Any new remote news?

[itschris]

I'm still waiting for the perfect remote to come to market...

1) RF - since I have a cabinet and my wife and daughter can't remember to keep the thing pointed in the general direction of the equipment

2) Programmable via the computer - I want to be able to just click, drag, drop, scroll, edit, adjust, an all that through an easy to use computer-based setup.

3) I need it to be smart enough to know that the TV or something else is already on or off or whatever, when selecting a new function say from watching tv to wanting to watch a blu-ray.

4) Cost. I know I can have the perfect remote,.. but $400+ doesn't make it perfect anymore.

5) Looks - The Harmony One is a beautiful remote. It should look as good a my equipment. Be gone with the clunky looking remotes.

Anything new or am I just wishful thinking still.

 

[Nemo128]

Supposedly a Harmony One with RF Extender compatibility is in the works. I'll be replacing my 890 Pro with one if it's true.

 

[Highbar]

Have you checked out the URC Lineup? I know they don't use a computer program to setup but the members here that have them seem to like them. I think that's the way I'm going to go next time.

 

[GlocksRock]

I love my One, but since I don't need RF, it is the perfect remote for me. Hopefully they will add RF, and even bluetooth in the future, then it really would be perfect remote, and more worth it's hefty asking price.

 

[itschris]

Have you checked out the URC Lineup? I know they don't use a computer program to setup but the members here that have them seem to like them. I think that's the way I'm going to go next time.

I have and it's close. I guess I have a hard time dumping so much money into a remote... before I do, I gotta reconcile it in my head. I think for $250 you should be able to get everything a typical system needs.

 

[MDS]

I think for $250 you should be able to get everything a typical system needs.

You can get an MX-350 plus MRF-260 RF basestation for about $250. It's what I use and it works very well for my needs. The MX-350 is NOT programmed on the computer but rather directly on the remote and I prefer it that way.

Knowing the power state of a device is very difficult given that there is no two-way communication. URC has a solution with a controller and various sensors but it is not cheap and is way overkill for most systems.

There are ways to work around most of the problems by eg. always starting from a 'home' state and macro tricks to deal with devices that are toggle only power so IMO at least dealing with the power state of devices in the system is not such a huge problem that it warrants paying big bucks for a solution.

 

[bandphan]

If you want 2 way control URC and R T I are the least costly but not at 400. If you gear has discrete codes you will be ok without rs 232 or ip control, unless you want feed back from something like a music server. The issue with most non Computer based learning remotes is most oem remotes do not have the discrete codes for things like power which is where you will run into issues.

 

[jostenmeat]

My thoughts:

-I know that many, many, many are happy with Harmony. I recently jibber jabbered with someone who "downgraded" from Pronto, and is very pleased.

-Me? I will take URC's bottom of the line over Harmony's top of the line. Or any other for that matter.

-I will never, ever recommend Harmony over URC to any friend or family of mine so long as the implementation is not greatly improved. It's a major pain in my butt.

-I've programmed multiple of each now, including for brother, and a very long tenured brain scientist for whom I had to write out trouble-shooting instructions, regarding his $#%^* Harmony 880.

JMO

 

[itschris]

You can get an MX-350 plus MRF-260 RF basestation for about $250. It's what I use and it works very well for my needs. The MX-350 is NOT programmed on the computer but rather directly on the remote and I prefer it that way.

Knowing the power state of a device is very difficult given that there is no two-way communication. URC has a solution with a controller and various sensors but it is not cheap and is way overkill for most systems.

There are ways to work around most of the problems by eg. always starting from a 'home' state and macro tricks to deal with devices that are toggle only power so IMO at least dealing with the power state of devices in the system is not such a huge problem that it warrants paying big bucks for a solution.

That's the thing I guess i'm concerned about. If i program a macro to WATCH TV, that turns on the cable, turns on the TV, then an hour later my wife wants to watch a movie, will the WATCH BLU-RAY macro toggle the TV even though it's already on? In this example, it has to do both... it has to know to turn the tv on when the entire system is off, and it has to know not hit the TV when it's already on. Do I need seperate WATCH BLU-RAY macros for each scenario?

