Emotiva UMC-200 Preamp / Processor Review

[gene]

I have the Emotiva stereo preamp USP-1 which I really like and it allows for bass management with subwoofer for stereo sources. Plus it fits right in with my reciever with the HT bypass mode. But if the UMC-200 has such a good preamp section, maybe I wouldn't need a separate preamp. Does this UMC-200 allow for bass management in pure direct/stereo mode? That's my favorite thing about the USP-1, be able to manage a subwoofer with stereo sources. Unfortunately my mains can't go down to 20HZ... but whose surprised?
-Thanks

No the analog bypass is basically a straight thru connection with a very well implemented analog preamp stage.

 

[mdanderson]

Gene,
Thanks for such a detailed and thorough review of the UMC-200. After reading your input regarding the preamp section of the UMC-200 and your Oppo 105, it really makes me want to get the 105. I currently have the Oppo 93 and my UMC-200 is on order since I sold my UMC-1. The Oppo 93 is a really great player, but I have been thinking about how a player like the 105 would compare with it's excellent Sabre32 dacs and analog section. Thanks again for the review.

 

[gene]

Gene,
Thanks for such a detailed and thorough review of the UMC-200. After reading your input regarding the preamp section of the UMC-200 and your Oppo 105, it really makes me want to get the 105. I currently have the Oppo 93 and my UMC-200 is on order since I sold my UMC-1. The Oppo 93 is a really great player, but I have been thinking about how a player like the 105 would compare with it's excellent Sabre32 dacs and analog section. Thanks again for the review.

The 105 has an exceptionally good analog output, especially via balanced. It's literally an audiophile dream player. It's a big investment though, especially since you've already got a 93.

 

[srrndhound]

I made a few updates to the review based on the feedback I saw at the Emotiva forum.

Thank you, Gene, for quickly revising the review. I would make some clarifications to my post at Emotiva, too, except ole' Dan locked the thread! I will make them here and address your post as well, if I may.

I informed Emotiva about my findings and they are working on a firmware update to disable the option of combining LFE signal back into the main channels with the "enhanced bass" feature turned on.

Wow. I am sort of surprised that they are planning to change the Enhanced Bass mode, since it operated exactly as the UMC-200 manual described: "allows you to route the LFE signal to ALL speakers that are set to large," just as your tests confirmed. Nevertheless, I do think it is better to change it to act like "LFE+Main" as that is much safer for the main speakers, and fully achieves the desired result: allow the sub to supplement full range mains.

I don't think anyone can say for certain what will ALWAYS be in the LFE channel. I put in a call to Dolby to see if I could get some clarity on this issue.

I was trying to make the point that the notch you found will not be an issue under normal circumstances. By saying it will never be an issue I was overstating the case for dramatic effect. Technically, yes, you are correct, there are undoubtedly some unfortunate mixes out there where the LFE was derived directly from the main channels. I say unfortunate because when such signals encounter the consumer's bass management, the compounded phase shifts will degrade the subwoofer signal (like with notches!). Anyway, with the impending redesign of Enhanced Bass mode, the issue will be totally moot.

I've personally found that LFE channel must also contain audio from the other channels since when I tried to run the Status 8T as large and a dedicated sub channel, they 8Ts weren't getting much bass at ALL for multi-channel sources. Disabling my bass management so that LFE routes to the main channels made a huge difference, especially on music Blu-rays.

I'm a little confused by the highlighted part, but I think I get the jist.

Yes, since the loudest bass in a 5.1 program is typically in the LFE channel, you will hear more bass when the LFE signal is used, whether it is heard from the mains or the sub. If your main speakers handle LFE better than the subwoofer (assuming one is available), then by all means, use the mains. I think this is an exceedingly rare condition for most home theaters, particularly if the sub (or subs) are well situated and tuned. In that case, the best overall results will happen with standard bass management.

 

[agarwalro]

I've personally found that LFE channel must also contain audio from the other channels since when I tried to run the Status 8T as large and a dedicated sub channel, they 8Ts weren't getting much bass at ALL for multi-channel sources. Disabling my bass management so that LFE routes to the main channels made a huge difference, especially on music Blu-rays.

Thats odd, if the LR tracks had info down to 20Hz, set to large, no reason why the processor did not route it as expected.

The best way I've found to combine LFE + main bass to both subwoofers and your main speakers is to bypass the subwoofer channel all together by setting the sub to "no" and the mains to "large" and then connecting your powered subs to the L/R main channel outputs. You lose subwoofer control and delay but EQing the subs can be a good workaround. This worked great in my setup.

