320USD 10" driver suggestions please

[mike c]

if someone wants to play just 80-100hz and has 320USD

has about:
360wpc at 8ohms x 2
or
180wpc at 4ohms x 4
or
120wpc at 8ohms x 4
available amp power

there is a size restriction (tiny)

does he get 4 80USD drivers? 2 160USD drivers? 1 320USD driver?

should have an Le of around 1.1 or less ...
should be a 10"er
should be powered by the wattage above

initial suspects:
Dayton RS 10"er HF
JL W1 10"
JL W3 10"

please recommend some more drivers ... thanks in advance

(this is per side [L&R], what you suggest here would be x2 the other set for the other side)

for the frequency range in question, the W3 doesn't seem to give anything over the W1 except for looks ...

so i didn't include it in the sims:

same cost in drivers ...
4 W1's 8ohms 360w yellow
2 W1's 4ohms 360w blue
2 Kappa 10's 360w red (low Q)

what's the difference btw of the low Q to mid Q?

 

[gus6464]

How about any of the AE Lambda TD10 drivers? You can buy them in 4ohm versions as well.

http://www.aespeakers.com/products.php

TD10M - 8ohm
Fs: 40.5Hz
Qms: 2.7
Vas: 59L
Cms: .35mm/N
Mms: 44g
Rms: 4kg/s
Xmax: 6mm
Sd: 345
Qes: .26
Re: 6.6
Le: .2mH
Z: 8ohm
Bl: 17Tm
Pe: 500W
Qts: .23
1W SPL: 93.9dB

TD10H- 8ohm
Fs; 27.6 Hz
Qms: 4.88
Qes: 0.23
Qts: 0.22
Vas: 68 Liters
Cms: 0.4 mm/N
Mms: 83 grams
Sd: 345 cm2
Rms: 3.0 Kg/S
Bl: 20.4 T/m
Re: 6.5 ohms
Z 8ohms
Le 0.3 mH
Pe (max) 500 Watts
Pe (transient) 1000 Watts
1WSpl: 90.1 dB
Linear Xmax: 14 mm (peak)
Mech Xsus: 18 mm (peak)

TD10X- 8ohm
Fs: 35.5 Hz
Qms: 4.22
Qes: 0.29
Qts: 0.27
Vas: 67.5 Liters
Cms: 0.4 mm/N
Mms: 50 grams
Sd: 345 cm2
Rms: 2.7 Kg/S
Bl: 16.7 T/m
Re: 7.2 ohms
Z: 8 ohms
Le: 0.3 mH
Pe (max): 500 Watts
Pe (transient): 1000 Watts
1WSpl 92 dB
Linear Xmax 14 mm (peak)
Mech Xsus 18 mm (peak)

TD10S- 8ohm
Fs: 32.7 Hz
Qms 3.04
Qes 0.39
Qts 0.34
Vas 68 Liters
Cms 0.4 mm/N
Mms 59.4 grams
Sd 345 cm2
Rms 4.0 Kg/S
Bl 13.1 T/m
Re 5.5 ohms
Z 8 ohms
Le 0.3 mH
Pe (max) 500 Watts
Pe (transient) 1000 Watts
1WSpl 90 dB
Linear Xmax 14 mm (peak)
Mech Xsus 18 mm (peak)

 

[mike c]

i like the looks Gus

for the layman : what's the difference in the H, S, T and M series?

a bit expensive though ... i also tried to plot the 15"er on winisd ... the TSP's are nuts!

 

[MidnightSensi]

What's the application? I'm not sure I understand why you just want 80-100Hz. Unless you are going to have extremely high output, why mess with a three way crossover? 10" subwoofers are optimized for lower bass optimization, and pro sound drivers are optimized higher.

How do these map out?

RE Audio SX series 10"
http://www.reaudio.com/specs.html#sp_sx

Image Dynamic drivers, whichever is the best that fits in your budget. Pretty sure you could get an IDmax for that:

http://www.imagedynamicsusa.com/pdf/iDMax10%20V3%20D4%20spec.pdf


RE Audio XXX drivers are absolutely sick but the smallest they have are 12", they take a ton of power and cost a lot more. 178dB record for a single XXX in a car though.

 

[Matt34]

Isn't this what Andrew's creation was for?

 

[mike c]

Isn't this what Andrew's creation was for?

yes, that was for the center channel ... i can't have dual 12's for the L and R wont fit vertically ...

i can do dual 15's side by side
or
quad 10's (nice looking )
OO OO
OO OO
or even hex 10's if i lose my tower
OOO OOO
OOO OOO

What's the application? I'm not sure I understand why you just want 80-100Hz. Unless you are going to have extremely high output, why mess with a three way crossover? 10" subwoofers are optimized for lower bass optimization, and pro sound drivers are optimized higher.