 

[jostenmeat]

That's the thing I guess i'm concerned about. If i program a macro to WATCH TV, that turns on the cable, turns on the TV, then an hour later my wife wants to watch a movie, will the WATCH BLU-RAY macro toggle the TV even though it's already on? In this example, it has to do both... it has to know to turn the tv on when the entire system is off, and it has to know not hit the TV when it's already on. Do I need seperate WATCH BLU-RAY macros for each scenario?

If I understand correctly, as long as your TV has discrete codes for both on and off you're ok. Most TV's do.

Another nice thing about the way I use the URC is that, say I'm in your shoes, and I know that I will jump back and forth from BD and cable, I can leave anything I want as on. Or off. With Harmony (unless as you noted in programming multiple macros), it will cycle the components on and off each time.

Otherwise, I'm gonna step out, and let bandphan and MDS help you out. They know more about this stuff than I do.

 

[highfigh]

I have and it's close. I guess I have a hard time dumping so much money into a remote... before I do, I gotta reconcile it in my head. I think for $250 you should be able to get everything a typical system needs.

Define "typical system".

$250 won't usually get a remote that does macros, it'll be basic, might be only activity-based and that alone can be a huge PITA. The MX-810 is one of the less expensive URC models but because so many installers and programmers complained that it doesn't program the same way as all of their other models, they came out with the MX-880, which looks the same but uses the MX Editor. If these people had paid attention or gone to training, they would have known that it uses a setup Wizard, but that's another matter.

Personally, I think too much emphasis is placed on the custom graphics. Basic remotes do not need them, IMO. The MX 350/550/650/750/850 are monochrome titles and they work fine but the models in that series use serial communication, which makes them less popular. They work great, though.

Keep in mind that if you buy a URC online, it won't come with a warranty because they don't authorize ANYONE to sell online.

IR and RF work fine with discreets and even if a piece of equipment does toggle ON/OFF, there's usually some kind of work-around. In the case of the Scientific Atlanta 8300HDC, it's a matter of going into Settings, look on the left column for Settings (not along the bottom), Power settings and select On with numeric. Then, add a command in the power on sequence for whatever Power On channel is acceptable. Time Warner uses Ch 0 and 01 for their information, so those don't work. Supposedly, SA receivers will revert to the last channel if a useless channel is selected but I didn't see it happen yesterday when I fixed a power command issue for someone.

BTW- Time Warner and some other providers set their boxes to turn off if they haven't been used for a particular time period and this is why they suck. I wouldn't care if they would enable discreet ON/OFF but they don't, so my opinion stands.

 

[MDS]

That's the thing I guess i'm concerned about. If i program a macro to WATCH TV, that turns on the cable, turns on the TV, then an hour later my wife wants to watch a movie, will the WATCH BLU-RAY macro toggle the TV even though it's already on? In this example, it has to do both... it has to know to turn the tv on when the entire system is off, and it has to know not hit the TV when it's already on. Do I need seperate WATCH BLU-RAY macros for each scenario?

If the TV has discrete on/off codes then no problem...

Otherwise, it's still easy and relates to what I said about a 'home' state; ie you always start from a known configuration. My macros are set up for exactly the situation you describe.

My power on macro turns on the TV, cable box, and receiver and selects the video input on the receiver. This is my 'home' state as I watch cable 99% of the time. If I want to then watch a DVD, I have a macro on the DVD button that turns on the DVD player and selects the DVD input on the receiver but does not turn off the cable box (although it could). To get back to cable is another simple macro on the Cable button which goes back to the initial state but also turns off the DVD player.

Note though that with this approach it is necessary to always go back to the starting state before turning everything off.

 

[highfigh]

That's the thing I guess i'm concerned about. If i program a macro to WATCH TV, that turns on the cable, turns on the TV, then an hour later my wife wants to watch a movie, will the WATCH BLU-RAY macro toggle the TV even though it's already on? In this example, it has to do both... it has to know to turn the tv on when the entire system is off, and it has to know not hit the TV when it's already on. Do I need seperate WATCH BLU-RAY macros for each scenario?

The MX Editor is the easiest way around power ON issues. Basically, you would create the macro and just not use the TV On and input select commands. However, if the TV has discreets, and it probably does, it won't hurt anything if the TV ON and Input Select are sent.

