Plasma TV is Dead - Pioneer Exits

[admin]

You heard it here first: Plasma TV is dead. As we predicted several years ago, plasma technology is on its way out. Putting one of the nails in the lengthy coffin is Pioneer Corp, who is stopping ALL production of plasma display panels. Last week we reported that they had decided to stop all 42-inch panel production, however that has now been expanded to its entire plasma line. Rather than panic, Pioneer shares immediately jumped to a four-month high following the report - up 11.2 percent. Pioneer is the world's fifth-largest plasma TV manufacturer and has constantly struggled for relevance against the larger Panasonic brand (Matsushita). Now, Pioneer will buy its panels from the competing brand and it will begin picking up LCD panels from... you guessed it - Sharp.

Discuss "Plasma TV is Dead - Pioneer Exits" here. Read the article.

 

[Davidt1]

It's rather sad, actually. It's just another case of inferior technologies winning mass market acceptance.

 

[stratman]

It's obvious why this happened. They shot themselves in the foot, by being perceived as "high-end" in a market that sees the high end shrinking only to an elite (no pun intended) few. Panasonic's efforts were smarter from a business point of view, bring a high quality product to market, make a smaller profit per unit, but clean up in volume, and they've done this to a Tee. Inch per inch Pio's TVs are the most expensive and the PQ difference isn't that great to warrant the prices they were asking. The KURO line at a better price point would have mopped the floor with Panny, but alas it tain't so sheriff. As for plasma exiting the market, well, LCD still has light years to catch up in PQ before it can best color rendition offered by plasma.

It has been rumored for the longest time that Panny was looking to leave the plasma market behind, but after billions of dollars in tech investments, that rumor might just be that, a rumor.

 

[obscbyclouds]

This is pretty dissapointing. I was planning on a nice 50" Plasma for my next display. I really am not fond of LCD's for critical viewing. Maybe they'll have some nice Plasma fire sales?

 

[stratman]

I really don't think plasmas are dead yet, I think Panny will be in it for the long haul.

 

[Wayde Robson]

OH NO YOU DIh-ENT!

Don't mess with MY plasma!

Actually I can see the truth to the story. Although I personally love plasma technology and own a plasma (by Panasonic) myself. In its price range and size it clearly won me from competing LCD panels.

Yes, I suppose I do see the current generation of plasma as superior to LCD in picture quality. Since we now know plasma burn-in is a myth there is no real drawback.

Except of course - heat and energy efficiency. But in terms of contrast and pixel 'rise-fall' speed, LCD is still playing catch up.

No, I'm not a plasma fan-boy. I really don't care which is superior, based on the information available I see plasma as the one.

 

[Pyrrho]

It's rather sad, actually. It's just another case of inferior technologies winning mass market acceptance.

Let's see, comparing plasma with LCD, LCD uses less power, generates less heat, is lighter weight, is better for viewing in lighted rooms (which is how most people view), zero chance of "burn in"...how do you come to the conclusion that an "inferior" technology won? In my case, the absolute determinant was the "burn in" issue, as I hate distorted and cropped images, and watch quite a bit of material that is not 16:9. So I often have black bars for hours at a time. And for those who say, "burn in is no longer an issue with plasma", I say, I will believe that when manufacturers give warranties against burn in. If the makers of the screen admit the fault, I will continue to believe them, because if it were really not an issue, they would want to brag about it as it would help sales. I have seen burn in on a screen before, and it isn't pretty.

Anyway, Panasonic will probably continue with plasma for a while, and you can still get a Pioneer in the stores, if you really want a plasma screen. Eventually, though, I expect plasma will die. I doubt many, if any, will be made 10 years from now. And it may die sooner; perhaps in 5 years it will all be over for plasma, but we will see.

 

[stratman]

Well from personal experience and use I can tell you that my soon to be 5 year old Panny plasma hasn't suffered any maladies, and my kid leaves it on for hours at a time with the black bands and what have you, screen looks as good as when it was installed. My newer lcd in my master is crap and the PQ doesn't come close to the Panny's.

 

[allargon]

LCD became the de facto format due to its smaller form factor. At equal sizes, plasma is cheaper than LCD. However, LCD's come as small as 9" diagonally. Plasmas generally bottom out around 32 (really 42) inches. Therefore, a lot of people bought smaller LCD's. I know a lot of people (raises hand) with 37" or smaller LCD's that they bought for less than $1k.

All the FUD about burn-in and image retention didn't help plasma. Moreover, the not at all FUD issue about power consumption is another one.

LCD is still a visually inferior technology to CRT, plasma and (yes, I'm saying it) DLP. It's going to come out on top. Flat panel sexy is in except for enthusiasts with projectors. They're in the minority. I figured plasma would outlast RP DLP. We'll see.

