going to get. They might be a couple hundred bucks cheaper next year, but with prices this low it won't be by much.. and you will have waited an entire year!

 

[The Dukester]

Flat screen tvs are like the computers of a few years ago in that it seems like every other week they get better and less expensive. If you keep playing the waiting game, though, you'll never buy anything. There will always be something coming out that's better and/or less expensive.

Most all the above is good advice, I think. Prices will come down in the next few weeks on many of the sets. If you like the LCDs, I was told that Sony will be offering a deal in a week or two. Some plasmas have already come down since CES. You will have to go look at the tvs and decide for yourself which you like the best. Beware, though that most places have their displays in "torch" mode to make them look good.

I personally like the plasmas better, but again, it's subjective. If you have a lot of windows and view a lot during the daytime, then you may want to look at LCD b/c of the less reflective screen. If you view mostly at night or have a fair amount of light control, then it's' a mute point.

As for 1080 vs 720, that depends on many things. If you don't plan on upgrading within (IMO) a very few years, then I would somewhat future proof yourself and buy a 1080p unit as you will benefit if you buy a high def DVD player. You will notice a difference in 1080p if you buy a 50" or larger screen with your viewing distance IMO, also.

"Clay" faces refers to the fact that some displays (usually plasma in my observations) will not have natural looking flesh tones, especially in the face. They have a "clay" look. Think Silly Putty. Black levels are generally better on the plasmas as well. The new Sony XBR3 and best model (can't remember the model #) Sharps have much improved black levels.

Also note that the refresh rates are better on plasmas, so if you watch a lot of fast moving sports, they generally look better. LCDs tend to have more motion blurring. It's much better than before, but still not usually as good as plasma.

Lastly, if you are reasonably careful with your plasma, burn in is not really an issue.

Best of luck in your new purchase and welcome to the forum

 

[MDS]

All good points from the Dukester. See what I mean? Trade-offs from one technology to the other.

I've been playing the waiting game too but am about sick of it. LCD prices decreased 20% last year and are predicted to decline another 20% by the end of this year. You have to pick a point at which you are comfortable and just go with it otherwise you will wait forever.

My self-imposed limit is $3K for a 50-ish inch TV. The Sharp Aquos 52" LCD was $4K at the end of last year but is now $3,500. I pray that it will drop to $3K in the next few months, but even if it doesn't I'm just going to pull the trigger and get one.

LCD rear projection is getting better and cheaper too. I was originally inclined to go that way, but if you figure in the cost of replacement bulbs over the life of the set paying more upfront for an LCD flat panel that doesn't require bulb replacement seems reasonable. Plasma is the best bang for the buck in terms of cost, but there is something about LCD flat panel that appeals to me more.

 

[Herr D]

I haven't seen an LCD yet that matched the PQ of a Pioneer Plasma, no matter what the technology of the future will be, right now I would advise everyone to go for plasma, unless you're very worried about energy consumption, in which case my advice would be to buy a fireplace.

 

[1tribeca]

The biggest shock here is the prices you lucky American folk pay for a TV!! Prices here (Canada) can be a bit nuts. The Pioneer plasma 50" (the model right below their top end) is $4500 here...less Stateside I'd imagine.

I guess you can wait forever if you don't jump on one of the technologies.

I was having this discussion with my bro' (who lives in Japan) about technology levelling off to a point where it's reasonably safe to jump in. We both agreed that gadgets such as digital cameras, are at a point where we don't need any serious advancements in technology to buy...6-10 megapixels is more than adequate for the average consumer AND now at an affordable price.

A good home PC is attainable for $1000 - $2000 and has enough speed, memory, storage, features etc for the average consumer AND at an affordable price.

Any increases in size, speed etc for either of the aforementioned is pretty much icing on an already calorie dense cake! I'd by either one of those products tomorrow if I needed one.

I just don't think TVs have reached that point yet. Maybe it'll be soon, but I don't think we're quite there. My brother says the TVs in Japan that are common in every household, are atleast 3 years ahead of what we see here. Regardless, I think I have a better understanding thanks to you guys/gals than I did before. I'll most likely buy in the next 6 months.

Wonder if the Superbowl has an effect on pricing up here in the "Great Not-So-White North"???

John

 

[wisemaj]

1tribeca:

I too am a newbie here, and recently struggled with the same questions. I have made my decisions, and my purchases, and wanted to share my thoughts.

First, since I winter in Florida, I wanted something I could easily take with me, so a front projector was the obvious choice. I selected the Panasonic AX-100U, using LCD technology at 720p native, for 3 primary reasons:
1. The glowing reviews
2. The brightness (2000 lumens) for a non-dedicated theater room, and
3. The price point ($1699 after rebate with 40 Blockbuster movies and 1 year extended GE warranty)

I also selected the OPPO 981, again at 720p native, primarily because ot the outstanding reviews and the price point ($229).

So that's how I wound up with LCD. Now for the resolution issue. I really would like to have gone with 1080p to future-protect myself. However, I think I'm better off putting that off for 2 or 3 years for the following reasons:
1. As already mentioned in this thread, 1080p TV signals won't be available for many years.
2. The high-def DVD format war between BlueRay and HD-DVD has not yet been decided. By choosing now, you could be selecting the next BetaMax.
3. Current high-def DVD players are very expensive, and some of the lower priced ones get mixed reviews.
4. Current 1080p projectors are very expensive. The 1080p version of the Panny I bought is around $4K. I don't know if this is as big an issue for TV's.

By waiting a few years to get into 1080p, I won't have spent all that extra money in the meantime when I wouldn't really be able to take full advantage of it. And when I upgrade, prices will have come down enough that I'll probable spend no more total (for both setups) than I would have now, and I'll wind up with 2-3 year more advanced technology.

Hope that helps, and good luck with your purchase.

 

[rr2465]

I was sold on plasma...

My wife and I were sold (almost!) on getting a Panasonic 42 inch plasma. We ended up going with a 40 inch Sony LCD primarily because of the glare in our family room. Having had the set for the entire football season I can tell you that there are no noticeable motion artifacts. The TV looks great. We watch a lot of sports and we're pretty picky. I still think that the Panny Plasma looks great but we're happy with our Sony LCD.

Happy shopping!