How do these map out?

RE Audio SX series 10"
http://www.reaudio.com/specs.html#sp_sx

Image Dynamic drivers, whichever is the best that fits in your budget. Pretty sure you could get an IDmax for that:

http://www.imagedynamicsusa.com/pdf/iDMax10%20V3%20D4%20spec.pdf

checking now ...

yes, high SPL for the frequency range ...

pro drivers just look too ugly for me

how much are the RE's?

 

[gus6464]

i like the looks Gus

for the layman : what's the difference in the H, S, T and M series?

a bit expensive though ... i also tried to plot the 15"er on winisd ... the TSP's are nuts!

I think the difference between each driver is based on what application you want to use them for. I know the M is recommend for open baffle so the others might be for sealed and ported. My wife is buying me one of their AV15-H drivers for Christmas to build a sealed sub like Warp's TC project.

 

[MidnightSensi]

yes, that was for the center channel ... i can't have dual 12's for the L and R wont fit vertically ...

i can do dual 15's side by side
or
quad 10's (nice looking )
OO OO
OO OO
or even hex 10's if i lose my tower
OOO OOO
OOO OOO



checking now ...

yes, high SPL for the frequency range ...

pro drivers just look too ugly for me

how much are the RE's?

They are about 400 in the store, close to your budget online, and if you eBay or bargain shop it well under. They take some serious abuse, YouTube or take a look at the RE Audio videos on Realm of Excursion (Click R and then select RE Audio, then you can watch time wasting videos haha!).

The SX series sounds really good and can make some painful SPL numbers. Pretty good balance.

 

[avaserfi]

From my research it seems the RE XXX series drivers use typical motor configurations. This means that they will certainly play loudly, but at the same time have significant distortion during medium/high output due to lack of motor linearity. I should note this will be tested as I know someone with an RE XXX 18" who has offered to let me test it in the future.

One possible high quality 10" driver would be this Seas. As far as I can tell it is optimized for your intended application. Also, note that it is unlikely, in most cases for a driver to perform as well as they model at medium to high output because of non-linearity. Units like the Kappa VQ, JL W7 and Audipulse Revo series have been proven linear devices and such assumptions can be made with them, but typically such an assumption is a gross leap of faith.

 

[Warpdrv]

check out ebay for this one.... search audiopulse....

Not that box size matters, but XXX's always seem to require a really large box...

got what you need right there.... If shipping is an issue, I'll be happy to buy it for ya mike, and ship it to your desired location...

Otherwise.... the JL or the Infinity as Andrew suggested, would certainly fit the bill as well...

 

[TLS Guy]

if someone wants to play just 80-100hz and has 320USD

has about:
360wpc at 8ohms x 2
or
180wpc at 4ohms x 4
or
120wpc at 8ohms x 4
available amp power

there is a size restriction (tiny)

does he get 4 80USD drivers? 2 160USD drivers? 1 320USD driver?

should have an Le of around 1.1 or less ...
should be a 10"er
should be powered by the wattage above

initial suspects:
Dayton RS 10"er HF
JL W1 10"
JL W3 10"

please recommend some more drivers ... thanks in advance

(this is per side [L&R], what you suggest here would be x2 the other set for the other side)

for the frequency range in question, the W3 doesn't seem to give anything over the W1 except for looks ...

so i didn't include it in the sims:

same cost in drivers ...
4 W1's 8ohms 360w yellow
2 W1's 4ohms 360w blue
2 Kappa 10's 360w red (low Q)

what's the difference btw of the low Q to mid Q?

Why don't you talk in the English language Mike? What is it you want to do?

Give us a detailed specification, budget and dimension restrictions if any, and then we can help you design a something specific to your application. You have posted a woolly ramble, that there is no help for.

 

[avaserfi]

Not that box size matters, but XXX's always seem to require a really large box...

Not really, the idea behind a large excursion driver is to put it into a small box and equalize it flat using a higher powered amp and the subwoofers (ideally) linear excursion.

WinISD offers the 'idea' (whatever that is) cabinet size/tuning. It is far more practical to adjust the cabinet size to a more suitable response and tailor a response from there. I almost never use or recommend the WinISD auto modeled response because almost always a better response can be achieved with some proper adjustment between cabinet design and equalizer use.

Otherwise.... the JL or the Infinity as Andrew suggested, would certainly fit the bill as well...

I didn't recommend the Infinity this time... . I pointed Mike towards a Seas driver.