 

[Hi Ho]

Wow, I was not expecting this. It is very dissapointing. I wouldn't buy an LCD as my main set for any amount of money. They just can't compete. I really hope Panasonic sticks with it. Maybe they'll even make a deal with Pioneer and adopt some of the techniques that made Kuro so wonderful.

 

[Jim Robbins]

Since we now know plasma burn-in is a myth there is no real drawback.

Well, it's not really a myth. It's just difficult to burn in plasma screens these days. For example, I have a coworker who recently bought a 50" Panasonic plasma. This was less than 6 months ago, so it isn't one of the older models. His wife was playing some kids cartoon for their children, then she paused it for whatever reason and forgot about it. When he got home from a business trip the following evening, it was still on the screen. He unpaused it, and of course, there was a ghost of the previous cartoon still on the screen. He wasn't too happy. The next day he came in to work, and he was still pretty worked up. He has played some noise patterns for hours at a time to reduce the burn it. I think it has eventually since faded to the virtually undetectable level. But still, burn in can happen. So, I recommend NOT pausing bright cartoons with hard edges for over 24 hours on you plasma tvs, even if they are pretty new. *grin*

 

[autoboy]

So why does everyone want these super thin displays? I just don't understand the consumer's reasoning. I am perfectly happy with my 60" rear projection SXRD that I got for $1500 vs the $3000 - $5000 flatscreens. If I'm putting it on a 2' deep cabinet, who cares how think it is? Most of America is so fat they can't fit through a door, do they feel like their slim TV makes up for their fast food addiction?

I think plasmas are on their way out for several key reasons.
1. Cost - the primary reason LCD is more popular is because a comparable LCD is cheaper to build, and thus, cheaper to the consumer.
2. Screen Size - most displays sold today are no bigger than 42" and plasmas do not make $ at less than 50" right now. 42" sounds huge to the average consumer but the screen real estate is really no bigger than their old 36" CRT. Eventually bigger sizes will become more popular. I believe 50" is just about the perfect screen size for most homes.
3. Weight - plasmas weigh a ton compared to the LCD and this is a major concern for people who also believe in thin TVs. Thin is in.

One notable exception here is quality. It matters little in a society that still believes that stretched 4:3 content looks fine. As we all know here too well, quality is ignored until the salesman tries to sell you monster cables. You can make up for a bad off brand TV with quality cables. The packaging says so!

 

[croseiv]

Well, it's not really a myth. It's just difficult to burn in plasma screens these days. For example, I have a coworker who recently bought a 50" Panasonic plasma. This was less than 6 months ago, so it isn't one of the older models. His wife was playing some kids cartoon for their children, then she paused it for whatever reason and forgot about it. When he got home from a business trip the following evening, it was still on the screen. He unpaused it, and of course, there was a ghost of the previous cartoon still on the screen. He wasn't too happy. The next day he came in to work, and he was still pretty worked up. He has played some noise patterns for hours at a time to reduce the burn it. I think it has eventually since faded to the virtually undetectable level. But still, burn in can happen. So, I recommend NOT pausing bright cartoons with hard edges for over 24 hours on you plasma tvs, even if they are pretty new. *grin*

Seems like a bizarre and rather unusual occurance really.

 

[Pyrrho]

LCD became the de facto format due to its smaller form factor. At equal sizes, plasma is cheaper than LCD. However, LCD's come as small as 9" diagonally. Plasmas generally bottom out around 32 (really 42) inches. Therefore, a lot of people bought smaller LCD's. I know a lot of people (raises hand) with 37" or smaller LCD's that they bought for less than $1k.

All the FUD about burn-in and image retention didn't help plasma. Moreover, the not at all FUD issue about power consumption is another one.

LCD is still a visually inferior technology to CRT, plasma and (yes, I'm saying it) DLP. It's going to come out on top. Flat panel sexy is in except for enthusiasts with projectors. They're in the minority. I figured plasma would outlast RP DLP. We'll see.

I think you are oversimplifying things. If I compare my LCD with my old CRT, the blacks are better with the CRT. But the picture geometry is better with my LCD (that is, straight lines are very, very straight, even into the corners). And the tint on my LCD TV is as good as I have ever seen on any TV. Using a test disc with a pattern with color bars and the flashing boxes of color, when I look through the special blue filter, the boxes are completely invisible with the default center "zero" setting on the tint control on the TV. It just can't get any better than that.

Each type of TV has its virtues and its vices. There is no such thing as a perfect TV, or one that is the best in every way. It is all a question of which virtues and vices one cares to live with. If black level is your only concern, then LCD (both direct view and rear projection) is probably going to be judged by you to be one of the worst. If off-axis viewing is your only concern, then rear projection is probably going to be judged by you to be one of the worst. And if "burn in" matters most to you, then you will probably judge plasma to be one of the worst (followed by CRT). It really is simply a matter of what vices one can live with, and the idea that there is one best type for all people, given the various faults they all have, is ridiculous.