This will only work for folks who's main speakers actually play low down to 20Hz at 100dB at the listening position. Most full range speakers barely make it to f20 of 25Hz. So, one risks damaging their mains. Then, there is tremendous power demand on the amp. So, one risks clipping the signal and risking the mains. Last but not the least, this will not work for folks whos subs are signigicantly further away than the mains. The approach may introduce timing issues that exacerbate the poor bass at listnening position.

A bit of shortsighted and reckless advise, don't you think?

 

[mdanderson]

The 105 has an exceptionally good analog output, especially via balanced. It's literally an audiophile dream player. It's a big investment though, especially since you've already got a 93.

Thanks Gene for the additional information. You mentioned that you really like the results from the xlr balanced outs from the oppo 105 but since the UMC-200 has no balanced inputs, did you connect the 105 directly to your amp or to a separate preamp? Thanks.

 

[gene]

Thats odd, if the LR tracks had info down to 20Hz, set to large, no reason why the processor did not route it as expected.

This will only work for folks who's main speakers actually play low down to 20Hz at 100dB at the listening position. Most full range speakers barely make it to f20 of 25Hz. So, one risks damaging their mains. Then, there is tremendous power demand on the amp. So, one risks clipping the signal and risking the mains. Last but not the least, this will not work for folks whos subs are signigicantly further away than the mains. The approach may introduce timing issues that exacerbate the poor bass at listnening position.

A bit of shortsighted and reckless advise, don't you think?

The processor did route fullrange signal to the front left/right channels but the LFE channel contained much of the same bass at greater amplitude. By not having all 4 subs playing the same signal, this was noticed as very weak bass for 5.1 HD music sources.

No I don't recommend routing LFE to the main channels for 99% of installs for the very reasons you stated. In my case my speakers and amps are capable and ideal for this configuration. This was the only way I could configure them and my external powered subs to properly play together for all sources.

There are no timing issues if you know what your doing. All of this is in my review of the Status 8T system.

It's reckless to make assumptions on what I recommend

 

[j_garcia]

I'm still having issues with the PS3 and the UMC-200. It seems like a handshake issue since it is both video and audio, but the odd thing is that it is different depending on what I am doing. For games, and sometimes even if it is just sitting on the main screen doing nothing, I get the video "glitches" for a second. These may be an actual flicker or just some minor static. With Netflix, the video is fine but the audio will randomly drop for a second, but not all the time. This ONLY happens with the PS3, whether set to PCM or Bistream. My Oppo and Roku XD do not do this. I found last night that if I have the UMC on and then turn on the PS3, it seems to help, which would seem to support handshake issue. I've sent an email to Emotiva to see if they can offer any advice.

Another minor thing that I believe is the sub not the UMC is that the sub sometimes does not want to trigger on. I noticed this last night also, I was listening to some music and it was clear the sub wasn't on. I turned it up and the sub clicked on (connected via XLR), so it may be that I'll have to lower the sub's level and recalibrate so I get a higher voltage from the UMC? I didn't have this problem previously with it connected via unbalanced with it set to the same level. Would I be looking at a similar voltage output for the sub via balanced? I may need to ask Emotiva this one as well.

 

[ZrC]

I'm still having issues with the PS3 and the UMC-200. It seems like a handshake issue since it is both video and audio, but the odd thing is that it is different depending on what I am doing. For games, and sometimes even if it is just sitting on the main screen doing nothing, I get the video "glitches" for a second. These may be an actual flicker or just some minor static. With Netflix, the video is fine but the audio will randomly drop for a second, but not all the time. This ONLY happens with the PS3, whether set to PCM or Bistream. My Oppo and Roku XD do not do this. I found last night that if I have the UMC on and then turn on the PS3, it seems to help, which would seem to support handshake issue. I've sent an email to Emotiva to see if they can offer any advice.

Another minor thing that I believe is the sub not the UMC is that the sub sometimes does not want to trigger on. I noticed this last night also, I was listening to some music and it was clear the sub wasn't on. I turned it up and the sub clicked on (connected via XLR), so it may be that I'll have to lower the sub's level and recalibrate so I get a higher voltage from the UMC? I didn't have this problem previously with it connected via unbalanced with it set to the same level. Would I be looking at a similar voltage output for the sub via balanced? I may need to ask Emotiva this one as well.

I seen this happen a few times, everyone solved it by using a longer HDMI cable. It seems it can be picky with cables shorter than 6' due to impedance matching.

 

[j_garcia]

I seen this happen a few times, everyone solved it by using a longer HDMI cable. It seems it can be picky with cables shorter than 6' due to impedance matching.