The URC aren't "activity-based", in the way Harmony remotes are but by creating macros, they can be. If you don't want to worry about Power ON being sent and if you use the receiver to change the source inputs, you can set it up so you press Power ON to turn the whole system on (other than anything that really shouldn't be left on like a BluRay or a projector) and then just choose which device you want to control. If you choose Recvr, you'll go to a page with inputs. Certain controls will punch through, like volume, mute, etc but you can map commands to any device. If you want to bypass selecting Recvr, you can just record a macro for DVD, which would include the commands for selecting the input on the receiver, then place volume, mute and any other commands you want on the DVD page. Any commands you don't ever want anyone to access, can be hidden when you have hte MX Editor open. With the non-computer programmed ones, you either need to manually delete the commands or omit learning them.

The computer programmable ones are much more efficient, from the standpoint of making changes and testing the seteup. I avoid the non-computer setup remotes completely.

 

[bandphan]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Universal-Remote-MX-950-Remote-Control-IR-RF_W0QQitemZ180348736805QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item180348736805&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72:1234|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318|301:0|293:1|294:50

note this remote will not work with vista and is not color, however its the one I use and will do anything you want..except 2 way

 

[MatthewB.]

Your post reminded me of a funny story I read once. A man goes to visit his elderly father who is sitting down watching TV with his wife. The son starts telling his dad, that he needs a new expensive universal remote to make things easier on him. The father then turns to his wife and barks out "Honey, Matlocks On" the wife immediatly gets up and changes the channel and sits back down. He turns to his son, smiles and says, "No thanks, nothing wrong with the current one."

 

[itschris]

Thanks a ton for the help guys. I don't think my requirements are out of bounds. I think when you're spending 2, 3, 4 hundred dollars for something like a remote, there's shouldn't be a need for compromise, work arounds, and what not. I realize I'm being a bit of ***** about this, but it just doesn't seem like it should be so hard to do the things I want. I want to press one button and just have it work... period. I shouldn't have to go to training to learn how to program it, and it should just look good.

The current crop out there just doesn't work for me either because of price or other issues. I may break down at some point, but as it stands I don't see anything I'd want to spend even $200 for. I'm not cheap, I just want what I want and it's not out there yet. I'll just be old fashioned and use the individual remotes for now like I have been. Hopefully there will be some new stuff on the horizon that's better suited to what I believe a lot of users are looking for.

 

[bandphan]

also FWIW the 880, msc400 and the 980 does CCP now which helps tremdously

 

[MatthewB.]

I can't in good conscience recommend the 880/890 remotes, I had three 880 remotes and everyone of them had issues with charging. I got replacement chargers from Harmony, new batteries, I tried everything, nothing but problems and according to Harmony they have done nothing further to fix the issue that has plagued so many 880/890 owners. I actually gave away the three 880's to some members on another forum I frequent, cause I was just so frustrated at trying to get them to work. They tried a solder trick and one member took the charger apart to "lift" the prongs, to get it to work, but I feel why the consumer should have to modify his charger just to get it to charge. I went with two 670 remotes in place, because the old style Harmony with batteries you have to replace work much better. Alas they are not RF.

 

[BMXTRIX]

Strangely enough, I'm able to get my of my clients into Crestron for their home theater setups. Granted it isn't cheap cheap - but I pick up a MC2W online and a MX850 to go with it for about $400 then pass the savings on.

Considering a typical 1080p front projection setup may run $10K to $15K installed, the addition of a $1000 (programmed) remote control which does exactly what was requested is something most people happily buy into.

 

[itschris]

Strangely enough, I'm able to get my of my clients into Crestron for their home theater setups. Granted it isn't cheap cheap - but I pick up a MC2W online and a MX850 to go with it for about $400 then pass the savings on.

Considering a typical 1080p front projection setup may run $10K to $15K installed, the addition of a $1000 (programmed) remote control which does exactly what was requested is something most people happily buy into.

I absolutely get what you're saying and I understand the methodology. Just for me, I just have a hard time spending even $300 or $400 on something that just turns my stuff on and off. I know it's more complex and it certainly increases the usability of the system, but it's just hard for me to swalllow. I'll spend on a lot of things, but something about spending that much on a remote just rubs me the wrong way. Foolish... sure, but it's just the way I feel.