There are some people for whom each of the various current possibilities is the "best" choice. It depends upon budget, size of TV desired, the room in which it will be viewed (both size and ambient light matter for this), one's viewing habits, and it also depends upon which imperfections bother one the most. For a lot of people, LCD is the right choice, though certainly not for everyone.

If I had an ideal situation with unlimited funds, I would have some sort of front projector. But since I am renting, a permanent installation is out of the question, and what I would want is beyond my budget.

 

[Pyrrho]

Well, it's not really a myth. It's just difficult to burn in plasma screens these days. For example, I have a coworker who recently bought a 50" Panasonic plasma. This was less than 6 months ago, so it isn't one of the older models. His wife was playing some kids cartoon for their children, then she paused it for whatever reason and forgot about it. When he got home from a business trip the following evening, it was still on the screen. He unpaused it, and of course, there was a ghost of the previous cartoon still on the screen. He wasn't too happy. The next day he came in to work, and he was still pretty worked up. He has played some noise patterns for hours at a time to reduce the burn it. I think it has eventually since faded to the virtually undetectable level. But still, burn in can happen. So, I recommend NOT pausing bright cartoons with hard edges for over 24 hours on you plasma tvs, even if they are pretty new. *grin*

Seems like a bizarre and rather unusual occurance really.

You think it is bizarre and unusual for someone to forget something and accidentally leave it on? You must not have any contact with humans at all.

 

[Wayde Robson]

My mom comes to visit once in awhile. When it comes to a/v gear she's pretty clueless. I had to leave for work and she took care of my young son for the day. I reminded her to turn off the TV (almost brand new Panny plasma) when she's done watching.

I come home that night, a little late. Nobody is home, TV is one with a digital cable radio station playing, grey bars on the sides burned into the screen. I was freaking out.

I knew logically the damage was unlikely to be permanent. After playing back normal video for an hour all evidence of the grey bars were gone. It's very VERY difficult to burn-in a plasma these days. But there is no doubt that it probably can happen.

 

[GlocksRock]

So is LCD going to be the only tv technology in the near future? It seems as though most manufacturers are dropping rear projection sets, and now plasmas are being phased out, what else does that leave? Will Mitsubishi's laser technology come to fruition, and can it compete with LCD?

 

[westcott]

I think several of you hit the nail on the head. The majority of Joe Shoppers do not even know the technical differences between LCD and Plasma. They just want a "flat panel display" in HD. And, if the mfg's can sell a cheaper set to fill this need, that is what they are going to do.

And yes, Plasmas are superior to LCD panels in almost every category. Contrast, off axis viewing, Depth perception, and black levels.

I will give the slight nod to lcd for brightness and color accuracy, but the latter is rather mute if not in a light controlled environment.

Panasonic made the right business decisions to put them at the top of the heap. Pioneer could not survive on the few that could afford AND appreciate their high level of performance in plasma technology.

 

[Biggiesized]

This news deserves an expletive "what the ****?!"

I am absolutely stunned by this news. In fact my throat just sank into my stomach. No wonder Pioneer did a behind the doors showing of its 9G panels.

I honestly can't believe this. I first thought this was just re-iterating the news that they were dropping their 42 inch line, but the whole thing?! That's craaaazy! I'm Brian Fellow!

No wonder Tweeter is selling the Elite 50" 768p Kuro for nearly the same price as the closeout PDP-5080HD. You can pick one up for $2300 ($1200 off) while supplies last.

I want to hear official word before I drop some money on the last line of Kuros. This is totally disheartening.

 

[Jack Hammer]

I recently bought a new 52" LCD. I'm happy with the black levels and colors overall. I still have occasionaly doubts about not getting a plasma. What I least like about lcd's is the way motion is on it. To me it almost seems as if you can see each individual frame, the motion is jerky. I've never seen an lcd that didn't do this.

What drove my decision wasn't the inch slimmer the lcd is or the energy efficiency, it's that I constantly pause movies and go to bed or fall asleep and leave the menu up all night. If there ever was a person who could make a tv with a million to one chance of suffering burn in suffer it, it's me. Unequivocably and without any doubt.

Most people I talk with believe lcd to be the superior type of tv. This is what they've been led to believe either by other uninformed individuals or salespeople or just old fashioned advertising. I'm sure one day it will be a better technology, improvements are coming all the time. Honestly though, I really don't think that Joe Public can tell the slightest bit of difference between the pictures on plasma, lcd, and dlp tvs (both flat panel and projection). That's why they will buy what they're told to get, not what is best.

Jack