 

[mike c]

the JL W7 would really be ideal, in fact, if not for some crazy sudden expense, i'd have quad 10 W7's right now ...

warpdrv, thanks for the offer - but if i wasn't in a financial bind, i'd probably have a pair of the axis 15's

it's tough to be a subwoofer freak with 7 bucks an hour

 

[MidnightSensi]

check out ebay for this one.... search audiopulse....

Not that box size matters, but XXX's always seem to require a really large box...

got what you need right there.... If shipping is an issue, I'll be happy to buy it for ya mike, and ship it to your desired location...

Otherwise.... the JL or the Infinity as Andrew suggested, would certainly fit the bill as well...

Well, for him I was recommending the SX series, which was closer to his budget and also offered a 10" driver (Smallest XXX is 12").

You are absolutely right on they do take a big box (all the RE's). I put a 15" XXX in my friends Land Rover and originally he wanted some trunk space so I went kind of small with a sealed box, then we scraped it and built a 4ft^3 ported box and it is so loud in there the front window flexes and the liftgate in the back lifts like its floating when the bass hits. It still sounds really good in there too (when he turns on the flat profile rather than the "BOOM" profile). It was heavy as **** though, almost lost a damn finger putting it in the hole and we had to brace the box for holding that driver as much as making it sound good. And basically had to Dynamat the entire suv to take care of "most" of the rattles, which was a complete pain. The end result is pretty spectacular though.

But the box size could be smaller for making 80-100Hz.

 

[mike c]

Why don't you talk in the English language Mike? What is it you want to do?

sorry, did i have my Filipino language cap on?

Give us a detailed specification, budget and dimension restrictions if any, and then we can help you design a something specific to your application. You have posted a woolly ramble, that there is no help for.

it's a bit fragmented, but i believe all the requirements are above/below with budget, size restriction, specs

if someone wants to play just 80-100hz and has 320USD

has about:
360wpc at 8ohms x 2
or
180wpc at 4ohms x 4
or
120wpc at 8ohms x 4
available amp power

there is a size restriction (tiny)

does he get 4 80USD drivers? 2 160USD drivers? 1 320USD driver?

should have an Le of around 1.1 or less ...
should be a 10"er
should be powered by the wattage above

please recommend some more drivers ... thanks in advance

 

[MidnightSensi]

Pawn some furniture and buy electronics.

I used to do that when I was younger. I barely had a place to sit at one point. Luckly my girifriend moved in and now I have more than a futon and speakers... I have dish's and forks and carpets...and stuff haha.

I understanding what your trying to build I'm just trying to understand the "why." If you can crossover to your mains at 80Hz or so, then I'd just look into selling your mains and buying some bigger ones.

*edit*

Yeah, I just re looked at your system... look at those subs next to those LCR's. You need some big dog mains. Something to help them with the 80-100Hz won't solve your problem. I've played the same game you are man, you can't system plan from the bottom or else you'll end up just moving the problem up the frequency spectrum.

 

[gus6464]

How small of a box are you wanting to do mike and how high of an SPL are you looking for?

It looks like the Lambda TD10S (green) works best on a small sealed box that is 14x14x14". Also since these drivers are not subs they should give you better midbass SQ than the other ones you are looking at.

 

[mike c]

vertically with two enclosures, id like to keep it below 25" (24" ideal)
horizontally, i can go 35"-36"

sensi,
actually the mains above 100hz are plenty loud ... i just want the 80-100hz kick ...

im not sure about SPL, but ill take what dual or quad 10's can do with 360wpc/720wpc

 

[Matt34]

Not really, the idea behind a large excursion driver is to put it into a small box and equalize it flat using a higher powered amp and the subwoofers (ideally) linear excursion.

WinISD offers the 'idea' (whatever that is) cabinet size/tuning. It is far more practical to adjust the cabinet size to a more suitable response and tailor a response from there. I almost never use or recommend the WinISD auto modeled response because almost always a better response can be achieved with some proper adjustment between cabinet design and equalizer use.



I didn't recommend the Infinity this time... . I pointed Mike towards a Seas driver.

Andrew,

What about four of the Rythmic DS12 drivers in 2cu/in sealed enclosures?


Shameless plug for the subs I'm using.

 

[TLS Guy]

sorry, did i have my Filipino language cap on?



it's a bit fragmented, but i believe all the requirements are above/below with budget, size restriction, specs

Why do you want to just play a 20 Hz frequency band? If someone wants to play 80 to 100 Hz! What does that mean? Or do you mean you want an F3 in that range. I have no idea what problem you are trying to solve.