Interesting, but I doubt length is the problem. I do use a short HDMI for the PS3, but I use an even shorter one for the Roku and I used the Roku for a while last night and it had no issues. I will swap cable from the Oppo and see if it changes anything. I am also definitely NOT using a cable over 6ft for a run that is less than 1ft.

 

[j_garcia]

They didn't respond yet, but I played with the settings last night and got the audio drops with the PS3 to stop by changing one of the BD settings. For whatever reason, turning DRC off seems to have stopped the audio drops 100% so far. Unfortunately, the video drops are still there a little bit, but I am guessing there is a setting in there somewhere that will hopefully fix that too.

 

[j_garcia]

Emotiva got back to me yesterday and recommended turning DeepColor off on the PS3. The default is set to "Auto" but they said this is a function that is essentially not used at this point. The PS3 will still attempt to use it or check for it with it set to On or Auto, so turning it off will prevent that. So far, it seems to have fixed the video glitch issue.

 

[Bryceo]

20 amp out let I think that could be wrong as in Australia all our outlets are 240 volt 30 amp ac

 

[Nomo]

Mine is on order. Shipping date Jan 30th.


On a related note: Any one looking for a third party intervention; Don't count on Brian or Doug.

 

[sfdoddsy]

I'm having an issue with my UMC-200 and am unsure whether it is a 'feature' or if I am just stupid.

I'm unable to set different presents for the different inputs. In other words, if the unit sees a PCM source I can't make the TV input play DPL2 and the CD input play Stereo automatically. It will set the same preset for all PCM sources.

Are you finding this too, and if not what did you do?

 

[j_garcia]

I'm having an issue with my UMC-200 and am unsure whether it is a 'feature' or if I am just stupid.

I'm unable to set different presents for the different inputs. In other words, if the unit sees a PCM source I can't make the TV input play DPL2 and the CD input play Stereo automatically. It will set the same preset for all PCM sources.

Are you finding this too, and if not what did you do?

Yes, I have the same issue and contacted them about it. They confirmed that as a known issue and they will be releasing an update to address it very soon.

 

[mdanderson]

I am very pleased with my UMC-200. Music sounds much better than I expected. SACD and DVDaudio discs as well as 2channel music sound fantastic, especially when using the analog inputs and my Oppo 93. Movies sound great as well and I have my Oppo connected directly to my tv rather than through the UMC-200. Music from the server on my desktop sent to the Oppo and then through the UMC sounds very nice with plenty of bass.

 

[DaleAV]

I think there may be some issue with regards to EmoQ G2. Even though the manual recommends against performing additional runs unless you made physical changes, a 2nd result gave me markedly different results.

1. The new crossovers settings were now 250Hz for the front channels, but 60 and 90Hz respectively for Center and Rear Surrounds, previously all channels were 250Hz. ( reset all to 80Hz post cal).

2. There were no speakers noted as being out of phase, where previously ALL were said to be out of phase.

I changed nothing with respect to connections, speaker locations, etc.

Another curiosity I happened upon was adjusting input level. Previously, there seemed to be a problem I can only relate to as a dynamic range issue. I was running a good half way up the volume range for a normal listening level from both my Dish DVR/Receiver and Panasonic BlueRay player.
I reset both input levels (HDMI 1&2) to 7db.

Now 'normal listening' level is only 1/3 up the range, which I think is appropriate and the overall sound is much more balanced dynamically.

Has any mention been made with regards to firmware revision?
I noticed mine is 1.52.02.31 and was curious if this is the only one since the UMC-200 began shipping.
I don't know if this is just a version or an actual software rev. number.

I hope this helps someone, and I am certainly interested in results others have had.

 

[j_garcia]

Can't recall off the top of my head, but that looks like the same version I have on mine; will confirm when I get home from work. I am guessing there have not been any updates since they started shipping, and that would be the firmware version IMO.

I noticed only yesterday that it set my mains to 80Hz, but my center to 175Hz, and thus my sub to 175Hz to match. I noticed with this setup, dialogue on multichannel is difficult to hear because presumably a lot of it is coming from the sub. I didn't compare settings, but running it the second time, it did take a lot longer on the center on mine. Did you place the mic in the exact same spot as before? Tripod? I need to pick up a tripod.

 

[DaleAV]

Yes, I mounted it on a tripod facing up. The hole for the tripod screw on the mic is not a standard camera mount.. it is smaller, very strange.. so I used some tacky putty to hold the mic in place on top of the tripod. With the tripod raised just above my seat back, and mic facing straight up as recommended by Emotiva.

I think I had the same problem as the one you describe where it seems dialogue is being masked. I tried center channel trim which helped some...but after adjusting the input levels to 7 db put the input trim back to '0' now and it sounds much better.